Sub results and p & L breakdown
smtjoy
Posts: 617
Here is a bit of how I analyze a sub when I get one it. I saw someone asking why people send in cards and then cant sell them for more than grading fees or who lose money on them. Here is a recent sub of mine.
With a sub I plan for some losses but hope to hit more on the plus side to more than make up for it. There is a vegas side to some submissions, score a low pop in high grades and make some nice cash, the other side is sometimes the grades just dont go your way. Sub goals were- I really wanted to sell a number of cards to cover my grading fees (cards listed as for registry set) and felt I had a good shot at making big money on a card or two-
1 1 14997071 VERY GOOD-EXCELLENT 4 1965 BAZOOKA 14 BOB CLEMENTE HAND CUT-BATTING Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
2 1 14997072 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1971 MILK DUDS ROBERTO CLEMENTE HAND CUT Card US (Paid $199 for complete box to try for an 8, got a 6 as a box so cut and resubmitted total cost with grading fees $230, VCP has a 7 going for $95, an 8 at $195 and a 9 at $1200, I figured my downside was $130 loss if I hit a 7, a $30 loss if I got an 8 and a $870 profit if I hit a 9, I will take those odds any day, I got an 8 so only cost me $30 for the try)
3 1 14997073 GOOD 2 1971 TOPPS TATTOOS PERFORATED ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
4 1 14997074 NEAR MINT 7 1962 TOPPS 160 DICK STUART Card US (found in a box of old cards in closet, would have made big money hitting an 8, vcp 7 at $30 so Profit of $18)
5 1 14997075 VERY GOOD 3 1965 TOPPS TRANSFERS BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
6 1 14997076 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Purchased a lot of 10 of these for $85, sold off the lower graded ones for $50 so into clemente mays koufax and the killebrew for 35 plus 48 in grading fees so $83/4 or $21 a card, VCP has a 7 at $36 and an 8 at $187 and Im sure a 9 would sell for $700+, got an 8 so a $166 profit)
6 2 14997077 EXCELLENT 5 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (paid $9 plus 12 so into for $21, had hoped for a 6+ but I vcp has 5 at $21 so breakeven)
7 1 14997078 EXCELLENT-MINT 6 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS WILLIE MAYS Card US ((Purchased a lot of 10 of these for $85, sold off the lower graded ones for $50 so into clemente mays koufax and the killebrew for 35 plus 48 in grading fees so $83/4 or $21 a card, VCP has a 6 at $20 and im sure a 7 at $40+ , got an 6 so I lose $1)
8 1 14997079 NEAR MINT 7 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS SANDY KOUFAX Card US (Purchased a lot of 10 of these for $85, sold off the lower graded ones for $50 so into clemente mays koufax and the killebrew for 35 plus 48 in grading fees so $83/4 or $21 a card, VCP has a 6 at $17 a 7 at $35 and an 8 at $87, got an 7 so I make $15)
9 1 14997080 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS HARMON KILLEBREW Card US (Purchased a lot of 10 of these for $85, sold off the lower graded ones for $50 so into clemente mays koufax and the killebrew for 35 plus 48 in grading fees so $83/4 or $21 a card, VCP has a 7 at $25 and an 8 at $77 and I'm sure a nine would have gone over $200, another I was shooting for the 9, got an 8 so I make $57)
10 1 14997081 GOOD 2 1962 POST CANADIAN 173 ROBERTO CLEMENTE HAND CUT Card US (Purchased for attempt at PSA 3 for registry, will sell and should lose $8)
11 1 14997082 EXCELLENT-MINT 6 1972 MILTON BRADLEY ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
12 1 14997083 VERY GOOD-EXCELLENT 4 1966 TOPPS RUB-OFFS BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Paid $15 plus grading 12 so into for $27, last 4 sold for $33 per vcp so profit $5)
12 2 14997084 EXCELLENT-MINT 6 1966 TOPPS RUB-OFFS BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Paid $25 plus grading 12 so into for $37, no sales in over a year but I should make $20+)
13 1 14997085 POOR 1 1968 ATLANTIC OIL PLAY BALL GAME-HAND CUT ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
14 1 14997086 N0: AUTHENTIC 1961 POST CEREAL 132 BOB CLEMENTE PERFORATED Card US (no idea here this was a recrack and submit from a 9 (oc), still think it should be an 8)
16 1 14997088 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1969 TOPPS STAMPS BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set but paid $12 add grading of 12 and im into for $24, this is a 1 of 3 with only 1 higher, It would sell for a bunch, I would guess $200)
17 1 14997089 EXCELLENT 5 1964 WHEATIES STAMPS ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Paid $108 plus grading of 12 so into for $120, I really though this had a shot at an 8 or 9, VCP has the only one a 5 selling for $178, I would put a 7 at $250 and an 8 at $500, I would make $50 bucks but considering a resub instead for chance at a lot more)
18 1 14997090 EXCELLENT-MINT 6 1961 POST CEREAL 145 WILLIE MAYS PERFORATED Card US (Paid $72 plus grading of 12 so into for $84, again another I really though this had a shot at an 8 or 9 and I got hammered, VCP has the only one a 6 selling for $89, I would put a 7 at $150 and the last 8 sold for $277, I would make $5 bucks but considering a resub too)
19 1 14997091 EXCELLENT 5 1971 BAZOOKA NO NUMBER ROBERTO CLEMENTE HAND CUT Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
20 1 14997092 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 OC 1965 O-PEE-CHEE 2 N.L. BATTING LEADER CLEMENTE/CARTY/AARON Card US (Paid $32 plus fees 12 so into for $44, was hoping for a 7, pop on the card is highest graded a 7 with a pop of 2 so I got close, I have a private buyer of this at $150 so profit of $106)
21 1 14997093 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1965 O-PEE-CHEE 160 BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Jackpot!!!!!, Highest graded 1 of 7, In my mind the whole sub rode on this card, Paid $371 for card and total with sub $385, I know someone who paid 1k 6 months ago for this card)
P&L (excluding 65 opc) - $611
Extra grading fees for registry set cards 8 x $12 = $96
Final P & L (excluding 65 opc) = $515
Now that said this was one of my worst subs from the last 20 or so I have done, i didnt hit one 9 and had many I though should have hit 8, the only saving grace was the last card. I dont know maybe I expect too much or have just been on a good roll for a couple years but this sub has me worried, also note no half grades. I normally make a lot more on my subs.
What do you think?
With a sub I plan for some losses but hope to hit more on the plus side to more than make up for it. There is a vegas side to some submissions, score a low pop in high grades and make some nice cash, the other side is sometimes the grades just dont go your way. Sub goals were- I really wanted to sell a number of cards to cover my grading fees (cards listed as for registry set) and felt I had a good shot at making big money on a card or two-
1 1 14997071 VERY GOOD-EXCELLENT 4 1965 BAZOOKA 14 BOB CLEMENTE HAND CUT-BATTING Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
2 1 14997072 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1971 MILK DUDS ROBERTO CLEMENTE HAND CUT Card US (Paid $199 for complete box to try for an 8, got a 6 as a box so cut and resubmitted total cost with grading fees $230, VCP has a 7 going for $95, an 8 at $195 and a 9 at $1200, I figured my downside was $130 loss if I hit a 7, a $30 loss if I got an 8 and a $870 profit if I hit a 9, I will take those odds any day, I got an 8 so only cost me $30 for the try)
3 1 14997073 GOOD 2 1971 TOPPS TATTOOS PERFORATED ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
4 1 14997074 NEAR MINT 7 1962 TOPPS 160 DICK STUART Card US (found in a box of old cards in closet, would have made big money hitting an 8, vcp 7 at $30 so Profit of $18)
5 1 14997075 VERY GOOD 3 1965 TOPPS TRANSFERS BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
6 1 14997076 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Purchased a lot of 10 of these for $85, sold off the lower graded ones for $50 so into clemente mays koufax and the killebrew for 35 plus 48 in grading fees so $83/4 or $21 a card, VCP has a 7 at $36 and an 8 at $187 and Im sure a 9 would sell for $700+, got an 8 so a $166 profit)
6 2 14997077 EXCELLENT 5 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (paid $9 plus 12 so into for $21, had hoped for a 6+ but I vcp has 5 at $21 so breakeven)
7 1 14997078 EXCELLENT-MINT 6 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS WILLIE MAYS Card US ((Purchased a lot of 10 of these for $85, sold off the lower graded ones for $50 so into clemente mays koufax and the killebrew for 35 plus 48 in grading fees so $83/4 or $21 a card, VCP has a 6 at $20 and im sure a 7 at $40+ , got an 6 so I lose $1)
8 1 14997079 NEAR MINT 7 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS SANDY KOUFAX Card US (Purchased a lot of 10 of these for $85, sold off the lower graded ones for $50 so into clemente mays koufax and the killebrew for 35 plus 48 in grading fees so $83/4 or $21 a card, VCP has a 6 at $17 a 7 at $35 and an 8 at $87, got an 7 so I make $15)
9 1 14997080 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1963 TOPPS PEEL-OFFS HARMON KILLEBREW Card US (Purchased a lot of 10 of these for $85, sold off the lower graded ones for $50 so into clemente mays koufax and the killebrew for 35 plus 48 in grading fees so $83/4 or $21 a card, VCP has a 7 at $25 and an 8 at $77 and I'm sure a nine would have gone over $200, another I was shooting for the 9, got an 8 so I make $57)
10 1 14997081 GOOD 2 1962 POST CANADIAN 173 ROBERTO CLEMENTE HAND CUT Card US (Purchased for attempt at PSA 3 for registry, will sell and should lose $8)
11 1 14997082 EXCELLENT-MINT 6 1972 MILTON BRADLEY ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
12 1 14997083 VERY GOOD-EXCELLENT 4 1966 TOPPS RUB-OFFS BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Paid $15 plus grading 12 so into for $27, last 4 sold for $33 per vcp so profit $5)
12 2 14997084 EXCELLENT-MINT 6 1966 TOPPS RUB-OFFS BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Paid $25 plus grading 12 so into for $37, no sales in over a year but I should make $20+)
13 1 14997085 POOR 1 1968 ATLANTIC OIL PLAY BALL GAME-HAND CUT ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
14 1 14997086 N0: AUTHENTIC 1961 POST CEREAL 132 BOB CLEMENTE PERFORATED Card US (no idea here this was a recrack and submit from a 9 (oc), still think it should be an 8)
16 1 14997088 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1969 TOPPS STAMPS BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set but paid $12 add grading of 12 and im into for $24, this is a 1 of 3 with only 1 higher, It would sell for a bunch, I would guess $200)
17 1 14997089 EXCELLENT 5 1964 WHEATIES STAMPS ROBERTO CLEMENTE Card US (Paid $108 plus grading of 12 so into for $120, I really though this had a shot at an 8 or 9, VCP has the only one a 5 selling for $178, I would put a 7 at $250 and an 8 at $500, I would make $50 bucks but considering a resub instead for chance at a lot more)
18 1 14997090 EXCELLENT-MINT 6 1961 POST CEREAL 145 WILLIE MAYS PERFORATED Card US (Paid $72 plus grading of 12 so into for $84, again another I really though this had a shot at an 8 or 9 and I got hammered, VCP has the only one a 6 selling for $89, I would put a 7 at $150 and the last 8 sold for $277, I would make $5 bucks but considering a resub too)
19 1 14997091 EXCELLENT 5 1971 BAZOOKA NO NUMBER ROBERTO CLEMENTE HAND CUT Card US (Not for resale for Clemente Master set)
20 1 14997092 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 OC 1965 O-PEE-CHEE 2 N.L. BATTING LEADER CLEMENTE/CARTY/AARON Card US (Paid $32 plus fees 12 so into for $44, was hoping for a 7, pop on the card is highest graded a 7 with a pop of 2 so I got close, I have a private buyer of this at $150 so profit of $106)
21 1 14997093 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1965 O-PEE-CHEE 160 BOB CLEMENTE Card US (Jackpot!!!!!, Highest graded 1 of 7, In my mind the whole sub rode on this card, Paid $371 for card and total with sub $385, I know someone who paid 1k 6 months ago for this card)
P&L (excluding 65 opc) - $611
Extra grading fees for registry set cards 8 x $12 = $96
Final P & L (excluding 65 opc) = $515
Now that said this was one of my worst subs from the last 20 or so I have done, i didnt hit one 9 and had many I though should have hit 8, the only saving grace was the last card. I dont know maybe I expect too much or have just been on a good roll for a couple years but this sub has me worried, also note no half grades. I normally make a lot more on my subs.
What do you think?
0
Comments
thanks
John
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
T222's PSA 1 or better
One other thing on cards I might flip, I set a price thats a good deal for it and stick to it in my snipe vs a card I want in my collection I will usually pay more and sometimes x2 or x3 of vcp to get it.
jim