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Another ebayer to block (**UPDATED- CASE CLOSED See page 2)
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Raybob15239
Posts: 1,359 ✭✭✭
Sold this item 1860 CN Indian Head Cent on ebay. It closed for a whopping $4.75 and $1.50 shipping. The buyer was vega7709.
When I package my items, I print out the receipts first, then loupe each coin to make sure its the right one. I wrap it in plain white paper (or use a flip if I have them available), then tape it to the receipt. I then double check before I place it into the envelope. I KNOW (100% certain) that she received the coin that corresponded to that auction. She claimed I sent her a 1902. I did not even have a 1902, let alone one in the auctions that closed that day. There is no way that I could have switched the coin by accident. She has now filed a paypal dispute. Its only $6 but I'm not backing down on this. This woman lost it, mislaid it, whatever, but she received it.
Here is the exchange:
Dear raybob15239,
Just returned from vacation. I opened your package. It should have had the 1860 indian cent. The coin I received was a 1902. Please check and see if you sent me the right coin. Thanks
- vega7709
MY RESPONSE:
Dear vega7709,
I'm sorry, but that is not possible. I double check all packages going out and verify that the right coin is enclosed. I wrapped the 1860 CN cent in white paper and taped it to a copy of your paypal receipt. I verified that the coin enclosed was the 1860. Furthermore, I did not have a 1902 in any listing with which it could have been confused. (I don't have a 1902 for that matter.) I am certain that you were shipped the 1860. Please double check and see if you confused it with another package.
Ray
HER REPLY
Dear raybob15239,
I had received several pennies while I was gone. I opened all of the packages at one time. I set them together until this morning when I checked to be sure they were all as ordered. All of the other pennies are as I ordered except a 1901,1902,1903 and a 1905. Three of these were in a roll of wheat pennies. There is not a 1860 in the group. I do not own a 1860. I have double checked every order I have received. I will keep looking and checking to make sure I did not make a mistake. Please do the same.
- vega7709
MY RESPONSE:
Dear vega7709,
I have double checked and it is not on my desk.
I carefully packaged each order. I had a number of coins up for auction at that time. There were no duplicate dates. I wrapped each coin individually in plain whie paper, then taped it to the paypal receipt.
I checked my post office reciept and I have one package going to Oklahoma City, OK 73165, mailed from the downtown Pittsburgh post office on July 31, 2009.
Did you receive the package? If so, when you removed the paypal receipt, did you see the coin, wrapped in paper and taped to the receipt?
- raybob15239
HER REPLY:
Dear raybob15239,
I have your receipt. I had received several pennies when I returned from vacation. I opened all of the packages together and placed the coins on a shelf. I did not check them until Monday morning. I did not find the 1860. Since I did not look at the coin when I opened the package I guess I will just take the loss.
- vega7709
MY RESPONSE:
Dear vega7709,
I had wrapped the coin in plain white paper and taped it to the receipt. Check and make sure that you removed it from the receipt. Its small and you may have missed it.
- raybob15239
HER RESPONSE:
Dear raybob15239,
I have the receipt. I remember removing the coin but I did not check the date until the next day. I set it on a shelf with the other coins I received that day. I have made 58 coin purchases in the last month. I can account for every coin except yours.
- vega7709
This may be it for me with ebay. I've seen so many instances where buyers blackmail sellers and ebay lets them get away with it. The buyers don't pay the ebay fees, the sellers do. They are driving sellers away with their rule changes. Why don't they see this????
When I package my items, I print out the receipts first, then loupe each coin to make sure its the right one. I wrap it in plain white paper (or use a flip if I have them available), then tape it to the receipt. I then double check before I place it into the envelope. I KNOW (100% certain) that she received the coin that corresponded to that auction. She claimed I sent her a 1902. I did not even have a 1902, let alone one in the auctions that closed that day. There is no way that I could have switched the coin by accident. She has now filed a paypal dispute. Its only $6 but I'm not backing down on this. This woman lost it, mislaid it, whatever, but she received it.
Here is the exchange:
Dear raybob15239,
Just returned from vacation. I opened your package. It should have had the 1860 indian cent. The coin I received was a 1902. Please check and see if you sent me the right coin. Thanks
- vega7709
MY RESPONSE:
Dear vega7709,
I'm sorry, but that is not possible. I double check all packages going out and verify that the right coin is enclosed. I wrapped the 1860 CN cent in white paper and taped it to a copy of your paypal receipt. I verified that the coin enclosed was the 1860. Furthermore, I did not have a 1902 in any listing with which it could have been confused. (I don't have a 1902 for that matter.) I am certain that you were shipped the 1860. Please double check and see if you confused it with another package.
Ray
HER REPLY
Dear raybob15239,
I had received several pennies while I was gone. I opened all of the packages at one time. I set them together until this morning when I checked to be sure they were all as ordered. All of the other pennies are as I ordered except a 1901,1902,1903 and a 1905. Three of these were in a roll of wheat pennies. There is not a 1860 in the group. I do not own a 1860. I have double checked every order I have received. I will keep looking and checking to make sure I did not make a mistake. Please do the same.
- vega7709
MY RESPONSE:
Dear vega7709,
I have double checked and it is not on my desk.
I carefully packaged each order. I had a number of coins up for auction at that time. There were no duplicate dates. I wrapped each coin individually in plain whie paper, then taped it to the paypal receipt.
I checked my post office reciept and I have one package going to Oklahoma City, OK 73165, mailed from the downtown Pittsburgh post office on July 31, 2009.
Did you receive the package? If so, when you removed the paypal receipt, did you see the coin, wrapped in paper and taped to the receipt?
- raybob15239
HER REPLY:
Dear raybob15239,
I have your receipt. I had received several pennies when I returned from vacation. I opened all of the packages together and placed the coins on a shelf. I did not check them until Monday morning. I did not find the 1860. Since I did not look at the coin when I opened the package I guess I will just take the loss.
- vega7709
MY RESPONSE:
Dear vega7709,
I had wrapped the coin in plain white paper and taped it to the receipt. Check and make sure that you removed it from the receipt. Its small and you may have missed it.
- raybob15239
HER RESPONSE:
Dear raybob15239,
I have the receipt. I remember removing the coin but I did not check the date until the next day. I set it on a shelf with the other coins I received that day. I have made 58 coin purchases in the last month. I can account for every coin except yours.
- vega7709
This may be it for me with ebay. I've seen so many instances where buyers blackmail sellers and ebay lets them get away with it. The buyers don't pay the ebay fees, the sellers do. They are driving sellers away with their rule changes. Why don't they see this????
Successful B/S/T transactions: As Seller: PascoWA (June 2008); MsMorrisine (April 2009); ECHOES (July 2009) As Buyer: bfjohnson (July 2008); robkool (Dec 2010); itsnotjustme (Dec 2010) TwoSides2aCoin (Dec 2018) PrivateCoin Jan 2019
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Comments
"A car is a tool that takes you from one place to another. Everything beyond that is a payment for other people's perception of you."
-Paul
However, that will not prevent you from getting a neg. I am not sure if ebay will remove the neg if you win the paypal dispute.
<< <i>If you sent it with delivery confirmation, and provide that info to paypal, and the e-mail exchange, you will probably win the paypal dispute.
However, that will not prevent you from getting a neg. I am not sure if ebay will remove the neg if you win the paypal dispute. >>
"item not as described" will win the dispute. Seller can't win on this one. Good thing it's only $6
"A car is a tool that takes you from one place to another. Everything beyond that is a payment for other people's perception of you."
She's not asking for her money back. She can't find the coin and asked you to check to make sure you mailed it.
I did not look at the coin when I opened the package I guess I will just take the loss.
Read her email.
Ray
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>She's not asking for her money back. She can't find the coin and asked you to check to make sure you mailed it.
I did not look at the coin when I opened the package I guess I will just take the loss.
Read her email.
Ray >>
After she sent that email, she opened the paypal dispute. She is now asking for a refund. Even if I give it to her, she will still neg me. She neged another seller who gave her a full refund and accused him of fraud. I lose either way, so I might as well fight it.
<< <i>I'm not sure who's at fault here so I'm going to block both the seller and the buyer just to be on the safe side.
I know you're kidding,but for the record, I had a 79-O Morgan that sold that same day as well. I called it MS63. The buyer wrote and said it had hairlines and asked for a refund (it sold for AU money about $39). My refund policy is if the coin is not authentic or not as described, I will refund the purchase. I disagreed about the hairlines, but did not argue and gave the guy a full refund plus shipping because he felt that the quality was not as I described. In this case, she said that i sent her a 1902. I don't have a 1902. She lost it. When I checked her feedback for others and saw that she neged a guy who gave her a full refund AFTER the refund, I figured I'm getting my first neg regardless of what I do. I might as well fight it.
When it comes to packaging its better to assume the lowest common denominator in buyers when it comes to opening packages with small items.
Ray
<< <i>I might as well fight it. >>
If you're going to fight it (with a SNAD claim, there's really no way for you to win, you know), you might as well contact the buyer and tell her if she's not satisfied with the coin, she can return it for a refund. At least you'll end up with something out of the deal.
edited to add... if you accept PayPal, there's no point putting this in your listing...
Return policy: The seller will not accept returns for this item.
Seller's payment instructions: All sales are final.
Good thing it's a $6.25 deal not a $625 deal.
This is why they used to have real FB for buyers.
<< <i>
<< <i>She's not asking for her money back. She can't find the coin and asked you to check to make sure you mailed it.
I did not look at the coin when I opened the package I guess I will just take the loss.
Read her email.
Ray >>
After she sent that email, she opened the paypal dispute. She is now asking for a refund. Even if I give it to her, she will still neg me. She neged another seller who gave her a full refund and accused him of fraud. I lose either way, so I might as well fight it. >>
I always like a good fight!
Especially for a $6.00 purse!
I wonder whose gonna lose?
The name is LEE!
I see the neg she left someone - just what IS a frued???
"he never talked to me and never sent me the item that is wat i call frued"
When Paypal and skype have better quarterly earning than the parent EBAY you know there's a problem.
By the way looks like Ebay will spin off a new IPO next year ( Skype) old meg wasted 2.6 billion dollars
As is pointed out E-Bay/Paypal seem to always side with the buyer no matter what.
Buyer blocked.
Ike Specialist
Finest Toned Ike I've Ever Seen, been looking since 1986
<< <i>disgust; i am the buyer of that coin. the seller is delusional. i always store my coins glued together in a jar under the sink, in other words i dont like complicated things. As reported by the seller 'Raybob15239', i have purchased more than 58 indian cents over the last month, I always purchase hair care products on ebay but bought the coins for my brother who used to have his own account until he was institutionalized. the coin is clearly not the year i purchased because the numbers on all of my coins are different. i have checked my own feces for the last week and am absolutely certain I did not eat the coin. therefore the seller is an unethical cheater who ships wrong cions. >>
master boob
It's interesting that she only has 64 feedbacks.
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
1) The customers
2) The employees
Guess you guys are in the same boat.....
Jim O'C.
<< <i>After she sent that email, she opened the paypal dispute. She is now asking for a refund. Even if I give it to her, she will still neg me. She neged another seller who gave her a full refund and accused him of fraud. I lose either way, so I might as well fight it. >>
You shouldn't jump to that conclusion based on just ONE prior incidence. From what I can see, the only other seller she NEG'd was way back in 2004, and the circumstances were likely very different from yours. Her solitary negative feedback begins with "he never talked to me..." But as of right now, you're already WAY ahead of that guy. At least you're actively communicating with the buyer, and she seems to be expressing herself in a calm and rational manner. There's still a very good chance she'll eventually come around and realize she may have indeed misplaced the coin, or at least be willing to give you the benefit of the doubt. Don't give up hope so easily!
<< <i>Tell her to return the 1902 IHC to you and give her a refund. >>
And Adam, I know why you posted that a few times and I did laugh!
does delivery confirmation say it arrived?
when you have that many purchases, the post office is guaranteed to delay delivery for 2-3 weeks on one item
I have extra coins from purchases as well - some sellers include a freebie or two - something low enough value/slight damage that it does not warrant an auction by itself
bob
P.S. Just noticed she bought at least three 1902 Indian Heads in the past month or so. Dump them all on the shelf, I wonder how anything could have been mixed up
She simply emailed you asking you to check to see if it was possible that you sent the wrong coin. Your first response was that it was not possible that you sent the wrong coin as if somehow you are above ever making a mistake. I hate to break it to you, but things get double checked all the time and mistakes still happen, and not only with $6 coins either. It happens with fast food orders, labels on slabs, and O-rings in solid rocket boosters just to name a few.
<< <i>I would say she is at least being reasonable. Yes, she may have misplaced the coin, but it's not like she is screaming and yelling and threatning you with negative feedback. She simply requested that you double check to make sure you did send the right coin and she would do the same. Once you said you did not have it, she stated that whe would take the loss.
She simply emailed you asking you to check to see if it was possible that you sent the wrong coin. Your first response was that it was not possible that you sent the wrong coin as if somehow you are above ever making a mistake. I hate to break it to you, but things get double checked all the time and mistakes still happen, and not only with $6 coins either. It happens with fast food orders, labels on slabs, and O-rings in solid rocket boosters just to name a few. >>
Yes, she said that she would "take the loss." She then filed a paypal complaint to get her money back.
By her own admission, the following occurred:
1. She received the package from me.
2. She opened the package from me, removed a coin, and without looking at it, placed it with a number of other coins without regard to what coin came from what envelope.
3. She acknowledges that she has the receipt for the 1860 that I included in her package.
I did not say that I am above ever making a mistake. I stated that I confirmed the coin when I attached it to the receipt and that I mailed it to her. I explained further how I process my auctions when they close to ensure that everyone gets the exact coin that they purchased. Every other auction I ran from that group left positive feedback. Even the one that was returned. THis person was careless and lost the coin and now wants me to pay for it. If they find it, do you think that they will send me a check saying "Opps, I found it"?
Hello *********,
******* has closed this dispute.
Thank you for working with your buyer to resolve their concern. We hope
you found the PayPal dispute resolution process to be helpful as you worked
toward an agreement.
Any funds associated with this payment that may have been considered
"Disputed" are now available for withdrawal.
Thank you,
PayPal
I wonder if they found the coin? Now to see what they do on feedback....
<< <i>disgust; i am the buyer of that coin. the seller is delusional. i always store my coins glued together in a jar under the sink, in other words i dont like complicated things. As reported by the seller 'Raybob15239', i have purchased more than 58 indian cents over the last month, I always purchase hair care products on ebay but bought the coins for my brother who used to have his own account until he was institutionalized. the coin is clearly not the year i purchased because the numbers on all of my coins are different. i have checked my own feces for the last week and am absolutely certain I did not eat the coin. therefore the seller is an unethical cheater who ships wrong cions. no, no, no, stop the voices. >>
You definately need proffesional help.
BST Transactions: DonnyJf, MrOrganic, Justanothercoinaddict, Fivecents, Slq, Jdimmick,
Robb, Tee135, Ibzman350, Mercfan, Outhaul, Erickso1, Cugamongacoins, Indiananationals, Wayne Herndon
Negative BST Transactions:
<< <i>Update:
Hello *********,
******* has closed this dispute.
Thank you for working with your buyer to resolve their concern. We hope
you found the PayPal dispute resolution process to be helpful as you worked
toward an agreement.
Any funds associated with this payment that may have been considered
"Disputed" are now available for withdrawal.
Thank you,
PayPal
I wonder if they found the coin? Now to see what they do on feedback.... >>
I would think a friendly email inquiry as to why the case was closed is in order.
The name is LEE!
I lost to Pay Pal for an item sent to Russia. The buyer said it was "not as described". She opened the large box from the bottom after asking me for the tracking number, and then sent back the perfect packing box back to me and said the item was broken. She didn't even pay for the return shipping. Needless to say Pay Pal ruled in her favor.
What goes around, comes around.
From Seller
8/20/2009 13:12 PDT
Check every one of my auctions that closed that day. Every single auction gave positive feedback. There was no error on my end. I am meticulous when packaging coins to ensure that everyone gets the right item. The 1860 CN IHC was sent to the buyer. I did not have any 1902 cents in the auctions closing that day; I do not have any 1902 IHCs period. The buyer acknowledges that he received the package. The buyer further states that he opened all of the packages from coins that he/she bought at one time, placed them on a shelf and reviewed them later. He/she acknowledges that he opened the package and removed the coin (as he did for several packages) but did not examine the coins when he opened them. He states that he placed all of them on a shelf without regard to what coin came in what package. He states that he examined them at least one day after he opened the packages. Based upon his own statements entered above, he can not state with any certainty that the 1860 CN IHC was not in the package that he received from me. The facts which are undisputed are that he received the package that I sent him; that he opened it and removed a coin; that he did not examine the coin upon opening the package. He claims that a day later, he went thru the coins and could not find the one that I sent him. There clearly exists the possibility that he mislaid the coin or that it was moved from the shelf where he claims to have placed it.
The buyer responded:
From Buyer -
8/20/2009 13:29 PDT
I did not receive the 1860 coin. But I have better things to do than argue with you. I am going to close this dispute. What a waste of time.
From Buyer -
8/20/2009 13:31 PDT
What a waste of my time. I did not receive the 1860 coin.
PayPal Note: Buyer confirmed that buyer and seller reached an amicable resolution on this Dispute and buyer closed the Dispute.
8/20/2009 13:31 PDT
I fully anticipate getting a neg on this. Its like getting that first ding on a new car...you dread it until it happens...when it does, you're upset for a little while, but eventually, you get over it. Yeah, its a $6 item, and the easy way out would be to eat the loss, but I know that the coin was sent. I believe that he lost it and wanted me to cover the loss. I also wonder if he found it... who knows... now the countdown to my very first neg!