How PCGS has recently let me down in many ways
jessewvu
Posts: 5,065 ✭✭✭✭✭
After reading another post (link to the post) I decided I have waited long enough for a response from PCGS that I still have not received.
It looks long but there are a few different points made.
I called PCGS when the American Buffalo Gold coin was released a few weeks ago from the mint and purchased 15 on the PCGS customer service reps statement that they would offer the First Strike and give it a special designation. I am absolutely sure of this because at first, the rep said no and then she corrected herself and said "wait, are you talking about the Bald Eagle gold coins?.... yes, we are offering first strike and special designation on the Celebration Buffalo coins" Well, I got the coins, filled out a submission form, and all but put it in the mail. I decided to call PCGS and confirm the first strike because I was submitting it via the Express submission level and with the first strike, it was going to run me about $900 bucks for grading. When I called on March 14th, they said they were NOT going to do first strike but WERE going to do a special designation. I was kind of mad and decided to only send in 5 coins (my submission form has the 15 scratched out and replaced with 5) for the express service and see how they turned out. So, I express mailed them to PCGS on the 14th, they were delivered on the 15th. PCGS didn't enter them into the system until the 18th and I didn't get grades until the 26th. I looked at the grades and noticed the Variety was American Buffalo, not Celebration buffalo. I immediately called and ended up talking to Laura and she told me that PCGS messed up and the reps mistakenly told me (and PCGS listed on their website) that they were going to give the coin a special designation but changed their mind two days before my grades were published (that's about 4 days after they got them). I explained that I submitted them only because they were going to have a special designation and she said she was sorry and offered me 5 regular submission vouchers "valued at $150". Well, thinking about it, I can't send the coins back to the Mint because they were removed from the shrink wrapping and I didn't get what I paid for from PCGS. On top of all that, I had put on my submission for that the coins be shipped back via Express mail, and the copy PCGS sent me back CLEARLY shows that I requested express mail. They even wrote “USPS EXP.” on the blue PCGS box. Well, they shipped it registered mail and charged me $2.00 per box to return my Celebration Buffalo boxes. They shouldn’t have charged me for the return box fee because I asked to use my Express mail account. Well I called customer service and talked to someone who was like what the hell do you want me to do about it? (those were not her words but pretty close in tone) I said I wanted them to look at my submission form and tell me what I put on it. She said they would have to go find my submission and I told them I’d wait. She said she would call me back, that was three days ago, no phone calls. I have called Laura directly no less than three times, leaving messages, many very detailed with my contact info, I have PM’ed her here, and I tried to talk to other people at PCGS and not one single person has given me a call back, not one. My opinion is either nobody at PCGS gives a rats behind or nobody at PCGS is in control. I have spent over $5,000 in grading fees alone with PCGS in the last month and this is what I get in return?
What do you think would be appropriate for PCGS do to in this situation? I have asked (via voice messages) to have my ENTIRE order refunded to me or PCGS should purchase the celebration coins from me at the US Mint price. I wouldn't have submitted the 2008 Celebration Bullion coins, at the express level no less, without a special designation.
The first and only time I talked to a knowledgeable rep, I talked to Laura, I also asked her about two bulk submission orders I had sent in. Before I submitted, I talked to Stephanie (I’m 97% sure it was her) and to the best of my recollection, she said I had to send in a minimum of 100 coins to get bulk and they had to be the same denomination, mint mark, and year. Well, I had 400 Bald Eagle Silver dollars (200 unc, 200 proof) to send in and about 20 $5 Gold Proof Bald eagles and 12 $5 Gold Unc eagles to send in too. I was told that I had to submit my gold coins in via the regular submission level. My bulk orders and my gold regular submission orders were accepted by PCGS on the same day so it wasn't like I was making this up... Well, it turns out that I could have sent them in via bulk after talking to Laura. She said she was going to look into that for me too. But me having to send those coins in through the regular level cost me about $550 extra. I was talking with Laura and said that the guidance is very very poor regarding bulk orders and mentioned a thread here that has some of that being discussed (Link to thread) Oh they forgot to send me my Bald Eagle $1 Silver capsules back that I wrote on my submission. I wrote it in pen, highlighted it, highlighted in another color around that, and put a post-it note OVER the submission so it wouldn’t be missed. Well, they did end up sending me capsules in one USPS Priority flat rate box, threw them all in there without protection. Only the one thing they did not realize is that the US Mint DOES NOT use the same capsules for every coin, thus, I got 347 American Silver Eagle coin capsules, and 53 capsules that were for the Bald Eagle silver coins. the ASE capsules do not fit in the Bald Eagle cases. There was a stinking reason I asked for my specific capsules back. The capsules I did get back are all severely scratched, I wouldn't give them away in any of my auctions.
Anyway, what do you all think? I have to say, the entire experience of my recent submissions has been very, very poor because of PCGS and their lack of guidance and clarity. I decided to start a relationship with PCGS, instead of NGC, because of their reputation. However, the more I deal with them, the more I am starting to recognize that maybe all they are is a third party grading service, and not really a business.
I decided to hold off on this and give PCGS a chance to “make good”, they haven’t even had the courtesy to say we appreciate your business but we can’t do anything for you, they just ignore me and it's been almost two weeks without a response.
I’m pretty ticked. But, if I am out of line here, I would be the first person to say, yeah, I screwed up. Tell me what I did wrong, or how I should have done something different.
NOTE: PCGS, IF I HAVE SOMETHING WRONG HERE OR LEFT SOMETHING OUT, PLEASE LET ME KNOW, I AM DIEING TO HEAR FROM SOMEONE FROM YOUR COMPANY!
edited for clarity and typos
It looks long but there are a few different points made.
I called PCGS when the American Buffalo Gold coin was released a few weeks ago from the mint and purchased 15 on the PCGS customer service reps statement that they would offer the First Strike and give it a special designation. I am absolutely sure of this because at first, the rep said no and then she corrected herself and said "wait, are you talking about the Bald Eagle gold coins?.... yes, we are offering first strike and special designation on the Celebration Buffalo coins" Well, I got the coins, filled out a submission form, and all but put it in the mail. I decided to call PCGS and confirm the first strike because I was submitting it via the Express submission level and with the first strike, it was going to run me about $900 bucks for grading. When I called on March 14th, they said they were NOT going to do first strike but WERE going to do a special designation. I was kind of mad and decided to only send in 5 coins (my submission form has the 15 scratched out and replaced with 5) for the express service and see how they turned out. So, I express mailed them to PCGS on the 14th, they were delivered on the 15th. PCGS didn't enter them into the system until the 18th and I didn't get grades until the 26th. I looked at the grades and noticed the Variety was American Buffalo, not Celebration buffalo. I immediately called and ended up talking to Laura and she told me that PCGS messed up and the reps mistakenly told me (and PCGS listed on their website) that they were going to give the coin a special designation but changed their mind two days before my grades were published (that's about 4 days after they got them). I explained that I submitted them only because they were going to have a special designation and she said she was sorry and offered me 5 regular submission vouchers "valued at $150". Well, thinking about it, I can't send the coins back to the Mint because they were removed from the shrink wrapping and I didn't get what I paid for from PCGS. On top of all that, I had put on my submission for that the coins be shipped back via Express mail, and the copy PCGS sent me back CLEARLY shows that I requested express mail. They even wrote “USPS EXP.” on the blue PCGS box. Well, they shipped it registered mail and charged me $2.00 per box to return my Celebration Buffalo boxes. They shouldn’t have charged me for the return box fee because I asked to use my Express mail account. Well I called customer service and talked to someone who was like what the hell do you want me to do about it? (those were not her words but pretty close in tone) I said I wanted them to look at my submission form and tell me what I put on it. She said they would have to go find my submission and I told them I’d wait. She said she would call me back, that was three days ago, no phone calls. I have called Laura directly no less than three times, leaving messages, many very detailed with my contact info, I have PM’ed her here, and I tried to talk to other people at PCGS and not one single person has given me a call back, not one. My opinion is either nobody at PCGS gives a rats behind or nobody at PCGS is in control. I have spent over $5,000 in grading fees alone with PCGS in the last month and this is what I get in return?
What do you think would be appropriate for PCGS do to in this situation? I have asked (via voice messages) to have my ENTIRE order refunded to me or PCGS should purchase the celebration coins from me at the US Mint price. I wouldn't have submitted the 2008 Celebration Bullion coins, at the express level no less, without a special designation.
The first and only time I talked to a knowledgeable rep, I talked to Laura, I also asked her about two bulk submission orders I had sent in. Before I submitted, I talked to Stephanie (I’m 97% sure it was her) and to the best of my recollection, she said I had to send in a minimum of 100 coins to get bulk and they had to be the same denomination, mint mark, and year. Well, I had 400 Bald Eagle Silver dollars (200 unc, 200 proof) to send in and about 20 $5 Gold Proof Bald eagles and 12 $5 Gold Unc eagles to send in too. I was told that I had to submit my gold coins in via the regular submission level. My bulk orders and my gold regular submission orders were accepted by PCGS on the same day so it wasn't like I was making this up... Well, it turns out that I could have sent them in via bulk after talking to Laura. She said she was going to look into that for me too. But me having to send those coins in through the regular level cost me about $550 extra. I was talking with Laura and said that the guidance is very very poor regarding bulk orders and mentioned a thread here that has some of that being discussed (Link to thread) Oh they forgot to send me my Bald Eagle $1 Silver capsules back that I wrote on my submission. I wrote it in pen, highlighted it, highlighted in another color around that, and put a post-it note OVER the submission so it wouldn’t be missed. Well, they did end up sending me capsules in one USPS Priority flat rate box, threw them all in there without protection. Only the one thing they did not realize is that the US Mint DOES NOT use the same capsules for every coin, thus, I got 347 American Silver Eagle coin capsules, and 53 capsules that were for the Bald Eagle silver coins. the ASE capsules do not fit in the Bald Eagle cases. There was a stinking reason I asked for my specific capsules back. The capsules I did get back are all severely scratched, I wouldn't give them away in any of my auctions.
Anyway, what do you all think? I have to say, the entire experience of my recent submissions has been very, very poor because of PCGS and their lack of guidance and clarity. I decided to start a relationship with PCGS, instead of NGC, because of their reputation. However, the more I deal with them, the more I am starting to recognize that maybe all they are is a third party grading service, and not really a business.
I decided to hold off on this and give PCGS a chance to “make good”, they haven’t even had the courtesy to say we appreciate your business but we can’t do anything for you, they just ignore me and it's been almost two weeks without a response.
I’m pretty ticked. But, if I am out of line here, I would be the first person to say, yeah, I screwed up. Tell me what I did wrong, or how I should have done something different.
NOTE: PCGS, IF I HAVE SOMETHING WRONG HERE OR LEFT SOMETHING OUT, PLEASE LET ME KNOW, I AM DIEING TO HEAR FROM SOMEONE FROM YOUR COMPANY!
edited for clarity and typos
1
Comments
42/92
<< <i>I can't send the coins back to the Mint because they were removed from the shrink wrapping >>
You can still return them to the Mint if they are opened. Many people return coins to the Mint after opening and examining them.
Of course this thread will go ****POOF***** come Monday....
Recipient of the coveted "You Suck" award, April 2009 for cherrypicking a 1833 CBHD LM-5, and April 2022 for a 1835 LM-12, and again in Aug 2012 for picking off a 1952 FS-902.
I too purchased (1) coin based on getting the "Celebration Coin" labeling and called to confirm that it would be done before sending it in. THEN they changed their mind and now I find out they won't do it. Well, I guess I'm glad I only bought (1) coin!
GrandAm
I can see how many people would make decisions based on information published on their website and confirmed by their customer service reps.
<< <i>What did the coins grade?
I too purchased (1) coin based on getting the "Celebration Coin" labeling and called to confirm that it would be done before sending it in. THEN they changed their mind and now I find out they won't do it. Well, I guess I'm glad I only bought (1) coin!
GrandAm
They all graded MS69 which is fine with me. That should immediatly bring up another question, would I be so ticked if they all came back MS70? I think yes and no. I would still be upset because I didn't get what I paid for and they did not notify me that they weren't going to give the special designation. When I had a problem with a 10th Ann Plat submission (I thought they would get the 10th Ann designation and they didn't), they put my order on STOP until I called them and said they could put it on a different submission, why is this different?
On the other hand, if they were all MS70, I could have recouped the cost of the grading fees myself, what I paid for and didn't get, by selling the coins. I wouldn't have relied on PCGS to recoup those costs for me. I still would have asked for my grading fees on the coins to be refunded.
Laura Rosenberg
Director, Customer Service
Collectors Universe, Inc.
(888) 469-2646 x424
<< <i>Do we know why they changed their mind on the Celebration Buffaloes? >>
I was told they decided to not offer any special designation because only the packaging was different with the coin. However, didn't they know that BEFORE the coins started shipping them?
When I opened a box from the mint to look at the coin, I was a little disapointed because all they did was take a bullion coin in the shrink wrap and put it in a box.
<< <i>Call this person.
Laura Rosenberg
Director, Customer Service
Collectors Universe, Inc.
(888) 469-2646 x424 >>
She is who I have been calling, I left her voice messages and PM's here on the boards, no response.
She is the one person at PCGS that everytime I have contacted her she has responded quickly and has handled the problem or found out an answer as to "WHY" it can't be done or wasn't done.
THIS MEANS ALOT.
BJ should set-up training classes and teach everyone else how business should be done!!!!
JMHO, GrandAm
Edited to include email: LRosenberg@collectors.com
<< <i>It's too bad that BJ Searls can't "HANDLE" everything!!!
She is the one person at PCGS that everytime I have contacted her she has responded quickly and has handled the problem or found out an answer as to "WHY" it can't be done or wasn't done.
THIS MEANS ALOT.
BJ should set-up training classes and teach everyone else how business should be done!!!!
JMHO, GrandAm
I absolutely agree with this. She and the other women that work the Registry are top notch.
<< <i>She is who I have been calling, I left her voice messages and PM's here on the boards, no response. >>
Maybe she has caller ID.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I agree.. BJ, and Cosetta, are absolutely super when asked to
look into something. Never have I not had resolution of a problem,
or at least, I was given a reasonable explaination!
And like I said before, I would be the first one to correct myself if I am out of line here. I think Laura honestly wanted to help me, and she seemed very nice when I talked to her, she explained everything very clearly. My problem is I haven't received a follow up and none of my messages have been returned. I am sure they are very busy at PCGS and might just be going through a hard time right now, I understand life. Life happens and in the grand scheme of life, this is low pretty piddily stuff. I think I am a pretty easy guy to please when it comes to dealing with people and situations, but how long is too long? I also understand that I not even close to being PCGS's biggest customer, I just think that someone could have given me a follow up call or email.
If they treat large volume submitters like this...well...it goes without saying I guess.
If I only had a dollar for every VAM I have...err...nevermind...I do!!
My "Fun With 21D" Die State Collection - QX5 Pics Attached
-----
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2 –DAMMIT BOY!!! ® Awards
BJ and Laura are a great duo, but inadequate credit is given to several others at PCGS customer service who consistently perform with professionalism and attentiveness. BJ and Laura aren't the only people who are reliable. I won't name specific people, but I know who they are, they know who they are, and all the work they have performed on my behalf I am greatly appreciative of.
One more thing...from personal experience from consistent contact with PCGS and NGC for the last decade I have figured out that the "Director of Customer Service" may not always be the one who's most able (or willing) to pull strings to your advantage.
Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
<< <i>PCGS customer service is not perfect, but comparing them to the USPS or US Mint is unfair since the folks at PCGS are leagues above those two government entities. >>
US Mint customer service will refund your money if you're unhappy. That sounds like good service.
<< <i>I won't name specific people, but I know who they are >>
Why? If there is someone in customer service who is helpful and intelligent
customers need to know about this.
<< <i>
<< <i>I won't name specific people, but I know who they are >>
Why? If there is someone in customer service who is helpful and intelligent
customers need to know about this. >>
If they get overloaded, the service they provide may degrade.
1. PCGS made the right decision regarding the "no First Strike" for this identical coin to the one the US Mint currently sells its handful of top distributors for far less money (and then gets trickled down to dealers and collectors).
2. PCGS made the right decision regarding no special label for this particular coin - collectors are probably fine with just the FS and non-FS regular coins for far less money - no need to add several more different slabs for this single coin at this time.
3. PCGS was generous in offering (10) free grading coupons. Could they have been even more generous and made them Express freebies? I guess they could have. That is the only thing I might be asking PCGS privately to consider.
4. I am not entirely sure you can not return those coins to the Mint, even now. You should ask - you might find out it is fine to do.
Bottom line - not every PCGS submission results in monumental profits. Some are even losers. No biggie - you just move on. I recently went about 0/2,000 on some modern coins where the grade through rate should have generally been about 1%+. Big difference between (20) PR70DC coins and 0. What did I do - grabbed a tall cold bottle of Grolsch (Dr. Pepper works just as well for the kids and non beer drinkers out there) and started fresh the next day.
Wondercoin
<< <i>My 2 cents:
1. PCGS made the right decision regarding the "no First Strike" for this identical coin to the one the US Mint currently sells its handful of top distributors for far less money (and then gets trickled down to dealers and collectors).
2. PCGS made the right decision regarding no special label for this particular coin - collectors are probably fine with just the FS and non-FS regular coins for far less money - no need to add several more different slabs for this single coin at this time.
3. PCGS was generous in offering (10) free grading coupons. Could they have been even more generous and made them Express freebies? I guess they could have. That is the only thing I might be asking PCGS privately to consider.
4. I am not entirely sure you can not return those coins to the Mint, even now. You should ask - you might find out it is fine to do.
Bottom line - not every PCGS submission results in monumental profits. Some are even losers. No biggie - you just move on. I recently went about 0/2,000 on some modern coins where the grade through rate should have generally been about 1%+. Big difference between (20) PR70DC coins and 0. What did I do - grabbed a tall cold bottle of Grolsch (Dr. Pepper works just as well for the kids and non beer drinkers out there) and started fresh the next day.
Wondercoin >>
Dr Mitch, what should I take for 6% on a coin with a 30% grade thru rate (2006 w 1/2oz age) ...the Grolsh didnt get it done??
Joflax - You do realize the raw coins are selling for about as much as PCGS-MS70 coins at times? You dodged a bullet with this one.
Wondercoin
<< <i>"Dr Mitch, what should I take for 6% on a coin with a 30% grade thru rate (2006 w 1/2oz age) ...the Grolsh didnt get it done??"
Joflax - You do realize the raw coins are selling for about as much as PCGS-MS70 coins at times? You dodged a bullet with this one.
Wondercoin >>
But my liver still hurts...and my fingers will hurt if I have crack em all out
Sorry though, it's just hard feeling sorry for a flipper like that. To only buy and only submit to make money and then have something happen (ie....lack of a LABEL) cause you to want to return them or feel that you will lose out on money......that is part of buying to sell....take the lumps when they happen or else get out of the game and stay out of it.
If you are big enough to play, then you are big enough to take some lumps.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<<BJ, and Cosetta, are absolutely super when asked to look into something.>>
Others, not so much. Still waiting on the OGP on the 20th Anniv. SAE set I had graded, what....2 years ago!
Even after calling & talking to someone who said he was in charge of those submissions & would have 1 sent to me.
And yes, I did pay for the packaging to be returned.
So I agree with jessewvu on the shoddy job done on the return of the capsules.
<<Sorry though, it's just hard feeling sorry for a flipper like that. >>
All this whining because of a designation on a label.
Talk about selling the slab, not the coin.
jessewvu, you state "Well, thinking about it, I can't send the coins back to the Mint because they were removed from the shrink wrapping and I didn't get what I paid for from PCGS. ".
Did you pay extra on grading for the type of submission? Or is it that you chose the submission type based on the labeling? Trying to get this to market first to capitalize on the label? I guess this goes back to selling the label, not the coin.
Bulk grading......I wish there was a clear standard posted online.
Seems as though there are a few 'rules' out there.
100 min. seems to be one of the rules, though I have been PM'ed that this can also be 'fudged' a bit if you're very close.
Same denomination, yes.
Routinely hear 4 different yr/mm....when you ask.
Never thought about whether Silver/Gold/Plat Eagles would be considered the same. Maybe not same denomination, but rather same design?
<< <i>All this whining because of a designation on a label.
Talk about selling the slab, not the coin. >>
Yes, but it was a designation advertised by PCGS. And PCGS is in the business of slabbing.
1) Paragraphs can be your friends.
2) $5,000 in a month in grading fees is amazing.
3) PCGS does not improve their customer service any more than they have to and they don't have to improve it much in today's TPG landscape.
<< <i>After reading another post (link to the post) I decided I have waited long enough for a response from PCGS that I still have not received.
It looks long but there are a few different points made.
I called PCGS when the American Buffalo Gold coin was released a few weeks ago from the mint and purchased 15 on the PCGS customer service reps statement that they would offer the First Strike and give it a special designation. I am absolutely sure of this because at first, the rep said no and then she corrected herself and said "wait, are you talking about the Bald Eagle gold coins?.... yes, we are offering first strike and special designation on the Celebration Buffalo coins" Well, I got the coins, filled out a submission form, and all but put it in the mail. I decided to call PCGS and confirm the first strike because I was submitting it via the Express submission level and with the first strike, it was going to run me about $900 bucks for grading. When I called on March 14th, they said they were NOT going to do first strike but WERE going to do a special designation. I was kind of mad and decided to only send in 5 coins (my submission form has the 15 scratched out and replaced with 5) for the express service and see how they turned out. So, I express mailed them to PCGS on the 14th, they were delivered on the 15th. PCGS didn't enter them into the system until the 18th and I didn't get grades until the 26th. I looked at the grades and noticed the Variety was American Buffalo, not Celebration buffalo. I immediately called and ended up talking to Laura and she told me that PCGS messed up and the reps mistakenly told me (and PCGS listed on their website) that they were going to give the coin a special designation but changed their mind two days before my grades were published (that's about 4 days after they got them). I explained that I submitted them only because they were going to have a special designation and she said she was sorry and offered me 5 regular submission vouchers "valued at $150". Well, thinking about it, I can't send the coins back to the Mint because they were removed from the shrink wrapping and I didn't get what I paid for from PCGS. On top of all that, I had put on my submission for that the coins be shipped back via Express mail, and the copy PCGS sent me back CLEARLY shows that I requested express mail. They even wrote “USPS EXP.” on the blue PCGS box. Well, they shipped it registered mail and charged me $2.00 per box to return my Celebration Buffalo boxes. They shouldn’t have charged me for the return box fee because I asked to use my Express mail account. Well I called customer service and talked to someone who was like what the hell do you want me to do about it? (those were not her words but pretty close in tone) I said I wanted them to look at my submission form and tell me what I put on it. She said they would have to go find my submission and I told them I’d wait. She said she would call me back, that was three days ago, no phone calls. I have called Laura directly no less than three times, leaving messages, many very detailed with my contact info, I have PM’ed her here, and I tried to talk to other people at PCGS and not one single person has given me a call back, not one. My opinion is either nobody at PCGS gives a rats behind or nobody at PCGS is in control. I have spent over $5,000 in grading fees alone with PCGS in the last month and this is what I get in return?
What do you think would be appropriate for PCGS do to in this situation? I have asked (via voice messages) to have my ENTIRE order refunded to me or PCGS should purchase the celebration coins from me at the US Mint price. I wouldn't have submitted the 2008 Celebration Bullion coins, at the express level no less, without a special designation.
The first and only time I talked to a knowledgeable rep, I talked to Laura, I also asked her about two bulk submission orders I had sent in. Before I submitted, I talked to Stephanie (I’m 97% sure it was her) and to the best of my recollection, she said I had to send in a minimum of 100 coins to get bulk and they had to be the same denomination, mint mark, and year. Well, I had 400 Bald Eagle Silver dollars (200 unc, 200 proof) to send in and about 20 $5 Gold Proof Bald eagles and 12 $5 Gold Unc eagles to send in too. I was told that I had to submit my gold coins in via the regular submission level. My bulk orders and my gold regular submission orders were accepted by PCGS on the same day so it wasn't like I was making this up... Well, it turns out that I could have sent them in via bulk after talking to Laura. She said she was going to look into that for me too. But me having to send those coins in through the regular level cost me about $550 extra. I was talking with Laura and said that the guidance is very very poor regarding bulk orders and mentioned a thread here that has some of that being discussed (Link to thread) Oh they forgot to send me my Bald Eagle $1 Silver capsules back that I wrote on my submission. I wrote it in pen, highlighted it, highlighted in another color around that, and put a post-it note OVER the submission so it wouldn’t be missed. Well, they did end up sending me capsules in one USPS Priority flat rate box, threw them all in there without protection. Only the one thing they did not realize is that the US Mint DOES NOT use the same capsules for every coin, thus, I got 347 American Silver Eagle coin capsules, and 53 capsules that were for the Bald Eagle silver coins. the ASE capsules do not fit in the Bald Eagle cases. There was a stinking reason I asked for my specific capsules back. The capsules I did get back are all severely scratched, I wouldn't give them away in any of my auctions.
Anyway, what do you all think? I have to say, the entire experience of my recent submissions has been very, very poor because of PCGS and their lack of guidance and clarity. I decided to start a relationship with PCGS, instead of NGC, because of their reputation. However, the more I deal with them, the more I am starting to recognize that maybe all they are is a third party grading service, and not really a business.
I decided to hold off on this and give PCGS a chance to “make good”, they haven’t even had the courtesy to say we appreciate your business but we can’t do anything for you, they just ignore me and it's been almost two weeks without a response.
I’m pretty ticked. But, if I am out of line here, I would be the first person to say, yeah, I screwed up. Tell me what I did wrong, or how I should have done something different.
NOTE: PCGS, IF I HAVE SOMETHING WRONG HERE OR LEFT SOMETHING OUT, PLEASE LET ME KNOW, I AM DIEING TO HEAR FROM SOMEONE FROM YOUR COMPANY!
edited for clarity and typos >>
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>Nice little rant
Sorry though, it's just hard feeling sorry for a flipper like that. To only buy and only submit to make money and then have something happen (ie....lack of a LABEL) cause you to want to return them or feel that you will lose out on money......that is part of buying to sell....take the lumps when they happen or else get out of the game and stay out of it.
If you are big enough to play, then you are big enough to take some lumps. >>
Regardless, one should be able to expect consistantcy in ones' suppliers.
Check out my current listings: https://ebay.com/sch/khunt/m.html?_ipg=200&_sop=12&_rdc=1
Where's the CliffsNotes version as this is painful!
Isn't the heart of this that PCGS changed it's mind on a designation. Are they not allowed to do this?
There was even compensation offered.
Time will tell if the capsule issue is resolved.
Oh yeah, no call-backs. Bad customer service, but Laura probably has a many things going on. This needs work.
While I agree that taking your hits and going on is part of it,,,,,, and I have certainely taken by share of hits without complaining in the past,,,,,, there is a difference WHEN you call customer service and ask direction,,,,, are told that PCGS will give a special label to that coin,,,,,, print that info off of the PCGS WEB SITE and include it with your submission and THEN after the coins are graded and fee's charged and you purchased coins based on what you were told by PCGS paying a higher price than you would have had to otherwise to acquire the same coin,,,,
JMHO, GrandAm
Well yes and no.
I was told there were no special holders for these coins from Day 1 and told anyone and everyone who asked me about them.
Wondercoin
Grandam - Edited to add...
Yes, it appears that Customer Service gal may have been mistaken in this case, but, other than offering 10 free submissions, how much more should be done by PCGS - (1) money for pain and suffering?; (2) money for lost profit; (3) money for loss of consortium?; (4) free vacation to CA? You tell me.
<< <i>"Isn't the heart of this that PCGS changed it's mind on a designation"
Well yes and no.
I was told there were no special holders for these coins from Day 1 and told anyone and everyone who asked me about them.
Wondercoin >>
So they changed their mind twice?
Sure is unfair what they did to you, good luck trying to get smoe satisfaction!
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
you're okay in my book
hang onto them for a wee bit and you will be able to get your money out of them
May I PM you in the future to see if you know what PCGS will do on a certain coin? You seem to know better than they do and I don't mean this in a smart way.
Edited to add:::: What should be done,,,,, and I stated this a few days ago in another thread is that PCGS should give the "Celebration Coin" Label to any submission in a sealed package that was POSTMARKED PRIOR to them removing the statement on their Web Site saying that they would in fact label the coin.
GrandAm
By the way, I was NOT aware there was a posting on their web site concerning the issue. And, like I said, I do not believe jessewu is not entitled to compensation - my only point is that 10 free submission (for 5 coins submitted?) seemed reasonable - no? Perhaps he should get a bit more.
Wondercoin
Edited to respond to Grandam's edit - Grandam - with respect to your proposed solution - then what about all the folks I told that PCGS would not designate the coin based upon PCGS' clear position to me? Wouldn't they be crying foul if PCGS then did it? What if I responded to your email and told you PCGS was not intending to do it and then they did it after you ordered no coins? How upset would you be at me? Maybe I shouldn't reply to anyone's PM's to ensure I don't mess up anyone.
Wondercoin
<< <i>
<< <i>Nice little rant
Sorry though, it's just hard feeling sorry for a flipper like that. To only buy and only submit to make money and then have something happen (ie....lack of a LABEL) cause you to want to return them or feel that you will lose out on money......that is part of buying to sell....take the lumps when they happen or else get out of the game and stay out of it.
If you are big enough to play, then you are big enough to take some lumps. >>
Regardless, one should be able to expect consistantcy in ones' suppliers. >>
Know your suppliers going into it and be aware of what may happen.
In this case, if you have been on the boards for more than a few months, you KNOW that PCGS has some CS issues at times. You KNOW there are always issues around the labels and you KNOW that things may crop of up with them that are timing issues, etc.
So, BBE, since I know you have a few businesses, what do you do when one of your suppliers is either inconsistent or doesn't deliver as promised?
You go elsewhere, right? If you don't want to go elsewhere, what do you do? You either suck it up, forget about them, or create a competitor, right?
So, while not a monopoly, for people that play this flipping game with labels, they have nowhere else to really go (NGC...kind of, but not the same ROI) and either suck it up or get out. If you don't know all of the above going into it, you shouldn't go into it, imho, as you don't know the business, right?
Kind of like those that turned into ebay dealers.....when they whine about the fees, feedback, DSRs, customers, etc........that's all part of the business. If you can't handle it, you shouldn't be doing it. If you choose to do it, well, then you are just a whiner (you does not mean you, BBE, it is the generic "you").
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
There is no easy answer here. I have a copy of a print -out of the Web Page saying they would label the coin. I printed it out when I heard they were not going to do it.
GrandAm
<< <i>Mitch,
There is no easy answer here. I have a copy of a print -out of the Web Page saying they would label the coin. I printed it out when I heard they were not going to do it.
The real issue here is the lack of concern or action addressing customer service issues. Anyone who has a lick of sense knows that if a company ignores it customer base that their future is limited.
I have been on these Forums since April 2002 and I have been submitting coins to PCGS since 1986. At that time you had to go thru an authorized dealer and I submitted thru SilverTowne in Winchester, IN.
Most people who have been around on these Forums KNOW that there has not many stronger supporters of PCGS in the past than I have been,,,,,,,,, BUT,,,,,,,, and their is always a butt,,,,,,
When you start alienating long time customers like me by IGNORING them,,,,,,,, well then there is a problem.
Nobody wants PCGS to prosper or be successful more than I do BUT there are issues that need to be addressed and nobody seems to be concerned about it!!!!! I hope I am wrong!!!!!!
GrandAm
Now, Gary, I will agree 100% with your points above. Just because one has to accept them doesn't make poor CS right. I really wonder a few things about PCGS' CS...
* Turnover rate
* Overall time with company
* How many CS staff
* Number of calls/emails/issues that have to be dealt with daily/weekly
It's very easy to throw stones from this side of the street but without knowing the above, I don't think it's fair. Not saying that's an excuse, just saying that, depending on the above answers, it would tell me whether it is a personnel problem or a company (upper mgmt) issue. If they get 2x more calls to handle than people can do, they need more people. If they have enough people, it is a people issue (not learning the right thing, paying attention to memos, etc).
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
And, I can assure you that I have my fair share of issues as well.
Look - there was obviously confusion at PCGS on the issue of whether to prepare a special holder or not for these coins. I will let you know that I was not contacted (or any other dealer I know) to ask our opinion on whether it made sense to have the special holder or not. That is different than the past, where I was at least asked about the 20th Anniv Gold sets and even recently asked on the 10th Anniv Plat sets. I still say there should be a small committee formed by PCGS consisting of one or two outside modern dealers and one or two outside collectors as well as a rep at PCGS to meet and confer on issues such as this. I truly believe the blend of a couple dealers, a couple well qualified collectors and whomever "makes the calls" at PCGS would be a better blend for decision making than the present system of just "whomever makes the calls". I was lucky (based upon Grandam just informing me about the website announcement)- it could have just as easily gone the other way and I would have provided bad information to a few customers who would have been very unhappy with me. As you said Grandam - there is no easy answer here. But, I think the Committee I mentioned might help on future situations like this one.
Wondercoin
This is what bothers me, it rings of the 20th anniversary "sealed" sets. Understand your position which you've explained before,
that your doing a service by disclosing any information you have, but still... the observer takes from it that you have information that others are not privelege to... unless of course they ask you.