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a call to arms
zeek
Posts: 397
eBay itself is already scarring off its customers, they own paypal now so together they roughly charge 20 percent of all sales. Is there another(cheaper) auction site that includes many members? I was checking out www.bidville.com but I don't know the population of members or how well it works .The listing seemed go be many but skimpy. Why doesn't numismatic sellers blackball/shrike eBay, by not listing on eBay(find another site), until lower prices are set? Would this not be the time, during a recession?
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Try CoinZip.com in the meantime. They're starting to get alot of traffic. Free listing, free selling, free everything until next year. Then it's only like $3.99/month.
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
RJ
<< <i>I'll third CoinZip.................
Motion carried.
<< <i>Is there another(cheaper) auction site that includes many members? >>
No.
People are working on it but none are anywhere close yet. For contenders, CoinZip.com and ILikeCoins.com are often mentioned on these forums along with the BST forum.
<< <i>Why doesn't numismatic sellers blackball/shrike eBay, by not listing on eBay(find another site), until lower prices are set? >>
Some are doing this and some are staying.
<< <i>Would this not be the time, during a recession? >>
Let's see, a recession hits and a dealer needs to put food on the table. The dealer moves his auctions to other venues that may get fewer buyers and/or lower realized prices. Would this be good for the dealer?
When it gets to the point where it is more expensive on eBay than other venue's, a dealer really needs to pay attention.
The name is LEE!
But they are still the only Real game in town
Where else can you sell to the world
I hate that they raised there fees, and I don't use ebay much
But when I have that certian item that doesn't sell, It seems to on ebay
Coinzip is a nice try, but it needs to get much bigger to really compete
<< <i>eBay itself is already scarring off its customers, they own paypal now so together they roughly charge 20 percent of all sales. Is there another(cheaper) auction site that includes many members? I was checking out www.bidville.com but I don't know the population of members or how well it works .The listing seemed go be many but skimpy. Why doesn't numismatic sellers blackball/shrike eBay, by not listing on eBay(find another site), until lower prices are set? Would this not be the time, during a recession? >>
How do you come up with 20%?
"How do you come up with 20%?">>
"eBay " "now" "owns" "paypal" "together they roughly charge 20 percent of all sales."
I sold on ebay last year, we just did our taxes so the numbers are fesh in my mind, BURNING is more like it. ebay nabbed about 11% of my sales and paypal got about 3%
A lot of the percentage has to do with what type of selling you are doing. NO RESERVE starting at .99 will be the least expensive for 2 reasons, 1. lower insertion fee & 2. higher percent of completed sales.
If you list only store items I bet your fees could get up close to 20% with the "New FEES"
<< <i>I'm ashamed to admit it but..........
I sold on ebay last year, we just did our taxes so the numbers are fesh in my mind, BURNING is more like it. ebay nabbed about 11% of my sales and paypal got about 3%
A lot of the percentage has to do with what type of selling you are doing. NO RESERVE starting at .99 will be the least expensive for 2 reasons, 1. lower insertion fee & 2. higher percent of completed sales.
If you list only store items I bet your fees could get up close to 20% with the "New FEES" >>
I'm just a little fish without feet. eBay killed any desire to run a coin business through their venue.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>"eBay " "now" "owns" "paypal" "together they roughly charge 20 percent of all sales." >>
Not even close. On a $100 sale:
eBay fees - $4.97
PayPal fees - $2.50
Total of $7.47, or less that 7.5%.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>"eBay " "now" "owns" "paypal" "together they roughly charge 20 percent of all sales." >>
Not even close. On a $100 sale:
eBay fees - $4.97
PayPal fees - $2.50
Total of $7.47, or less that 7.5%.
Russ, NCNE >>
Thanks for some clarity Russ!
<< <i>OK I looked. I had a sale for 227.25 and paypal took 7.10, thats way more than 2.5 percent 3.2 to 3.3 and with eBay fees; are you including Final Sales Fee and the listing >>
Yes, I included everything. But, I forgot that my PayPal fees are lower. Let's look at yours:
eBay fees - $9.42.
PayPal fees - $7.10.
Total of $16.52, or 7.27%. Nowhere near the 20% you claimed.
Russ, NCNE
eBay fees - $4.97
PayPal fees - $2.50
Total of $7.47, or less that 7.5%.
You're also assuming the best case scenario. If the starting price is higher, and you add a few basic features like a scheduled start and a BIN, the percentage is higher. A $10-15 item can easily approach 20% in combined fees.
<< <i>You're also assuming the best case scenario. If the starting price is higher, and you add a few basic features like a scheduled start and a BIN, the percentage is higher. A $10-15 item can easily approach 20% in combined fees. >>
If somebody is loading up on features for a $10 to $15 item they probably ought to re-think their business plan.
Russ, NCNE
It will be a long time before e-bay stops being the main place to be. As soon as the complaining period is over everything will go back to normal.
Ebay gives you worldwide exposure in a convinent format for both sellers and buyers.
Paypal gives you instant payment from anyone in the world, and with my Debit card I can draw the cash out of the ATM in seconds.
Nothing is free. But some things are worth the money, and I feel ebay is.
<< <i>
<< <i>OK I looked. I had a sale for 227.25 and paypal took 7.10, thats way more than 2.5 percent 3.2 to 3.3 and with eBay fees; are you including Final Sales Fee and the listing >>
Yes, I included everything. But, I forgot that my PayPal fees are lower. Let's look at yours:
eBay fees - $9.42.
PayPal fees - $7.10.
Total of $16.52, or 7.27%. Nowhere near the 20% you claimed.
Russ, NCNE >>
I guess the OP did not major in math.
I didn't say anything about loading up. The two options I mentioned are $.10 each. I'm just saying that if you look at the average fee burden, it's less than 20%, but definitely more than 7%.
<< <i>eBay itself is already scarring off its customers, they own paypal now so together they roughly charge 20 percent of all sales. Is there another(cheaper) auction site that includes many members? I was checking out www.bidville.com but I don't know the population of members or how well it works .The listing seemed go be many but skimpy. Why doesn't numismatic sellers blackball/shrike eBay, by not listing on eBay(find another site), until lower prices are set? Would this not be the time, during a recession? >>
If the fees were the same, and ebay did NOT own paypal, would you still care about it like you do now?
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>If somebody is loading up on features for a $10 to $15 item they probably ought to re-think their business plan.
I didn't say anything about loading up. The two options I mentioned are $.10 each. I'm just saying that if you look at the average fee burden, it's less than 20%, but definitely more than 7%. >>
In an email conversation with a friend yesterday:
Paypal takes 2.8% plus 30 cents for each transaction.
eBay has an insertion fee and a final value fee.
Insertion fee under $10 is 25 cents final value fee is
8.75% of final value up to $25, then it switches.
Their fees are running everyone away, including me!
on a $9.99 item you pay .25 to insert it and .88 if it
sells for $10, then pay paypal .58. Fees equal $1.71
or over 17%
and the owner of paypal or eBay is besides the point.
CoinZip and ILikeCoins are good alternatives. As long as they can hold tight, the traffic will start to come their way. In fact, I think niche auction sites like these have tremendous potential. eBay will be the Goliath for online auctions, but major genres of collecting (coins being one of the biggest) have enough of a market to sustain a niche site. It's just a matter of time before these sites build up enough traffic, registered users, and most importantly enough buyers and sellers that collectors consider it as a viable alternative to listing or shopping on eBay.
Total Copper Nutcase - African, British Ships, Channel Islands!!!
'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup'
<< <i>hey zeek - that's the whole idea - they really want to get rid of the sellers who routinely run items at less than $25 so that they can get rid of the image of being an online garage sale and cultivaate a more refined and up-scale image. >>
what percentage of their auctions end 25 bucks and under ?
Well that's the problem zeek, eBay seems to be trying to discourage the $10 items. If you're going to sell items for under $10 on eBay, you need to have already locked on to a profit after subtracting eBay and PayPal fees. It takes a little bit of the sting out of the higher fees.
Total Copper Nutcase - African, British Ships, Channel Islands!!!
'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup'
<< <i>i don't know what the percentages are for the under $25 auctions. I'm not sure that ebay has ever published that info. the general idea tho is that they make 80% of thier money from the top 20% of the sellers so if they can get rid of the overhead (servers, support, man power, etc) of a portion of the rest, then the lost revenue will not make a dent in the bottom line. >>
But it will make a dent in how a lot of former sellers of lesser value items feel about the site, perhaps they don't care about that now but
it could come back to bite them in the future.
<< <i> I'm hopping to simply sell sac and Kennedy sets for pocket change(10 a pc),
Well that's the problem zeek, eBay seems to be trying to discourage the $10 items. If you're going to sell items for under $10 on eBay, you need to have already locked on to a profit after subtracting eBay and PayPal fees. It takes a little bit of the sting out of the higher fees. >>
Thnx for the info
<< <i>Russ, can you agree that eBay does highjack sellers? >>
Uh, no. eBay management does many annoying things, but any seller is free to adapt or leave. It's a voluntary relationship.
<< <i>Paypal takes 2.8% plus 30 cents for each transaction.
eBay has an insertion fee and a final value fee.
Insertion fee under $10 is 25 cents final value fee is
8.75% of final value up to $25, then it switches.
Their fees are running everyone away, including me!
on a $9.99 item you pay .25 to insert it and .88 if it
sells for $10, then pay paypal .58. Fees equal $1.71
or over 17% >>
If all one is selling is $10 items then, again, one should re-think their business plan. For example, instead of starting the auction at $10, start it at 99c and cut the insertion fee by 60%. Or, group items together. Or, throw some higher value items in the mix.
Bottom line is that for the exposure eBay provides, the bang for the buck cannot be equaled anywhere else.
Russ, NCNE
For instance:
Sally sells sea shells down by the sea shore
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>eBay itself is already scarring off its customers, they own paypal now so together they roughly charge 20 percent of all sales. Is there another(cheaper) auction site that includes many members? I was checking out www.bidville.com but I don't know the population of members or how well it works .The listing seemed go be many but skimpy. Why doesn't numismatic sellers blackball/shrike eBay, by not listing on eBay(find another site), until lower prices are set? Would this not be the time, during a recession? >>
Is 20% correct? The last time I added it up I got 10%. Have they doubled their fees?
<< <i>Is 20% correct? The last time I added it up I got 10%. Have they doubled their fees? >>
No, it isn't correct.
<< <i>When I went to school, class of `88 and 95 BS, and used the term "roughly charge 20 percent" in statement, it would mean 20% is estimated. >>
An estimate, by definition, means an effort to come in somewhere near the realm of reality. Your own example of a $227 sale was about 1/3rd of your "estimate".
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>An estimate, by definition, means an effort to come in somewhere near the realm of reality. Your own example of a $227 sale was about 1/3rd of your "estimate".
Russ, NCNE >>
Excuse me Russ. I claimed to have sold an item for 227.25 and paypal took 7.10 that is 3.2 to 3.3; I gave these two percentages because the true percentage can not be rounded but it's closer to 3.2. I never once said "estimated" or "roughly" in the mentioned reply. As I recall you stated paypal charges 2.5 percent, but then you quickly acknowledged your error[(that you have a lesser fee) why is that?], I'm fine with that. And the correct answer is yes and no, in some cases eBay/paypal charges up to 20% for sellers as discussed in this thread.. This is my last reply on this thread and quite possibly my last post. I'm sick and tired of explaining myself, defending myself and having everything I write disfigured and distorted just like with RCC and it' member's maturity/mentality levels. God forbid a misspelling!
<< <i>I'm sick and tired of explaining myself, defending myself and having everything I write disfigured and distorted just like with RCC and it' member's maturity/mentality levels >>
You wrote:
"eBay " "now" "owns" "paypal" "together they roughly charge 20 percent of all sales."
How is noting the innacuracy of your assertion "distorting" what you've written?
Russ, NCNE
Now granted, the darkside auctions attract a different kind of attention that US coins. However, another forum (Google, Yahoo, Coinzip, etc) has a long ways to go before sellers can have the confidence that a large enough audience is watching. Its all about maximizing the selling dollar for me. Despite ebays fees, its still the only answer.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>Here we go again! If you return to my OP youwill see those words I quoted used, I did this to clarify my post to another idiot replier who can't understand words with more than 5 or 6 letters(I know "together" has 7). He too was putting words in or out of my OP Is this clear to you or do I need to write another 250 word paragraph to clear this up? I think you should just carefully reread the whole thread as I need/get a beer..., a shot... and a joint. >>
Why don't you just admit you were WRONG?
Nov thru Jan my ebay and PP fees were 6.5 % granted I sold some higher priced items but usually my fees are aroud 7-8%. In my opinion a very cheap price for the venue.
Joe
I have a lot of low cost stuff in modest volume that I'd like to move. I tried ebay last year and sold mostly mint packaged coins of various dates, some proof sets and some commems. I'm not so disappointed with the fees so much as I am with the ROI.
By the numbers:
I sold 26 offerings including 30+ items that cost me about $700.
I realized a hammer price around $630. Already losing $70 but the positive cash flow is not a bad thing.
I paid ebay costs = $57 (about 9% of the hammer price)
I paid PayPal costs = $27 (another 4.25% of hammer price)
Total fees = +13% of hammer price. Not bad compared to B&Ms. Keep in mind I'm not in business. These guys probably need around 40% on average to cover costs and enough to earn a decent income!
My total revenue including SH&I was $760 and my total cost including fees + SH&I but excluding packaging, and personal costs to stuff, drive to the USPS office and mail was $180 or about 24% of my total revenue.
For what it's worth I've solicited advice from Russ and others here on the CU boards about doing business on ebay. In my first try I've lost $112 or 14% of my original "investment" but my costs IMHO are still significantly below a B&M dealer cost. Granted I paid collector prices for my sales and not dealer prices.
In my scenario I believe that my costs are significantly below dealer B&M costs and so as I see it ebay is a low-cost alternative to reach millions of potential buyers even if I haven't achieved my goal.
I chock this up to learning experience and experience is an invaluable lesson.
I will consider a differnt mixture of low-priced offerings in the future combined with some better material for a higher return.
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Proud recipient of two "You Suck" awards