ethics and the new 09 cents

Whitby · February 18, 2009 10:59AM

Recently, a collecting friend of mine sold a brick of the new 09 cents for 1 grand.

I thought to myself, OMFG!!!!

Then wondered about this:

IF I had 2 bricks, thats 50 bucks and someone said hey here is coin x that you have always wanted, and coin x was about 200 bucks, would I take that trade?

My answer: OH HELL YES.

However, I have noted that if I sold them for this ammount, I would be a dirty rotten SOB.

So, Am I dirty rotten SOB for making the trade or not? IMO no. However, I am interested in your opinion. Caveat: The parties trading know that we are discussing 50 bucks in cents.

commoncents123 · February 18, 2009 11:09AM

There is nothing wrong with selling them for $100,000 as long as someone knows what they're buying

zeebob · February 18, 2009 11:10AM

If you can sell $50 in cents for $1000, go for it. Both parties understand face value. The buyer is likely gambling on a high end coin being in the batch that can be graded then auctioned for a registry set at Stacks for $10,000.

So if the buyer wants to gamble $1000, that's their call. Slots? Black Jack? Coins? All legal and all ethical as long as everyone understands the rules.

notwilight · February 18, 2009 11:12AM

There is nothing unethical about selling at a high price like that. I assume the buyer knew what he was doing. I would pay someone a nice premium to overnight me a brick.

If I thought the buyer was just clueless like most posters here think then I probably wouldn't do it but it is not an ethical choice. --Jerry

ArizonaJack · February 18, 2009 11:12AM

Whatever the market will bear I guess is the rule, but I have never played the modern hype game. Some folks know it well, I do not. I personally would not be comfortable doing it.
I guess it would depend if your mortgage payment depended on it, mine does not

MikeInFL · February 18, 2009 11:22AM

<< However, I have noted that if I sold them for this ammount, I would be a dirty rotten SOB.

So, Am I dirty rotten SOB for making the trade or not? >>

Yes, by that logic you are.

And I agree.

Profits should be reasonable -- and taking the other party for as much as you can (or an excessive amount as in the example) is plain wrong, IMO.

However, I respect the rights of "what the market will bear" capitalists everywhere -- I just don't agree with them or subscribe to the same credo.

Respectfully...Mike

doh · February 18, 2009 11:24AM

Huh? Why is the person a SOB for selling the coins for moon money? Hey, if you can find someone willing to pay the premium, go nuts. It's their problem, not yours.

notwilight · February 18, 2009 12:21PM

So any dirty SOB want to overnight me a brick?

Whitby · February 19, 2009 12:20AM

<< So any dirty SOB want to overnight me a brick? >>

Sure, if I had one, FOR A SWAP OF COURSE.

tahoe98 · February 19, 2009 2:07AM

<< Huh? Why is the person a SOB for selling the coins for moon money? Hey, if you can find someone willing to pay the premium, go nuts. It's their problem, not yours. >>

............what about sharing the wealth?

19Lyds · February 19, 2009 2:17AM

<< So any dirty SOB want to overnight me a brick? >>

Will this do??

OKbustchaser · February 19, 2009 2:17AM

<< 

<< However, I have noted that if I sold them for this ammount, I would be a dirty rotten SOB.

So, Am I dirty rotten SOB for making the trade or not? >>

Yes, by that logic you are.

And I agree.

Profits should be reasonable -- and taking the other party for as much as you can (or an excessive amount as in the example) is plain wrong, IMO.

However, I respect the rights of "what the market will bear" capitalists everywhere -- I just don't agree with them or subscribe to the same credo.

Respectfully...Mike >>

So someone is a "dirty rotten SOB" for selling coins for 20X face to a knowledgable buyer??? Man, I'll take all the bust halves you've got at that level--they don't even have to be brand new!!!

Whitby · February 19, 2009 2:19AM

<< 

<< 

<< However, I have noted that if I sold them for this ammount, I would be a dirty rotten SOB.

So, Am I dirty rotten SOB for making the trade or not? >>

Yes, by that logic you are.

And I agree.

Profits should be reasonable -- and taking the other party for as much as you can (or an excessive amount as in the example) is plain wrong, IMO.

However, I respect the rights of "what the market will bear" capitalists everywhere -- I just don't agree with them or subscribe to the same credo.

Respectfully...Mike >>

So someone is a "dirty rotten SOB" for selling coins for 20X face to a knowledgable buyer??? Man, I'll take all the bust halves you've got at that level--they don't even have to be brand new!!! >>

ROTFLMAO!!!!

2manycoins2fewfunds · February 19, 2009 2:22AM

Ebay serves a valuable serivice.............it seperates stupid people from their money before they can do any real harm.

19Lyds · February 19, 2009 2:29AM

And in response to the "ethical" part of the OP, if someone is handing out money, why not take your share?

I don't necessarily agree with the prices that some folks are paying for these rolls, because eventually they will lose money unless they can dump their investment before the iron gets cold, but if thats what folks want to do, who am I to try and stop them?

Now that bad part is that some of the folks are "uneducated" in these "wave" matters and some of them are going to get burned! But nothing you do or say will change their opinions as they truely believe that these will be worth a fortune in the future.

guitarwes · February 19, 2009 2:53AM

would you have paid 20X-40X face for a brick of 1909 Lincolns when they came out? You think they're thinking ahead maybe? couldn't be..........

19Lyds · February 19, 2009 3:36AM

Let's see, 27,995,000 1909's produced and 294,000,000 Log Cabins produced so far.

Yep! They're thinking ahead,

just not too clearly.

Personally, I just don't see a big long term investment in these but again do not hold it against those folks willing to shell out $20 to $250 for a roll of these. I only wish I had a couple of Denver Bricks to pass out.

BobSav · February 19, 2009 4:01AM

<< Ebay serves a valuable serivice.............it seperates stupid people from their money before they can do any real harm. >>

Bob

Type2 · February 19, 2009 4:07AM

$$$$$

Whitby · February 19, 2009 4:16AM

<< would you have paid 20X-40X face for a brick of 1909 Lincolns when they came out? You think they're thinking ahead maybe? couldn't be..........

>>

If nears and buts were beers and nuts we would all be fat drunk happy people....Oh well.

Coinhog · February 19, 2009 4:19AM

Whether you trade it for a much higher priced coin or sell it for big dollars. The end result is the same.

You flipped the brick and as such are a FLIPPER!!!! A hippocrite Flipper at that. A HippoFlipperCritter. Welcome to the dark side of capitalism.

slipgate · February 19, 2009 4:21AM

It's a classic Ponzi scheme. The people just need to know when to get out before they pyramid collapses. Or at least be on or near the top so they don't get (as) crushed.

Hyperion · February 19, 2009 4:22AM

"depends"

barbershopper · February 19, 2009 4:24AM

Make the trade and maybe you'll both be happy with it.
JMHO
JT

Whitby · February 19, 2009 4:25AM

<< Whether you trade it for a much higher priced coin or sell it for big dollars. The end result is the same.

You flipped the brick and as such are a FLIPPER!!!! A hippocrite Flipper at that. A HippoFlipper.. Welcome to the dark side of capitalism. >>

hmmm a trade is a flip?

I did not sell. BUT, in the effort to learn, let me get this straight

IF I trade, I flipped?

My understanding was, of course, that a flipper would be an individual who gets the coin, gets it graded by the TPG, assuming they get a 70, they then sell the thing for moon money. THEN after the submission, send back the rejects, AFTER depriving others of the chance to even buy the set........because to get the 70, they had to buy many many copies of the coin or set.

SO, a trade, makes me a flipper? Recalling again, I did not get the 70, I did not sell the coins and of course, I got a brick (which I did not others have) and knew billions of the coin would be made.

This makes me a flipper, right?

Whitby · February 19, 2009 4:26AM

<< Make the trade and maybe you'll both be happy with it.
JMHO
JT >>

Hence why I would trade and not sell. A trade assumes both paties have agreed to terms as opposed to an arbitrary ammount.

Of course, I am being informed, this is a flip?

Longacre · February 19, 2009 4:31AM

Cheer up. Obama will increase the tax on the gain, so your friend will only end up with about $1.98.

Coinhog · February 19, 2009 4:35AM

<< 

<< Whether you trade it for a much higher priced coin or sell it for big dollars. The end result is the same.

You flipped the brick and as such are a FLIPPER!!!! A hippocrite Flipper at that. A HippoFlipper.. Welcome to the dark side of capitalism. >>

hmmm a trade is a flip?

I did not sell. BUT, in the effort to learn, let me get this straight

IF I trade, I flipped?

My understanding was, of course, that a flipper would be an individual who gets the coin, gets it graded by the TPG, assuming they get a 70, they then sell the thing for moon money. THEN after the submission, send back the rejects, AFTER depriving others of the chance to even buy the set........because to get the 70, they had to buy many many copies of the coin or set.

The definition of a Flipper has NOTHING to do with 3rd party grading or 70's or mint returns. I have flipped virtually all of my mint purchases in original packaging. A Flipper is someone who bought a new mint product and resold it at what some people feel is an exhorbitant price. The payment for said flipped product can be in anything of value.

A

SO, a trade, makes me a flipper? Recalling again, I did not get the 70, I did not sell the coins and of course, I got a brick (which I did not others have) and knew billions of the coin would be made.

This makes me a flipper, right? >>

Yep, that's right

The definition of a Flipper has NOTHING to do with 3rd party grading or 70's or mint returns. I have flipped virtually all of my mint purchases in original packaging. A Flipper is someone who bought a new mint product and resold it at what some people feel is an exhorbitant price. The payment for said flipped product can be in anything of value.

Buy at issue , move it out for something of much greater value. It means you "Flipped" the original item for something else. Heck, you can even "Flip" at a loss. The key is you aquired initially with no intent of keeping it. You bought it to Flip. Now if you want to come up with another word for the people who buy , review and return. go ahead, but don't call them Flippers.

Call them "Screeners".

Whitby · February 19, 2009 4:40AM

<< 

<< 

<< Whether you trade it for a much higher priced coin or sell it for big dollars. The end result is the same.

You flipped the brick and as such are a FLIPPER!!!! A hippocrite Flipper at that. A HippoFlipper.. Welcome to the dark side of capitalism. >>

hmmm a trade is a flip?

I did not sell. BUT, in the effort to learn, let me get this straight

IF I trade, I flipped?

My understanding was, of course, that a flipper would be an individual who gets the coin, gets it graded by the TPG, assuming they get a 70, they then sell the thing for moon money. THEN after the submission, send back the rejects, AFTER depriving others of the chance to even buy the set........because to get the 70, they had to buy many many copies of the coin or set.

The definition of a Flipper has NOTHING to do with 3rd party grading or 70's or mint returns. I have flipped virtually all of my mint purchases in original packaging. A Flipper is someone who bought a new mint product and resold it at what some people feel is an exhorbitant price. The payment for said flipped product can be in anything of value.

A

SO, a trade, makes me a flipper? Recalling again, I did not get the 70, I did not sell the coins and of course, I got a brick (which I did not others have) and knew billions of the coin would be made.

This makes me a flipper, right? >>

Yep, that's right

The definition of a Flipper has NOTHING to do with 3rd party grading or 70's or mint returns. I have flipped virtually all of my mint purchases in original packaging. A Flipper is someone who bought a new mint product and resold it at what some people feel is an exhorbitant price. The payment for said flipped product can be in anything of value.

Buy at issue , move it out for something of much greater value. It means you "Flipped" the original item for something else. Heck, you can even "Flip" at a loss. The key is you aquired initially with no intent of keeping it. You bought it to Flip. Now if you want to come up with another word for the people who buy , review and return. go ahead, but don't call them Flippers.

Call them "Screeners". >>

your not saying this to clear your conscience are you?

I mean I realize we are almost the same age and everything but are you SURE, I mean REALLY SURE that most folks call this person a flipper?

IMO, no, but, I can still learn.

sanitarium1inmate · February 19, 2009 5:24AM

If I had these I would flip them and there is no name you can call me to stop me. It's my money and if I lose on the deal then it's my problem and not yours. Get off the high horse and mind your own business if you don't like the "flipping" thing.

Coinhog · February 19, 2009 5:25AM

Your view of as flipper is way too narrow.

If you buy initially with no long term intention of keeping it. You are buying to Flip. It has nothing to do with screening or grading. Some
'Flippers" may add the extra tasks of grading or screening, but.......they are not required for "Flipping".

If you bought a brick of new pennies with no intention of keeping them long term, then your intention is to "Flip" them for something else. 'Flip" them for cash or something else of value (i.e trade), either way you 'Flipped" your original item.

jessewvu · February 19, 2009 5:27AM

You would be a dirty rotten SOB if you did that and didn't have a giveaway!

sanitarium1inmate · February 19, 2009 5:32AM

<< You would be a dirty rotten SOB if you did that and didn't have a giveaway!

>>

If I made a mint on these then I would have a great giveaway. lol

Whitby · February 19, 2009 6:18AM

<< Your view of as flipper is way too narrow.

If you buy initially with no long term intention of keeping it. You are buying to Flip. It has nothing to do with screening or grading. Some
'Flippers" may add the extra tasks of grading or screening, but.......they are not required for "Flipping".

If you bought a brick of new pennies with no intention of keeping them long term, then your intention is to "Flip" them for something else. 'Flip" them for cash or something else of value (i.e trade), either way you 'Flipped" your original item. >>

Hmmmmmm.

I suppose my narrow definition will have to do.

I still kept a few. I mean, I traded the cents for the following:

A coin from a member here
a few beers at a bar
a WV quarter with cud
a favor to a bud
and oh yeah, I gave a few (less than 10 coins away)
AND OH YES, got 5 bucks from lady who offered me twenty+ for 3 of the coins

So, wow, that makes me a big bad flipper? Gee, I guess I could have been a mega flipper and gotten a grand right. OH BUT WAIT, that did not fit in my narrow view right?

OKbustchaser · February 19, 2009 6:24AM

<< 

<< Your view of as flipper is way too narrow.

If you buy initially with no long term intention of keeping it. You are buying to Flip. It has nothing to do with screening or grading. Some
'Flippers" may add the extra tasks of grading or screening, but.......they are not required for "Flipping".

If you bought a brick of new pennies with no intention of keeping them long term, then your intention is to "Flip" them for something else. 'Flip" them for cash or something else of value (i.e trade), either way you 'Flipped" your original item. >>

Hmmmmmm.

I suppose my narrow definition will have to do.

I still kept a few. I mean, I traded the cents for the following:

A coin from a member here
a few beers at a bar
a WV quarter with cud
a favor to a bud
and oh yeah, I gave a few (less than 10 coins away)
AND OH YES, got 5 bucks from lady who offered me twenty+ for 3 of the coins

So, wow, that makes me a big bad flipper? Gee, I guess I could have been a mega flipper and gotten a grand right. OH BUT WAIT, that did not fit in my narrow view right? >>

Yeah, you flipped them...so what? There is nothing intrinsically wrong with either the action or the name.

Whitby · February 19, 2009 6:27AM

<< 

<< 

<< Your view of as flipper is way too narrow.

If you buy initially with no long term intention of keeping it. You are buying to Flip. It has nothing to do with screening or grading. Some
'Flippers" may add the extra tasks of grading or screening, but.......they are not required for "Flipping".

If you bought a brick of new pennies with no intention of keeping them long term, then your intention is to "Flip" them for something else. 'Flip" them for cash or something else of value (i.e trade), either way you 'Flipped" your original item. >>

Hmmmmmm.

I suppose my narrow definition will have to do.

I still kept a few. I mean, I traded the cents for the following:

A coin from a member here
a few beers at a bar
a WV quarter with cud
a favor to a bud
and oh yeah, I gave a few (less than 10 coins away)
AND OH YES, got 5 bucks from lady who offered me twenty+ for 3 of the coins

So, wow, that makes me a big bad flipper? Gee, I guess I could have been a mega flipper and gotten a grand right. OH BUT WAIT, that did not fit in my narrow view right? >>

Yeah, you flipped them...so what? There is nothing intrinsically wrong with either the action or the name. >>

So I guess the terms "ethical flipper" versus "MEGA SHAFTER Flipper" are the same?

Coinhog · February 19, 2009 6:32AM

<< 
your not saying this to clear your conscience are you?

I mean I realize we are almost the same age and everything but are you SURE, I mean REALLY SURE that most folks call this person a flipper?

IMO, no, but, I can still learn. >>

Clear my conscience of what? Purchasing an item from a supplier for resale at market prices? Buying product from the mint while it is available and reselling it "at market prices" after it is no longer available has no negative effects on my conscience. There were always willing buyers "competing" for the product and..........they set the price in an open auction format.

I don't know why you seem to have a problem with this? Market driven and nobody holds a gun to anyone's head, and.......they line up as bidders on ebay.

cladking · February 19, 2009 6:40AM

It's really only 40c each and these will still be worth a few cents each by
the end of the year.

If the buyer is rushing to be the first on the market selling then he just
might make a profit. Otherwise one has to question his thinking.

Coinhog · February 19, 2009 6:40AM

<< 

<< 

<< 

<< Your view of as flipper is way too narrow.

If you buy initially with no long term intention of keeping it. You are buying to Flip. It has nothing to do with screening or grading. Some
'Flippers" may add the extra tasks of grading or screening, but.......they are not required for "Flipping".

If you bought a brick of new pennies with no intention of keeping them long term, then your intention is to "Flip" them for something else. 'Flip" them for cash or something else of value (i.e trade), either way you 'Flipped" your original item. >>

Hmmmmmm.

I suppose my narrow definition will have to do.

I still kept a few. I mean, I traded the cents for the following:

A coin from a member here
a few beers at a bar
a WV quarter with cud
a favor to a bud
and oh yeah, I gave a few (less than 10 coins away)
AND OH YES, got 5 bucks from lady who offered me twenty+ for 3 of the coins

So, wow, that makes me a big bad flipper? Gee, I guess I could have been a mega flipper and gotten a grand right. OH BUT WAIT, that did not fit in my narrow view right? >>

Yeah, you flipped them...so what? There is nothing intrinsically wrong with either the action or the name. >>

So I guess the terms "ethical flipper" versus "MEGA SHAFTER Flipper" are the same? >>

Anyone has a right to do what they want with an item they own. If you want to give them away, that's your perogative. If I want to sell them for a profit, thats mine. Neither scenarios are unethical.

Consider this though......

You charged a lady $5 bucks for 3 cents ???????? Sounds like a Mega, Mega, Mega Shaft to me.

In fact, at the rate of return, you should garner a "YOU SUCK" award.

Good for you , you Mr. Mega Shafter Flipper.

Since you have already crossed over the line into Mega Shaft territory, you should have gone for the whole $20. LOL!!!

OKbustchaser · February 19, 2009 6:43AM

<< 

So I guess the terms "ethical flipper" versus "MEGA SHAFTER Flipper" are the same? >>

I am not familiar with either adjective. Flipping is flipping--it has no moral (or immoral) qualities at all. Nor is the amount of profit moral or immoral. As long as the flipper treats the flippee fairly, sells him EXACTLY what he claims--regardless of profit--then there is nothing ethical or shafting about the exchange.

Whitby · February 19, 2009 6:51AM

<< 

<< 

<< 

<< 

<< Your view of as flipper is way too narrow.

If you buy initially with no long term intention of keeping it. You are buying to Flip. It has nothing to do with screening or grading. Some
'Flippers" may add the extra tasks of grading or screening, but.......they are not required for "Flipping".

If you bought a brick of new pennies with no intention of keeping them long term, then your intention is to "Flip" them for something else. 'Flip" them for cash or something else of value (i.e trade), either way you 'Flipped" your original item. >>

Hmmmmmm.

I suppose my narrow definition will have to do.

I still kept a few. I mean, I traded the cents for the following:

A coin from a member here
a few beers at a bar
a WV quarter with cud
a favor to a bud
and oh yeah, I gave a few (less than 10 coins away)
AND OH YES, got 5 bucks from lady who offered me twenty+ for 3 of the coins

So, wow, that makes me a big bad flipper? Gee, I guess I could have been a mega flipper and gotten a grand right. OH BUT WAIT, that did not fit in my narrow view right? >>

Yeah, you flipped them...so what? There is nothing intrinsically wrong with either the action or the name. >>

So I guess the terms "ethical flipper" versus "MEGA SHAFTER Flipper" are the same? >>

Anyone has a right to do what they want with an item they own. If you want to give them away, that's your perogative. If I want to sell them for a profit, thats mine. Neither scenarios are unethical.

Consider this though......

You charged a lady $5 bucks for 3 cents ???????? Sounds like a Mega, Mega, Mega Shaft to me.

In fact, at the rate of return, you should garner a "YOU SUCK" award.

Good for you , you Mr. Mega Shafter Flipper.

Since you have already crossed over the line into Mega Shaft territory, you should have gone for the whole $20. LOL!!! >>

Oh yeah, I mean wow, I might have gotten enough to pay for my metro fare that week...EGAD.

I just cant see a grand for a brick. To me thats the super mega get out the lube shafter award there.

BUT, I have learned, its NOT my place to judge AS LONG AS all parties concerned understand.

The whole buy a billion sets to get the 70 and send back the remnants thing, no, not so much. IMO, thats not ethical, IMO.

mrpotatoheadd · February 19, 2009 6:59AM

<< Flipping is flipping--it has no moral (or immoral) qualities at all. Nor is the amount of profit moral or immoral. As long as the flipper treats the flippee fairly, sells him EXACTLY what he claims--regardless of profit--then there is nothing ethical or shafting about the exchange. >>

Some people just aren't comfortable with the idea that other people often make choices they wouldn't make themselves.

micmt · February 19, 2009 7:01AM

Sell em if ya got em!

Coinhog · February 19, 2009 7:05AM

[

renman95 · February 19, 2009 7:11AM

If the government sold a brick for a grand....hmmmm....3+ billion cents.....ahhh! we could get trillions a pay off that porkulus.

Artist · February 19, 2009 7:18AM

<< Ebay serves a valuable serivice.............it seperates stupid people from their money before they can do any real harm. >>

That depends on what the guy does with the brick.

ethics and the new 09 cents

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