The other side of e-Bay

Rikey · May 13, 2009 9:17AM

Baca raton coin co just removed a listing. Gold coin that was in the last 2 hours. I guess they did not like way the bidding was going.

It is 4 pm on Wednesday, a work day, and few buy here at that time.

Puff, it is gone. I am a snipe only type of guy and had a big amount when compared to the last bid. Most of my buys are now snipe vs snipe.

Rag all you want about The Bay. I knew from their pictures that the NR they posted was crap.

doh · May 13, 2009 9:21AM

Sounds like their loss...

nicetoning42107 · May 13, 2009 9:29AM

In this age of sniping, i don't understand the logic of sellers who pull their no reserve listings like this because they get cold feet. The auction isn't over until it's over. i've had many auctions that were at an unsatisfactory price for 99.9% of the auction but what kind of, if any, snipes are involved determines the last 0.1%. Sellers who pull their listings due to what they perceive as disinterest sound like they do not trust in the market and the gutsy no reserve auction route isn't truly for them. Me, i trust in the market. Sure you won't get those last second snipes sometimes. But the times you do make up for the times you don't and in the end it's pretty even.

Frankcoins · May 13, 2009 9:41AM

Sniping is very unfair to sellers. An efficient market, where buyers have a 7 or 10 day period to place an initial bid, and see how their bid stands against
those of ther bidders, do additional research..maybe see what similar coins are selling for and raising their bids accordingly and noticing how aggressive other
bidders respond...and a seller has a chance to exercise his right to withdraw an item at any time before the final hammer falls if he feels that it's not the'best time to sell it (for any or no reason)...all those factors that show how markets work get disabled when most or all of the bids come during a train wreck in the last 5 seconds of the auction.

Rikey · May 13, 2009 9:47AM

Last night I sniped a gold coin that when from $400 to $900 in the last minute. My snipe never went off due to my price.

My main interest is auto actions. 2 guys, usually drinking, and on TV go head to head. I sit back and if the car has value, I start bidding during the last minute. That usually stops both guys, thinking I am a real strong bidder. I am not.

I almost got burned the other day. I had to have this coin and entered a stupid high figure. One guy out sniped me, thank god.

On the other hand, this co listing was 90% an ad for their company. I pass on those most them. They even had pictures of the people who work there.

Life is good. Or as my son say. Life is a series of experiences, and then they stop.

doh · May 13, 2009 9:47AM

<< Sniping is very unfair to sellers. An efficient market, where buyers have a 7 or 10 day period to place an initial bid, and see how their bid stands against those of ther bidders, do additional research..maybe see what similar coins are selling for and raising their bids accordingly and noticing how aggressive other bidders respond...and a seller has a chance to exercise his right to withdraw an item at any time before the final hammer falls if he feels that it's not the'best time to sell it )for any or no reason)...all those factors that show how markets work get disabled when most or all of the bids come during a train wreck in the last 5 seconds of the auction. >>

If sellers don't like eBay and how it works then they shouldn't use it. It's just that simple. It's annoying how many people complain about eBay. Don't like it? Fine, don't use it and shut up about it.

Rikey · May 13, 2009 9:54AM

Frank

Sniping hurts no one. I used to wait and count down the seconds. Why bid anything went a seller can withdraw the item. Sellers claim everything except being related to Jesus on e-bay. None Pcgs coins are "valued" at Pcgs prices. I could give you a long list but you know more than me about coins.

With respect to all.

Frankcoins · May 13, 2009 9:54AM

<< 

If sellers don't like eBay and how it works then they shouldn't use it. It's just that simple. It's annoying how many people complain about eBay. Don't like it? Fine, don't use it and shut up about it. >>

Isn't it nice that anytime a seller, using his real name, has a concern about getting a fair price for his goods on the venue that controls about 95% of online
auctions, so he can feed his family, he get comments like this from someone named Bartleby Fontelroy.

19Lyds · May 13, 2009 9:55AM

Snipers only snipe because they want the absolute lowest possible price (which is totally reasonable) and the only sure fire method of guaranteeing that low price is to bid at the last second and avoid any possible bidding wars! Heck, maybe they'll even get lucky and be able to rip "THE BIG ONE" on some expensive coin!

Sure, they have a price they are willing to pay in mind and that is usually what the snipe amount is BUT you can bid $100,000 on any coin you choose on eBay and if the next highest bidder is only .99 then you'll rip that sucker for $1.04! I'm thinking that if you have a price in mind that you are willing to pay for something, then bid that amount and forget this sniping stuff!

Instead, the sniper waits in the wings so that the fellow that DID bother to place a bid will have no earthly clue that he should have bid more. He/she won't even get the chance and IMO, that really sucks for sellers and it sucks for eBay!

Now, if eBay were to implement an auto-extend feature on all their auctions coupled with that stupid auto-bid feature, perhaps sellers would have a chance of getting reasonable money for their wares and maybe eBay could realize some nice profits!

Until that happens, I personally will not hold it against any seller that pulls an auction because of a lack of bidding. Its just to risky on common coins!

doh · May 13, 2009 10:00AM

<< Isn't it nice that anytime a seller, using his real name, has a concern about getting a fair price for his goods on the venue that controls about 95% of online auctions, so he can feed his family, he get comments like this from someone named Bartleby Fontelroy. >>

LMAO! I am -doh- on eBay. I've been selling for over a decade on there. I've never once ended an item early because I was worried it wouldn't sell for enough. And, Frank, buddy, no one cares about how you feed your family. Do you put that BS in your auctions? That's just like "selling grandpa's collection" and "finding coins in a wall." It's total BS. If you rely on eBay to feed your family, you, sir, are doing something wrong. That being said, I wish you luck.

Rikey · May 13, 2009 10:00AM

Here's a tip if you bid at a car auction.

Go from the first car to the last car. Most of the cars of interest go off at prime time but the first and last are bid by very few. I have done well that way. Forget about prime time.

I have never been to a coin action. I typed "rare" coin . Another word misused on the bay.

Tnx for comment doh.

Frankcoins · May 13, 2009 10:04AM

<< Frank

Sniping hurts no one. >>

Anything that artificially reduces the action in an auction sale hurts the sellers. As a real auctioneer, the most serious breech is to call SOLD when
someone else had their hand up and wanted to advance the bid. That's exactly what sniping without an auto-extend does. Ebay sends out emails and text messages
to people that wanted to know if they were outbid, but there is no time for them to bid because their bid was raised in the final 5 seconds.

Rikey · May 13, 2009 10:05AM

10ly

Not true. My "almost" disaster came about on a 400 buck coin. I sniped at 800 bucks thinking I would get it in the 400 to 500 range. Someone got the coin for 810 or so. The seller must have fallen out of his seat.

When 2 sniper go at it, not knowing what is up, all hell can happen. Now days there are 2+ usually 4 or 5 snipers. The days of your example are over.

Bochiman · May 13, 2009 10:09AM

Here ya go Frank.....this is where you need to post your posts like you have in this thread (and many others)

Rikey · May 13, 2009 10:14AM

I have never understood sellers who get upset at sniping.

Every car action I have been to has 2 types of bidders. Those who drink, have pretty girlfriends and get on TV. I sit in the back with a rep of the auction and when they seem done, I bid if I want.

You have days to go over the car. And drinking is a no no. I bought a nice 57 Chevy drunk. When it came at 2AM off a big truck, I noticed it was a 4 door.

Sold it for a slight profit to a guy who sell Real estate and needed a 4 door.

You need a busloud of faith to get by. Lou Reed

Ebay is now so full of snipers, I am going to stop.

Rikey · May 13, 2009 10:27AM

For you coin guys.

The coin of comment was a Liberty half eagle, IGC (sp) graded at ms 62. There were 7 bidders, most dealers-- by their high count. Not a common date and the seller list trends at 4000 or was it 2000. I have little faith in dealer posting what a coin is worth.. The last bid was at an AU price. My feeling is that 5+ were waiting to snipe. You get the feeling that you are not alone watching some listings. Last bid was 700+ I put in a snipe for 911.

You can look at this from many sides. So much gold to buy and so little time, don't you think?

291fifth · May 13, 2009 11:00AM

Many sellers are getting very tired of sniping. If they want to pull the listing it is their business.

Watchers are worth nothing and deserve no consideration.

tmcsr69 · May 13, 2009 11:22AM

<< Many sellers are getting very tired of sniping. If they want to pull the listing it is their business.

Watchers are worth nothing and deserve no consideration. >>

I agree with this as well as Frank. I understand snipers and many times don't make a decision to bid until the last few hours. I also understand sellers who pull a listing early and see nothing wrong with it. If I have a coin listed with a low opening bid and have no bids what so ever after 6 days, I now remove the listing. If no one is willing to bid .99 on the item and start the auction, chances are that the final price will be less than what I was looking for. Right now common date stuff is going for crazy low prices, if at all. I'm not a dealer, but I have been in retail sales. Any fool can sell products under cost and have plenty of business. Dealers are there to make a profit. Any obstacle to that is worthy trying to fix.

19Lyds · May 13, 2009 11:33AM

<< 10ly

Not true. My "almost" disaster came about on a 400 buck coin. I sniped at 800 bucks thinking I would get it in the 400 to 500 range. Someone got the coin for 810 or so. The seller must have fallen out of his seat.

When 2 sniper go at it, not knowing what is up, all hell can happen. Now days there are 2+ usually 4 or 5 snipers. The days of your example are over. >>

I wouldn't say that with any confidence friend. Occasionally two snipers end up shooting themselves through the eyepiece but its not a common occurance.
Sniping merely subdues auction action. Plain and simple.

Aberlight · May 13, 2009 11:41AM

I am tired of the bidding wars so I just snipe for now on. Bid placed in last 7 seconds.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400048043348&sspagename=STRK:MEWAX:IT&viewitem=&salenotsupported

Rikey · May 13, 2009 11:42AM

Buyers are tired of being lied to

As a sniper I participate in the auction at the end, not the beginning.

Long rant deleted.

erroid · May 13, 2009 12:05PM

You can't pull an auction that has any bids with less than 12 hours to go; it would go to the highest bidder anyway. eBay kills the seller with fees, unless you start em below $10.00 and you have to admire the seller for letting "goodies" just run the course. I've gotten KILLED by doing that: Top 50 ANACS attributed 1927D VAM-2 MS63 for 1/3 less than GS(no variety), or a raw (F) 96O Top 100 VAM-4(micro O) for less than $40.00....

19Lyds · May 13, 2009 12:31PM

<< You can't pull an auction that has any bids with less than 12 hours to go; it would go to the highest bidder anyway. >>

Sure you can. Just cancel all the bids then kill the auction. Of course, if you have 20 bidders you might ask yourself "Why am I doing this?" because at least folks are bidding.
What is generally being referred to here are auction with perhaps a single or no bidders.

mrpotatoheadd · May 13, 2009 12:38PM

<< Sure you can. Just cancel all the bids then kill the auction. >>

You can't always do that.

From here...

Your ability to end a listing early depends on the amount of time remaining in the listing and whether the listing has received any bids.

If there are 12 hours or less before the end of the listing, your ability to end the listing early depends on whether there are any bids on the item and whether the item has a reserve price.

Number of bids on the item - Can the listing be ended early?

No bids - Yes

One or more bids - Yes, but you must sell the item to the high bidder.

One or more bids, but the item’s reserve price wasn’t met - No

19Lyds · May 13, 2009 12:42PM

It does not say anything about canceling the bids which, from what I understand, you can do at anytime.

You had better cancel that high bidders bid before you end the auction early.

Loki · May 13, 2009 12:45PM

<< Buyers are tired of being lied to

As a sniper I participate in the auction at the end, not the beginning.

Long rant deleted. >>

As a seller, I do not mind snipers.

The real issue to me is the ability to be able to watch listings without bidding on them.
The ending prices were much better before the "watch this listing" feature was added.

erroid · May 13, 2009 12:59PM

The way I read it, you CAN'T cancel bids on items with "less" than 12 hrs remaining.

Rikey · May 13, 2009 1:10PM

Interesting

The fellow just relisted the coin with a starting bid of $925.

Now the wait to see if he gets an offer.

Should I watch bidding for 8 days? I don't think so. Maybe he is reading the BB. I wish him well.
To get a MS 64 on PCGS gold coin means it is a nice coin. He calls it a near Gem which is honest. He does not call it a rare coin and he has a 7 day return. Hell this might be one hellva nice dealer.

Congratulations to Rare Gallery of Boca Raton.

19Lyds · May 13, 2009 3:46PM

<< The way I read it, you CAN'T cancel bids on items with "less" than 12 hrs remaining. >>

Wanna try an experiment?

I'll run a three day auction, you bid on it, I'll cancel it with 6 hours to go.

You game?

BBN · May 13, 2009 4:14PM

I snipe. I do it to avoid a bidding war and running up an auction very high. When I hunt for an item on ebay I'm on there trying to get an item I want for the best price. Not to make sure the seller gets what he feels is a fair profit.

rec78 · May 13, 2009 4:54PM

I do not see how sniping hurts sellers. Without snipers the items would sell for even less. If the seller is that afraid of not getting what he wants for it then he should put on a reserve. I love snipers-please feel free to snipe anything i have up for sale -anytime.

darktone · May 13, 2009 8:54PM

I might bid a small amount at first but I alway's snipe too. I hate it when it's done on my auctions- I too wish for a free-for-all bidding war but when buying it's the smart move. Set your price and bid at the last moment and you don't have to worry about getting caught up in bidding more than you were prepared to do.

dantheman984 · May 13, 2009 9:07PM

<< 

<< Now, if eBay were to implement an auto-extend feature on all their auctions coupled with that stupid auto-bid feature, perhaps sellers would have a chance of getting reasonable money for their wares and maybe eBay could realize some nice profits! >>

I am on an auction site when sniping happens within 2 minutes or less, the auction automatically gets extended 2 minutes and it does work. The price does go higher.

Boom · May 13, 2009 9:13PM

<< Wanna try an experiment?

I'll run a three day auction, you bid on it, I'll cancel it with 6 hours to go.

You game? >>

This is News to me, Lee.

I don't pull listings anyway but I too though that once inside 12 hours
sellers could not end their listings. With sniping it's quite common to see
huge bids realized in the last few seconds.

I remember one incident in which I DID have an error in my listing.
There were many bids and though I do not recall all the particulars, I
contacted eBay (obviously this was years ago) and they advised me
that since I couldn't pull the item my only recourse was to cancel all
the bids! What a nightmare - all due to a typo.

I took ebay's advice and began the task of cancelling all bids only to
wind up with people bidding again and the item went for DIRT!

I was quite fortunate though because I explained the situation to the
eventual winner who understood and actually let me off the hook.

I was so impressed with the bidder that I wound up sending him
several nice items totally free of charge. You don't find such people
very often. I couldn't thank him enough because I was auctioning the
item for a friend as a favor.

Cancelling bids in the waning moments only to have new bids placed
can prove to be a very stress filled ordeal.

erroid · May 13, 2009 10:45PM

Lee, it wouldn't be fair, I already know the outcome and was trying to be nice with "my take". When I 1st started selling(6+ yrs), it was OK to pull pieces with poor prices. eBay up and changed it to the "12 hour rule" 4 or 5 years back, to stop the abuse and have "real" auctions. I had an R6 Peace $(don't even remember the VAM), that I tried to PULL with 2 minutes to go; it(eBay) wouldn't let me cancel the bids, and it sold for $6.00. I called and complained; that's when I found out about the rule change. Boom, they also made it easier to cancel bids; you can now do em ALL, as long as there's more than 12 hrs left.

KiltedOne · May 13, 2009 11:37PM

I'll admit it ... 95% of all my ebay auction wins are by snipe. If see an item I am interested in, I will enter the highest amount I am willing to pay (regardless of how low or high the current bid is) and let it go at about the 10 second mark. If I win then great, the seller makes money and pays his bills, feeds his family, etc, as I pay immediately. So who looses?

The seller gets paid and I get the item I wanted at the a price I was willing to pay. If I get out-sniped, or the previous bidder had a higher maximum bid, then so be it. The seller still wins as the item has sold (and I do get out sniped / out bid a lot). To me the problem is the sore loser who put in a low bid hoping that no one else would notice the item and was hoping for a bargain - then doesn't win.

Also, I do sell on ebay, and love snipers; I usually see lots of watchers, and no bidders until the last hour of the auction. Then WHAM, I'll get several bids in the last few min and sell the item no problem.

Remember, this is ebay! Know that ebay is an entity unto itself and should not be looked at as a traditional auction. Coins make up only a very small percentage of items sold on ebay. Guess the next thing people will want is for the buyers to begin to pay a 10% - 20% buyers premium to ebay so they can sleep at night knowing the shaft is continuing it's inward progress.

The other side of e-Bay

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