Is this one of those Chinese fakes?

StubbyMcNumbthumbs · December 13, 2008 8:06PM

ebay link

I'm not an expert on Morgans, but something just doesn't look right about this to me. With the proliferaton of fakes out there, I would never consider buying this, but just wanted some opinions, so maybe I can learn a bit of what to look for.

Thanks for any help!

Cheers

golfer72 · December 13, 2008 8:48PM

It looks real. Nothing to say otherwise from the pictures. Lousy coin though, only worth melt.

StubbyMcNumbthumbs · December 13, 2008 8:49PM

Pics from auction listing...

He has a couple of others that look about the same. Dunno, but looks a little dodgy to me.

The "LAR" in DOLLAR looks too big. Some other lettering doesn't look quite right.

I just can't pinpoint it. Am I being too paranoid??

I realize it's not a great coin (if it's real), but it doesn't look right.

golfer72 · December 13, 2008 8:57PM

I cant see anyone bothering to fake a common date like that. Doesnt seem worth the effort.

stevek · December 13, 2008 9:52PM

Seller is from Australia if that means anything.

stevek · December 13, 2008 9:56PM

<< I cant see anyone bothering to fake a common date like that. Doesnt seem worth the effort. >>

Point understood, but if you can sell a lot of them, then that money adds up. I think almost every collectible coin out there is prone to being faked, certainly including this one.

kaz · December 13, 2008 10:38PM

There was an article in CW a while back from one of the graders at ICG that they had encountered some high-quality common Morgan fakes that were only outed because the luster was wrong (this was before ICG was sold and lost their most experienced people). So, they are out there, and there will be more of them, as the Chinese continue to apply better technology to their forgery efforts. This one looks real to me, but the lighting is really weird.

rld14 · December 13, 2008 10:44PM

<< I cant see anyone bothering to fake a common date like that. Doesnt seem worth the effort. >>

It wouldn't make sense, but I have seen plenty of common date counterfeit Morgans on the Bay, such as an 1881-S, in what appeared to be XF. What's an XF 81-S worth, $15?

RBinTex · December 13, 2008 11:55PM

On feedback alone I'd say if so not intentional.

cullenbryant · December 13, 2008 11:57PM

you're right, that "LAR" is definetly bigger than the rest of the word. i'm not sure if that means
it's a fake or a standard anomoly for that year/mint. maybe someone who does know will see this.

Raybob15239 · December 14, 2008 12:30AM

My vote is real. I think that they imaged the coin using a scaner rather than a camera. That makes for lousy images with distorted luster. (Been there. Done that. Never again.)

StubbyMcNumbthumbs · December 14, 2008 7:03AM

<< Seller is from Australia if that means anything. >>

I'm not sure what that's supposed to mean, but...

I'm in Australia, too. There are a lot of Americans living here in Australia and there is a large collector base here. But I'm afraid that a lot of the older "American" coins being sold here did not originate in America. I'm sure it's happening more and more there, too. You can't always blame the seller, as far as integrity and such, because they just don't have the lifetime of experience looking at old U.S. coins like American dealers/collectors would.

As far as Australian and British coins go, however, the collectors here, I think, are as or more demanding and particular about the quality of their coins than the typical American collector/dealer. I was a bit put off by that at first, but then found it quite refreshing.

Since reading the article about the Chinese counterfeitors (sp?), I have started looking at ALL coins, not just the typically faked key dates, a little closer than I used to.

Stub

stevek · December 14, 2008 8:11AM

<< 

<< Seller is from Australia if that means anything. >>

I'm not sure what that's supposed to mean, but...

I'm in Australia, too. There are a lot of Americans living here in Australia and there is a large collector base here. But I'm afraid that a lot of the older "American" coins being sold here did not originate in America. I'm sure it's happening more and more there, too. You can't always blame the seller, as far as integrity and such, because they just don't have the lifetime of experience looking at old U.S. coins like American dealers/collectors would.

As far as Australian and British coins go, however, the collectors here, I think, are as or more demanding and particular about the quality of their coins than the typical American collector/dealer. I was a bit put off by that at first, but then found it quite refreshing.

Since reading the article about the Chinese counterfeitors (sp?), I have started looking at ALL coins, not just the typically faked key dates, a little closer than I used to.

Stub >>

Only meant it in the sense that since Australia is "closer" to Asia, they might have more "connections" with some there for these counterfeits - I honestly don't know. And I don't know how the Australian police monitor counterfeit coins.

I would, in general, trust a US coin dealer over any other country's coin dealer to sell genuine US coins - just my viewpoint.

TwoSides2aCoin · December 14, 2008 8:28AM

compare it to this one

adamlaneus · December 14, 2008 8:31AM

I say it is a good fake. About half of the dentils and the rim bother me and there is the matter of the weak mushy region on the left reverse of the coin.

My concerns aside, this does not look like "one of those Chinese fakes". "Those" coins look far worse than this.

FullStrike · December 14, 2008 3:08PM

If it ain't in a PCGS holder, just assume it's a Chinese Fake.

Elsewise, it certainly would be in a PCGS slab.

julie43 · December 14, 2008 4:27PM

<< Seller is from Australia if that means anything. >>

I have won many auctions from Australia everything from coins to Opals and never had a problem I have been quite happy with every purchase