Full Step or Not??? What did PCGS say?
Windycity
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President, Racine Numismatic Society 2013-2014; Variety Resource Dimes; See 6/8/12 CDN for my article on Winged Liberty Dimes; Ebay
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and if they were worth more than $140, I would try a couple more times if not
GrandAm
<< <i>100% NOT Full Step. The 5th step isn't there.
GrandAm
<< <i>
<< <i>100% NOT Full Step. The 5th step isn't there.
GrandAm
I think that is the 6th step that is almost not there?
not certain what you guys are thinking that the fifth step isn't there. the sixth step is missing(the partial line seen between pillars 1-2 and again at 3-4), but the fifth step is fully struck although the riser from step six up to step five might be missing. the only thing needed for the designation is a clear and unbridged step line.
bob
consider the OP's picture and this pasted statement from the Full Step Nickel Club:
Incused Lines. The easiest way to determine full steps is to count the lines cut into the surface of the step area. To make this absolutely clear, imagine a number of furrows plowed in a farmer's field. A five-step Jefferson nickel shows four furrows in the 'field.' In numismatic terms, the furrows are called incuse lines. Horizontally, there should be four complete incuse lines between the boxes located on the left and right sides of the steps. Even the smallest break in any one of these horizontal lines nullifies the line as a full step line. A six-stepped coin should contain five complete incuse lines.
remember, PCGS only requires five full steps for the FS designation to be awarded. the OP's coin doesn't lack five full steps, although there may indeed be bridges which precluded the designation. please, please, please stop giving out information here if you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground, it isn't helpful to those who don't know but think you are an authority............................
I agree completely. I still think this coin is a FS coin. I have other PCGS FS coins where the steps are not a clear.
this statement-----100% NOT Full Step. The 5th step isn't there.-----is what got me going, especially when it was followed by others agreeing in lock-step. they cleary don't know how to count steps and shouldn't make such strong assertions.
I agree with ALL your comments.
What I do disagree with is your interpretation that the fifth step is clear. I see a damaged fifth step.
While you have forgotten more about Jeffs than I have ever known I believe that PCGS wants to see a clean
fifth step not a damaged fifth step.
PS - NGC wants 6 steps if I am not mistaken while PCGS only looks for five, but 5 nice ones.
EXCUSE THE HECK out of ME!!!!!!
The 5th step ain't there and it looks like PCGS agreed!!!
JMHO, GrandAm
Thank you very much for the FS lesson it was informative and enlightening.
To Grandam and others who had other thoughts, No worries
Rob
"Those guys weren't Fathers they were...Mothers."
From this day forward NOBODY but KEETS is allowed to give an opinion on wether a Nickel is Full-Step or not!!!
It seems HE is the only person WORTHY of giving their opinion on this subject. KEETS should submit his application to PCGS ASAP and I am sure they will hire him on the spot to grade all nickels from here on out.
PLEASE wait a couple of weeks to apply though as I currently have a BULK order in of 165 nickels and I don't WANT KEETS grading them
JMHO, GrandAm
<< <i>New Forum Rule:
From this day forward NOBODY but KEETS is allowed to give an opinion on wether a Nickel is Full-Step or not!!!
It seems HE is the only person WORTHY of giving their opinion on this subject. KEETS should submit his application to PCGS ASAP and I am sure they will hire him on the spot to grade all nickels from here on out.
PLEASE wait a couple of weeks to apply though as I currently have a BULK order in of 165 nickels and I don't WANT KEETS grading them
JMHO, GrandAm
Rob
"Those guys weren't Fathers they were...Mothers."
Grandam..................
the fifth step is clearly there along with almost half of step number six. the part that is important is the step-line, not the riser which goes from one step to the next. as far as PCGS is concerned, i'm confident that they are in agreement with everything i've stated which has to do with counting steps, and i feel certain that their not assigning the FS designation has nothing to do with the step-lines. they most probably feel that there are some bridges which i'm willing to believe can be better seen in-hand.
perhaps others who avidly collect the series in Mint State and fully understand step counting will weigh in this evening to help clarify things.
<< <i>New Forum Rule:
From this day forward NOBODY but KEETS is allowed to give an opinion on wether a Nickel is Full-Step or not!!!
It seems HE is the only person WORTHY of giving their opinion on this subject. KEETS should submit his application to PCGS ASAP and I am sure they will hire him on the spot to grade all nickels from here on out.
PLEASE wait a couple of weeks to apply though as I currently have a BULK order in of 165 nickels and I don't WANT KEETS grading them
JMHO, GrandAm
......................
You will have to wait till the tide goes out,hes still walking on water
I like the strike though but a MS67? Tell me it's a lustrous coin and without a mark on the cheek then we'll go there.
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>Don't know - but why pay big bucks for a strike designation on 0.1% of the coin?
It's for the registry points man, .........don't you know that? Sheesh!
Leo
edited to add....sheesh...........
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
When I look at photo of the steps my first reaction is why aren't the 4 pillars raised? Maybe the same question for step 1?
In the side by side picture the the pillars do look raised. Based on the picture of the steps I would say not full steps but I have never been a farmer.
Here is an example of 6 step coin although it does have some chatter.
My Jefferson Full Step Variety Set (1938 - Current)
My Jefferson Proof Variety Set (1938 - Current)
<< <i>Yeah, I have to agree with keets, the midsection of the 5th step riser is missing, 4 1/2 steps at best. >>
Since you are saying there are only 4 1/2 steps you are agreeing with me,,,, not Keets.
GrandAm
Just to clarify,,,, when I said 100% NOT FULL Steps that does not mean there are NO Steps. It means that IMHO there is 0% chance that PCGS would Full Step the coin. The 5th step while ALMOST there appears to me to broken just past the 3rd pillar. This is why I said it is NOT Full Step!
JMHO, GrandAm
Allan
Dowgie
If you tilt it another way they may not be there. But it's not the 5th step thats not there!
.....................................................
<< <i>Don't know - but why pay big bucks for a strike designation on 0.1% of the coin that can't even be determined definitively from pics the size of a computer screen?
For most dates it's the first place a collector looks
when scanning rolls to see if they are fully struck.
It just seems to take on a significance of it's own
when you've looked at vast numbers of coins for
Full Head, Full Hands or whatever.
For some dates it can be excessively rare as well,
though this isn't one of them.
<< <i> Full Step Nickel Club:
Incused Lines. The easiest way to determine full steps is to count the lines cut into the surface of the step area. To make this absolutely clear, imagine a number of furrows plowed in a farmer's field. A five-step Jefferson nickel shows four furrows in the 'field.' In numismatic terms, the furrows are called incuse lines. Horizontally, there should be four complete incuse lines between the boxes located on the left and right sides of the steps. Even the smallest break in any one of these horizontal lines nullifies the line as a full step line. A six-stepped coin should contain five complete incuse lines.
............................ >>
Truly well said and from a partially very excellent post.
Problem is that we all think we know what we're talking about all the time.
If we really had to know then no one would ever get to talk.
S
Edited to clarify communication.
<< <i>When I look at photo of the steps my first reaction is why aren't the 4 pillars raised? Maybe the same question for step 1?
In the side by side picture the the pillars do look raised. Based on the picture of the steps I would say not full steps but I have never been a farmer.
Here is an example of 6 step coin although it does have some chatter.
Well, I'll match your 4 pillars and raise you two missing risers, it ain't full steps!
why aren't the 4 pillars raised?
And just what the heck is that? They do look weak in one pic.
And are you saying farmers exaggerate?
Just trying to move this along.
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
Time to lay down the gauntlet....
Somebody try to beat my 7 step Jeff ... !!!
This diagram is copyright the FSNC:
<< <i>JRocco, something looks off with the steps on that Jefferson. There looks to be a bulge on the bottom left of the stairs? And 7-steps? Cool!
It is a 6 step Jeff with neat strike doubling on the sixth step giving it 7 steps.
<< <i>
It is a 6 step Jeff with neat strike doubling on the sixth step giving it 7 steps.
Nice coin.
...but where are the seven steps on each end of Monticello?
Dowgie