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new ebay bill much higher
shark1970
Posts: 210
my ebay bill figured out to cost me 8.2% of my sales for may.
then the monthly fee, listing fee's, and all the paypal fee's, which we get 90% of
our payments thru paypal. so I guess our bottom line costs were around 11%.
that's not including any supplies, just ebay and paypal fee's.
my bottom line last month was 6.7% of my sales before paypal, ect.
1.5% may not sound like a lot, but it's $150 for every 10,000 you sell.
we only got the 5% dashboard discount of course, hardly no one is going to be able to get
the 15% with the new feedback policy.
then the monthly fee, listing fee's, and all the paypal fee's, which we get 90% of
our payments thru paypal. so I guess our bottom line costs were around 11%.
that's not including any supplies, just ebay and paypal fee's.
my bottom line last month was 6.7% of my sales before paypal, ect.
1.5% may not sound like a lot, but it's $150 for every 10,000 you sell.
we only got the 5% dashboard discount of course, hardly no one is going to be able to get
the 15% with the new feedback policy.
0
Comments
When I tell them that coins don't have a 100% markup and the spread between buy and sell is almost always less than 20% they reply "Change your business model." I find that arrogant.
--Jerry
That's down from the 100's per month I was paying them for a couple years.
I win !
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>I didn't know they reasied their fees as well. I was just going to add a few things after not doing it for awhile. I wanted to laugh when I logged in to see that sellers can't leave negative feedback for a buyer. WTF? >>
So still you're more focused on the feedback change than the fee increase--genius by ebay.
<< <i>Okay, so eBay charges too much. Where else are you going to go sell your stuff? Sure the BST, but what about non-numismatic material? Craigslist? I've used that with some success, but nothing like the success I've had on eBay. Bottom line, for what eBay provides in customer base and brand recognition the fees really aren't that much. >>
I think stuff like Craigslist works pretty well for general merchandise -- when we downsized to a smaller home, I was able to sell off some furniture and other "stuff" that wouldn't fit in the new home. Something like coins are definitely not suited to it, though.
<< <i>Something like coins are definitely not suited to it, though. >>
Oh yeah, I agree completely. CL is great for furniture, some clothing, sports tickets, but NOT coins. I almost always use the BST first for selling coins, but even with the fees, eBay certainly produces results (at least for me), so I'm willing to pay.
<< <i>Okay, so eBay charges too much. Where else are you going to go sell your stuff? Sure the BST, but what about non-numismatic material? Craigslist? I've used that with some success, but nothing like the success I've had on eBay. Bottom line, for what eBay provides in customer base and brand recognition the fees really aren't that much. >>
Well it sounds like you don't sell enough on eBay. I just don't see where 15% overall is reasonable for items that in some cases, do not have a mark up at all!
The name is LEE!
<< <i>I just don't see where 15% overall is reasonable for items that in some cases, do not have a mark up at all! >>
<< <i>15% is quite a bit for coins, I agree. But how many coins would the full timers be able to move without the marketing power of ebay? How much would you spend on some other marketing campaign to move a decent volume without ebay? >>
This is exactly why eBay has the market by the nads.
The genius of eBay is that its business model lends itself to a natural monopoly. Sellers want to be where the most potential bidders are, and buyers want to be where they have the most inventory to choose from. As a result, "whatever the market will bear" for their line of business is quite high.
It's genius in its simplicity, actually.
<< <i>
<< <i>I just don't see where 15% overall is reasonable for items that in some cases, do not have a mark up at all! >>
A) shouldn't have paid so much for it,
C) shouldn't have bought it at all.
If you're just dumping merchandise because you've had it too long or whatever, than you need to expect some kind of loss. That's just common business sense. >>
Huh?
Yer not talkin' to a idjut here! The piece that eBay is taking is great for items that have big markups but coins simply do not have big markups!
The name is LEE!
<< <i>The piece that eBay is taking is great for items that have big markups but coins simply do not have big markups >>
Makes sense. Do you still sell coins on eBay?
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>15% is quite a bit for coins, I agree. But how many coins would the full timers be able to move without the marketing power of ebay? How much would you spend on some other marketing campaign to move a decent volume without ebay? >>
Ok so if ebay is reasonable for coins. Is it reasonable for a dealer to make as much as ebay? Maybe even more? So if the dealer makes 15% and ebay make 15% then the buy/sell spread goes to 30%. People whine like a mashed cat around here when the buy/sell spread goes over 10%.
Coins can indeed be sold w/o ebay.
--Jerry
The buyer that dinged me bought a $500 medal, I charged $3.50 shipping (cost me $2.97) and $8.15 for insurance (with the rate increase I lost money), and he still said my shipping was way overpriced. Geeze!
<< <i>
Yer not talkin' to a idjut here! The piece that eBay is taking is great for items that have big markups but coins simply do not have big markups! >>
But if ebay created tiered fees, everyone would complain. Then the super duper power sellers would want adjusted fees along with their power seller rewards.
<< <i>Ok so if ebay is reasonable for coins. Is it reasonable for a dealer to make as much as ebay? Maybe even more? So if the dealer makes 15% and ebay make 15% then the buy/sell spread goes to 30%. >>
Except that eBay isn't making 15%. Not sure where that number comes from, but it is not that high. In my case, for example, it's about half that with eBay and PayPal fees combined.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Jerry is right. While everybody has been screaming bloody murder about the feedback policy change, the fee increase got lost in the shuffle. That said, eBay is still a hell of a lot cheaper than the overhead of a B&M store and produces a magnitude more eyeballs than any other venue. Nothing out there is even close.
Russ, NCNE >>
Russ what overhead do you have with running a B&M that you do not have with running a febay business?
and BTW depending on your success rate your ebay and paypal fees combined should be about 10-12%
<< <i>
<< <i>Ok so if ebay is reasonable for coins. Is it reasonable for a dealer to make as much as ebay? Maybe even more? So if the dealer makes 15% and ebay make 15% then the buy/sell spread goes to 30%. >>
Except that eBay isn't making 15%. Not sure where that number comes from, but it is not that high. In my case, for example, it's about half that with eBay and PayPal fees combined. Russ, NCNE >>
Russ,
I agree completely. The poster I quoted seemed to think 15% was reasonable.
I have a problem with the current 7.5%. Many of the coins I sell have a low margin in them and some months ebay makes more than I do. I know, the obvious answer to that is that I'm not a very good businessperson.... --Jerry
Except that eBay isn't making 15%. Not sure where that number comes from, but it is not that high. In my case, for example, it's about half that with eBay and PayPal fees combined. Russ, NCNE >>
<<Russ,
I agree completely. The poster I quoted seemed to think 15% was reasonable.
I have a problem with the current 7.5%. Many of the coins I sell have a low margin in them and some months ebay makes more than I do. I know, the obvious answer to that is that I'm not a very good businessperson.... --Jerry>>
It might make more sense to look at fees as a % of gross profit, rather than sales. You can list barebones auctions with .$99 starts and sell a lot of stuff, making the fee % of sales low. But if your margins are small, what's the point? You might find that half your profit goes to Ebay. I'd rather sell fewer items at higher margins.
<< <i>Russ what overhead do you have with running a B&M that you do not have with running a febay business? >>
Rent, property taxes, insurance, phone, electric, garbage, marketing, etc.
<< <i>and BTW depending on your success rate your ebay and paypal fees combined should be about 10-12% >>
My combined eBay and PayPal fees are around 7%.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Actually Russ, your combined PP and E-Bay fees are 0%, unless you are auctioning something of yours. You charge the fees back to the consignee correct? >>
True, but not relevant to the discussion. The discussion is what eBay and PayPal are actually charging, and the reality is that they are not charging the numbers that are being used in this thread.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>I know last month Russ and I both scored the 15% discount. This month someone dinged me with a 1 on shipping costs and I ended up with a 4.7 stars for shipping and dropped to a 5% discount. I know Russ got dinged on shipping also and lost his 15% and got 5%.
The buyer that dinged me bought a $500 medal, I charged $3.50 shipping (cost me $2.97) and $8.15 for insurance (with the rate increase I lost money), and he still said my shipping was way overpriced. Geeze! >>
<< <i>I have not done the calculations but I have been selling roughly the same amount of stuff and my e-bay fees are way down. I have been getting the 15% but am now on the cusp of dropping. I offer free shipping on most things and I still get dinged.
So instead of flat out rewarding the power seller for maing them tons of money, ebay takes advantage of the contentious buyer and dangles a discount in your face, based on situations you can't control no matter how hard you work to be a good seller and offer fair shipping fees. Then when you feel wronged by the buyer, you have no recourse to protect your reputation in the feedback system. To me, that is worse than raising fees.
1) It raises the FV Fee, which means that they collect a final value fee on shipping.
2) It attacks fee avoidance by the sellers who start auctions at $0.01 with shipping fees of $20.00.
3) It casts sellers who only charge actual shipping costs as the "bad guys", leaving them open to unwarranted negs in feedback.
Unfortunately, pushing sellers towards "free shipping" doesn't really help anyone but ebay, and actually hurts sellers financially.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>Unfortunately, pushing sellers towards "free shipping" doesn't really help anyone but ebay, and actually hurts sellers financially. >>
In more ways than one. Free shipping is a quick ticket to a lousy shipping cost DSR. The way it's worded, many buyers select "3" because they think it means "not applicable".
Russ, NCNE
That's not necessarily true. The % depends a lot on the final value. For a $25 item, the Final Value fee is 8.75% of the sell price. That would blow your 7% out of the water, even before Paypal, which adds another 3%. Only as the sell price increases does the % fall to the 7% that you're referring to.
<< <i>15% is quite a bit for coins, I agree. But how many coins would the full timers be able to move without the marketing power of ebay? How much would you spend on some other marketing campaign to move a decent volume without ebay? >>
Yup, they kinda know that most folks got nowhere else to go.
<< <i>That would blow your 7% out of the water >>
My 7% is an actual real life number, not speculation as most of the other numbers are in this thread.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>I know last month Russ and I both scored the 15% discount. This month someone dinged me with a 1 on shipping costs and I ended up with a 4.7 stars for shipping and dropped to a 5% discount. I know Russ got dinged on shipping also and lost his 15% and got 5%.
The buyer that dinged me bought a $500 medal, I charged $3.50 shipping (cost me $2.97) and $8.15 for insurance (with the rate increase I lost money), and he still said my shipping was way overpriced. Geeze! >>
Is it possible to see what feedback scores an individual buyer has left?
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
<< <i>Is it possible to see what feedback scores an individual buyer has left? >>
Yes, it is. Now that the DSR is calculated out to 100ths, it's obvious. eBay tried to claim that they built in latency and staggering to mask that, but it was propaganda.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>I know last month Russ and I both scored the 15% discount. This month someone dinged me with a 1 on shipping costs and I ended up with a 4.7 stars for shipping and dropped to a 5% discount. I know Russ got dinged on shipping also and lost his 15% and got 5%.
The buyer that dinged me bought a $500 medal, I charged $3.50 shipping (cost me $2.97) and $8.15 for insurance (with the rate increase I lost money), and he still said my shipping was way overpriced. Geeze! >>
Is it possible to see what feedback scores an individual buyer has left? >>
Only way I know is to check your dashboard often, when a user leaves feedback check if the dashboard scores change. The scores now go to two decimal places so it's not too hard to figure out.
<<My 7% is an actual real life number, not speculation as most of the other numbers are in this thread.>>
I never said that your number wasn't real. If you read my post you'll see that I'm using a $25 item as an example, and combined fees would be around 11-12%. That's not speculation, it's math. I'm just saying you can't assume that other sellers are paying the same fee % as you, because they may be selling lower priced items.
<< <i>I know last month Russ and I both scored the 15% discount. This month someone dinged me with a 1 on shipping costs and I ended up with a 4.7 stars for shipping and dropped to a 5% discount. I know Russ got dinged on shipping also and lost his 15% and got 5%.
The buyer that dinged me bought a $500 medal, I charged $3.50 shipping (cost me $2.97) and $8.15 for insurance (with the rate increase I lost money), and he still said my shipping was way overpriced. Geeze! >>
Frustrating. Those buyers obviously have not shipped anything insured, themselves, worth hundreds of dollars and signature confirmation. I rarely sell but when I do more often than not the shipping costs are greater to me than what is asked from the buyer. I didn't realize your stars have an effect on discounts. What a drag! It's a shame there are no ways to filter out idiots, ignorants, and those with little common sense.
The buyer that dinged me bought a $500 medal, I charged $3.50 shipping (cost me $2.97) and $8.15 for insurance (with the rate increase I lost money), and he still said my shipping was way overpriced. Geeze! >>
I'll bet a very small percent of seller get the 15%. Ebay set the bar that high for a reason. You're better off to charge what you need to for S&H, and take the 5% IMO.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I know last month Russ and I both scored the 15% discount. This month someone dinged me with a 1 on shipping costs and I ended up with a 4.7 stars for shipping and dropped to a 5% discount. I know Russ got dinged on shipping also and lost his 15% and got 5%.
The buyer that dinged me bought a $500 medal, I charged $3.50 shipping (cost me $2.97) and $8.15 for insurance (with the rate increase I lost money), and he still said my shipping was way overpriced. Geeze! >>
Is it possible to see what feedback scores an individual buyer has left? >>
Only way I know is to check your dashboard often, when a user leaves feedback check if the dashboard scores change. The scores now go to two decimal places so it's not too hard to figure out. >>
Ok. I thought about that, but was wondering if there was another way. I am also beginning to wonder if trying to make a few extra $$$ selling on Ebay is worth the trouble. All the extra time just to be able to take the family to Disney for a few days may not be worth it. Soryy kids.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
<< <i>I'll bet a very small percent of seller get the 15%. >>
In March, 30% of powersellers got the 15%, and 60% got the 5%.
Russ, NCNE
<< I'll bet a very small percent of seller get the 15%. >>
In March, 30% of powersellers got the 15%, and 60% got the 5%.
That's higher than I thought. That was before the new feedback rules though, so I'll bet it's much lower now.
It is slanted toward ebay, of course.
Options on feedback stars are:
- Very Unreasonable
- Unreasonable
- Neither unreasonable nor reasonable
- Reasonable
- Very Reasonable
A buyer is not 'dinging' you if they chose Reasonable. It's set up so Ebay will adventually win. If Ebay was looking to help the seller, they would have two options. Unreasonable and Reasonable. What more does there really need to be ?
<< <i><< I'll bet a very small percent of seller get the 15%. >>
In March, 30% of powersellers got the 15%, and 60% got the 5%.
That's higher than I thought. That was before the new feedback rules though, so I'll bet it's much lower now. >>
It's also higher than eBay anticipated - by double. The new feedback rules have nothing to do with the discount. It's based on DSR's, not feedback.
Russ, NCNE
I know for a fact my ebay and paypal fee's total over 10%
but we do fixed price buy it now listings with high listing fee's,
or fixed price listings in our ebay store.
so the fee's are much higher in the format we sell in.
<< <i>russ,
I know for a fact my ebay and paypal fee's total over 10%
but we do fixed price buy it now listings with high listing fee's,
or fixed price listings in our ebay store.
so the fee's are much higher in the format we sell in. >>
And, that's a choice you made.
Russ, NCNE
I had a 5% discount in April and just noticed a 15 % discount for May. I am happy with eBay.
Joe