Will McGwire get more support this year?

frankhardy · January 3, 2008 10:21PM

I was just wondering if some are changing there minds about McGwire since SO many, including pitchers, were doing PED's. Do y'all think his support will increase or decrease this year from his 23% last year. We will know January 8th. I tend to think his support will increase a little. I hope so. It's a tough call.

storm888 · January 3, 2008 10:30PM

Actually, I suspect it will be harder to defend dishonesty
this year than it was last year.

Ten-years from now, the scandal will be divided into
two-sets of players; those who told the truth, and those
who lied.

I can make a fair case that steroid-use is an issue of
"personal choice." I don't know how to defend folks
who continue to lie about their own personal choices.

Ironmanfan · January 3, 2008 10:55PM

I actually think McGwire will get less support than he got in '07

shagrotn77 · January 3, 2008 10:57PM

He'll get a little more support this year. You can bank on it.

jdip9 · January 3, 2008 10:59PM

He'll be between 20 and 30% once again.

BobaFett72 · January 3, 2008 11:06PM

Hopefully he falls far short and continues to do until the day he dies. Not that I hate the guy, I just dont think he goes into the HOF. I strongly believe that any and all juicers need to come clean and be honest to have even the slightest whiff of the HOF. None of this half-assed, I only took HGH one time, I smoked but I didnt inhale crap that they are trying to spin for us. Grow some stones and man-up chumps!

fandango · January 3, 2008 11:56PM

storm888 where you been, on a year long vacation?

Bosox1976 · January 4, 2008 12:00AM

He'd be wise to admit what he did. People's opinions start to change only after seeing some contrition. He could argue that much of his PED use was before they were specifically banned, and that point may be valid. That said, HOF voters are pretty old school - and having old school records broken by cheaters and loopholers may never sit well with them.

samspop · January 4, 2008 12:00AM

Very few "juicers" will ever come completely clean. Most will say something to the effect of..."I tried it one or two times, but I didn't think it was right, so I didn't do it again." This vague statement will admit their guilt, but make them also look like a victim of the "Steroid Era". The records will stand, baseball will hopefully clean itself up, and 10, 15, or 20 years from now, we will all look back on this as what it is, "The Steroid Era" in baseball. So much emphasis is given to the sluggers, but there is no way to pin everyone down who did this and convict them all. All positions are guilty, including pitchers, so the game has been skewed for the last 15-20 years. There are some records from this era that my never be broken, but, you can't take them away just because of when they happened or who accomplished them...for the most part, you can't even asterisk them. The 60's were "The Greenie Era", the 80's-90's were "The Steroid Era", and early 2000's were "The HGH era". Where do the asterisks begin and end???

I, as a baseball fan, just want to see the game cleaned up and want to enjoy the game again without a judging eye. It is still a GREAT game!

shagrotn77 · January 4, 2008 12:10AM

<< I, as a baseball fan, just want to see the game cleaned up and want to enjoy the game again without a judging eye. It is still a GREAT game! >>

In order for the game to be clean again, we need to get HGH out of it. It's funny how so many people think baseball is clean now and it's so so not. Supposedly they're working on a new test for HGH. Hopefully it'll be finished soon. I'm sure there's quite a few players still on HGH who will continue do so until they're at risk for being caught.

jmbkb4 · January 4, 2008 12:12AM

Will steroids/etc. being in the headline news the past few weeks, I can't imagine McGwire will get much support again this year.

God, he was such a fool in front of Congress.

WinPitcher · January 4, 2008 12:18AM

I think he gets less this yr. With that said, suppose he garners only 5% of the vote, is he allowed to remain on the ballot? Or is that requiremnet only for the first yr to remain on the ballot?

Anyone know? That would be a real slap in the face if it his taken off the ballot because he does not have the % needed.

Steve

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 12:24AM

see my personal tagline "Roids or no Roids, you still gotta put the bat on the ball" Every single one of us could take roids every single day and I guarentee you that not one of us would hit the ball out of the infield against a true MLB pitcher.

jmbkb4 · January 4, 2008 12:26AM

<< see my personal tagline "Roids or no Roids, you still gotta put the bat on the ball" Every single one of us could take roids every single day and I guarentee you that not one of us would hit the ball out of the infield against a true MLB pitcher. >>

I guess we may never know whether that is true. Regardless, Bonds' statistics exploded when he started juicing. No one can deny or refute that.

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 12:28AM

Bonds still would of broke the record. He has the sweetest swing in the game.

BobaFett72 · January 4, 2008 12:32AM

BOnds would NOT have broken the HR record, the single season nor the career mark of AAron.

shagrotn77 · January 4, 2008 12:32AM

<< God, he was such a fool in front of Congress. >>

I completely disagree, and I don't understand why so many people feel this way. If you want to talk about looking foolish in front of Congress, look at Palmeiro or Sosa. McGwire was the only one of the three not to sit there and lie through his teeth. By refusing to talk about the past, we all know what he was saying. Did you want him to come out and say he did steroids, and make millions of naive people think he was one of the only ones who did? The only way that would fly is if he outed dozens of other guys and said "all of them did it too". He's got too much class for that.

There was no reason for McGwire to be a martyr at the time. If he admitted to doing steroids now, yes I think that would be a good move. We all basicaly know he did them and was far from alone. But to go before Congress and be the only one to admit to using steroids would have been a terrible decision. So he did the next best thing. He didn't lie, or do any finger wagging, or forget how to speak English.

He's no fool.

jmbkb4 · January 4, 2008 12:34AM

Ummmm, he could have just friggin' stayed home that day.

Look at the results. Sosa has a better chance of him than getting in.

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 12:35AM

Sure he would of. Why would'nt he have?? It's not like he was only hitting warning track dingers before he supposedly took roids. IF he took them, they only increased his distances. He still had the power to hit homers. Go back and look at footage when he first came into the league. Those homeruns werent exactly weak.

jmbkb4 · January 4, 2008 12:36AM

<< Sure he would of. Why would'nt he have?? It's not like he was only hitting warning track dingers before he supposedly took roids. IF he took them, they only increased his distances. He still had the power to hit homers. Go back and look at footage when he first came into the league. Those homeruns werent exactly weak. >>

so, why did he juice then?

Is having a gigantic, bulbous head fashionable now??

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 12:38AM

IF he did them...he got greedy and I believe wanted to simply hit the ball farther than anyone else in the league. A homer is a homer no matter if it goes 400ft or 550ft, but which ones get more attention??? Which ones are showed on Sportscenter more???

stown · January 4, 2008 12:40AM

I think he will be at or below where he was last year.

Between being a one-dimensional player and Congress testimony, I don't see him ever getting into the Hall.

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 12:41AM

IF he did them, it was becuase he got greedy and I belive wanted to be recoginzed for his distance. A homerun is a homerun weather it goes 380ft down the line or 550ft. Which ones do they show more on Sportscenter though??? People are memorized by long distance homeruns. The normal..average..homeruns are going out of style. He still would have hit them all.....just not as far.

zippy · January 4, 2008 12:42AM

HE WILL RECEIVE LESS VOTES
He's a loser & the HOF doesn't need the likes of him in there

MeteoriteGuy · January 4, 2008 12:46AM

He will get more votes. Writers were making a statement, they will likely again, but not as many of them.

Mark

lsutigers1973 · January 4, 2008 1:17AM

I quit collecting cards in about '92. The only cards I kept were rookies of Bonds. It wasn't because I was some great prognosticator. It was because he was the best and was usually healthy. Yes, he was a first ballot HOF'er w/o roids. As far as McGwire goes, I started back collecting in '98 becasue of him. So, for that at least, I thank him.

DrJ · January 4, 2008 1:30AM

<< IF he did them, it was becuase he got greedy and I belive wanted to be recoginzed for his distance. A homerun is a homerun weather it goes 380ft down the line or 550ft. Which ones do they show more on Sportscenter though??? People are memorized by long distance homeruns. The normal..average..homeruns are going out of style. He still would have hit them all.....just not as far. >>

This just does not justify a response, but all I will say is you need to take a historical look at the frequency of 50 HR season (not to mention 60 and 70 HR seasons) before steroids became vogue. The 90's and early 00's totally shattered all past trends.

J

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 1:34AM

Does not matter. Bonds still would have broke the record. Bonds was that special of a player. What he did hurt his legacy no doubt. He would be in a much better situation had he not have taken roids, because he would STILL hold the record and there would be no asterick. He did it to himself no doubt, I am just saying he did not have to do roids to break the records. He was that special of a player.

artistlost · January 4, 2008 1:38AM

I was taking a look at his stats...and with out the homeruns he's nothing special...just a one trick pony...should he be hall worthy steriods scandal or not? I'm not too sure.

mathew

BobaFett72 · January 4, 2008 1:40AM

those roids and HGH et. al. helped bobblehead barry recover faster, heal faster. He would have missed significant time and would have probably been out of the game well before he broke the record.

DrJ · January 4, 2008 1:47AM

<< Does not matter. Bonds still would have broke the record. Bonds was that special of a player. What he did hurt his legacy no doubt. He would be in a much better situation had he not have taken roids, because he would STILL hold the record and there would be no asterick. He did it to himself no doubt, I am just saying he did not have to do roids to break the records. He was that special of a player. >>

Do you think the steroids and HGH may have had a little to do with his longevity?

J

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 1:52AM

Maybe a little. Not enough to hold him back from that record though. Even without roids and HGH, advances in medicine and science have made it a lot easier to come back from injuries faster these days than back in the 70's 80's and 90's

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 1:55AM

Also look at the Intentional walks. Barry has 607, Aaron is 2nd with 293. That is a extra 314 at bats that Aaron had just from Int. walks.

baseballfanatic · January 4, 2008 2:00AM

Isnt it something that when baseball came up with the new steroid penalties in 2005, Bonds missed the first 6 months of the season? Coincidence?
His numbers for the last 3 years are where they would have been earlier if not for the help he received.
You can throw the years 2000 to 2004 in the dumper.

A guy that averages over 140 games a year all of a sudden comes down with an injury when they start testing for steroids, and has averaged .270 and 27 homers since?

C'mon

Get real

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 2:06AM

Sorry guys....no one will ever change my mind. Barry is simply the best homerun hitter and feared hitter to ever put on a uniform. He is one of the only players I paid big bucks for a good seat when he came to Chicago. Hitting a baseball is the hardest thing to do in sports. None of us could ever hit a homerun in a big league park off a major league pitcher if we took all the HGH and roids in the world.

DrJ · January 4, 2008 2:21AM

<< Maybe a little. Not enough to hold him back from that record though. Even without roids and HGH, advances in medicine and science have made it a lot easier to come back from injuries faster these days than back in the 70's 80's and 90's >>

He only beat Aaron's record by 7 HR, and is likely never to play again. So you are saying HGH and Roids only added less than 1 good month to his career to allow him to surpass Aaron. Hmmmmmm.

J

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 2:25AM

Who knows...I am just stuck on my opinion of him. He is a dirtbag person to the media and fans, and he may have taken HGH or roids, but I still love his swing, his eye, and his pure intimidation at the plate.

BobaFett72 · January 4, 2008 3:46AM

Sorry guys....no one will ever change my mind. Barry is simply the best homerun hitter and feared hitter to ever put on a uniform"

clearly, you have drunk the bonds kool-aid, and thats fine.

" Beginning in 1998 with injections in his buttocks of Winstrol, a powerful steroid"

He was already the best player in the game, but not the best HR hitter in the game...he was envious of the attention given to McGwire and Sosa, poor widdle barry...aww. His records and his legacy are forever tainted.

"by 2001, when Bonds broke Mark McGwire's single-season home-run record (70) by belting 73, Bonds was using two designer steroids referred to as the Cream and the Clear, as well as insulin, human growth hormone, testosterone decanoate (a fast-acting steroid known as Mexican beans) and trenbolone, a steroid created to improve the muscle quality of cattle.

BALCO tracked Bonds' usage with doping calendars and folders -- detailing drugs, quantities, intervals and Bonds' testosterone levels -- that wound up in the hands of federal agents upon their Sept. 3, 2003 raid of the Burlingame, Calif., business.

Depending on the substance, Bonds used the drugs in virtually every conceivable form: injecting himself with a syringe or being injected by his trainer, Greg Anderson, swallowing pills, placing drops of liquid under his tongue, and, in the case of BALCO's notorious testosterone-based cream, applying it topically.

According to the book, Bonds gulped as many as 20 pills at a time and was so deeply reliant on his regimen that he ordered Anderson to start "cycles" -- a prescribed period of steroid use lasting about three weeks -- even when he was not due to begin one. Steroid users typically stop usage for a week or two periodically to allow the body to continue to produce natural testosterone; otherwise, such production diminishes or ceases with the continued introduction of synthetic forms of the muscle-building hormone.

Bonds called for the re-starting of cycles when he felt his energy and power start to drop. If Anderson told Bonds he was not due for another cycle, the authors write, Bonds would tell him, "F--- off, I'll do it myself.''

In moving pictures...

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 4:00AM

So your telling me that if you or I injected our bodies with all this stuff....that we could go out and hit bombs off of Justin Verlander with no problems huh? Don't you think that Bonds maybe...I dont know....has just a little bit of hitting talent? He RUINED his reputation as the best ever and that is clear, but he still has the talent to go out and know when to swing the freakin bat, how to tell what kind of pitch is coming, and tell if the pitch is a ball or strike. Maybe I will quit my job today and start taking some HGH because than I know for sure I can make it in Major League Baseball because obviously you don't need any talent at all to hit a baseball...you just need drugs.

BobaFett72 · January 4, 2008 4:29AM

Im fairly certain that your never-ending support of Bonds helps him sleep better through the night.

p.s. the greatest hitter of all time is Ted Williams and the greatest slugger of all time is Ruth or Aaron.

Bonds is a pretender to the throne

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 4:31AM

I guess that is the beauty of opinions

HighChopper · January 4, 2008 6:36AM

None of us could ever hit a homerun in a big league park off a major league pitcher if we took all the HGH and roids in the world.

How many hacks you gonna give me?

McGwire = Douche Bag.

Only way he'll see the Hall is by paying admission ... Just like the rest of us.

Bonds = "The Clear"

Knowingly broke the rules. Talented, sure, somewhat. Wish he'd just go away.

storm888 · January 4, 2008 7:03AM

"How many hacks you gonna give me?"

/////////////////////////////////

I was going to ask the same thing.

If I'd had the juice 35-years ago, I coulda' been a contender.

NickM · January 4, 2008 10:00AM

Bonds would hit 35 to 45 HR in a season pre HGH/steroids. Then, at an age when power is normally decreasing, he jumps to 73.

Sorry, whitesoxmike. That massive increase is not explainable without the drug coc-ktails turning 360 foot fly ball outs and line drive hits into 400 foot HRs. Even without the longevity-prolonging effects of his pharmacopeia, Bonds probably added at least 100 HR to his career total.

IMO McGwire will get some more support this year, but not much. 30% or so of the vote sounds about right.

Nick

grote15 · January 4, 2008 11:00AM

Does not matter. Bonds still would have broke the record. Bonds was that special of a player.

That statement reveals a total lack of knowledge about Bonds and the home run records he broke. There is NO WAY Bonds would have broken the single season HR record (he had never hit more than 50 homers in a season before juicing) or Aaron's record if he hadn't begun systematically injecting himself with performance enhancing drugs. Was he a HOFer before he started that crap? Yes, most definitely, and that's what's most unfortunate about it, IMO, that he was so envious of all the attention that McGwire and Sosa got in 1998 that he felt compelled to tarnish his legacy by cheating.

HighChopper · January 4, 2008 11:12AM

he was so envious of all the attention that McGwire and Sosa got in 1998 that he felt compelled to tarnish his legacy by cheating.

Great observation, Grote. Couldn't agree more.

bigfische · January 4, 2008 11:17AM

<< So your telling me that if you or I injected our bodies with all this stuff....that we could go out and hit bombs off of Justin Verlander with no problems huh? Don't you think that Bonds maybe...I dont know....has just a little bit of hitting talent? He RUINED his reputation as the best ever and that is clear, but he still has the talent to go out and know when to swing the freakin bat, how to tell what kind of pitch is coming, and tell if the pitch is a ball or strike. Maybe I will quit my job today and start taking some HGH because than I know for sure I can make it in Major League Baseball because obviously you don't need any talent at all to hit a baseball...you just need drugs. >>

What is your point here? That he could make contact either way? Contact hitters are a dime a dozen. You should get a seeing eye dog for your blindness.

bigfische · January 4, 2008 11:20AM

<< In moving pictures... >>

Its not even the body size here that stands out, it is that he had plastic surgery to become a bobble head doll in the 1997 off season. You can see it very well in this video.

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 12:40PM

<< Does not matter. Bonds still would have broke the record. Bonds was that special of a player.

That statement reveals a total lack of knowledge about Bonds and the home run records he broke. There is NO WAY Bonds would have broken the single season HR record (he had never hit more than 50 homers in a season before juicing) or Aaron's record if he hadn't begun systematically injecting himself with performance enhancing drugs. Was he a HOFer before he started that crap? Yes, most definitely, and that's what's most unfortunate about it, IMO, that he was so envious of all the attention that McGwire and Sosa got in 1998 that he felt compelled to tarnish his legacy by cheating. >>

This quote says it the best.
"Let me see your sorry (bleep) use steroids and hit that many homeruns. YOU CANT. Give the guy credit for what he has done. Look at all these other players that used steroids-Did they hit that many homers? No. How do you know that Babe Ruth didnt use steroids or Hank Aaron? You dont. Was it legal in baseball at the time? Yes. There was probably players that used steroids that never hit 10 homers. HONESTLY THOUGH, YOU NEED TO GET OVER IT ALREADY ... Honestly the Fresno Bee should be ashamed for even letting your dumb (bleep) write this article 'Bonds Shouldn't Be Making History'. Also you said most peoples power begans to weaken at age 35. uh key word MOST not ALL but MOST get that through your head. YOU ALSO NEED TO REALIZE HE IS THE BEST BASEBALL PLAYER THAT EVER LIVED PERIOD. I dont know if you are racist or what but come on. YOU ARE A (BLEEP) IDIOT! Get back to me if you want I dont give a (BLEEP)."

bigfische · January 4, 2008 12:53PM

<< 

<< Does not matter. Bonds still would have broke the record. Bonds was that special of a player.

That statement reveals a total lack of knowledge about Bonds and the home run records he broke. There is NO WAY Bonds would have broken the single season HR record (he had never hit more than 50 homers in a season before juicing) or Aaron's record if he hadn't begun systematically injecting himself with performance enhancing drugs. Was he a HOFer before he started that crap? Yes, most definitely, and that's what's most unfortunate about it, IMO, that he was so envious of all the attention that McGwire and Sosa got in 1998 that he felt compelled to tarnish his legacy by cheating. >>

This quote sais it the best.
"Let me see your sorry (bleep) use steroids and hit that many homeruns. YOU CANT. Give the guy credit for what he has done. Look at all these other players that used steroids-Did they hit that many homers? No. How do you know that Babe Ruth didnt use steroids or Hank Aaron? You dont. Was it legal in baseball at the time? Yes. There was probably players that used steroids that never hit 10 homers. HONESTLY THOUGH, YOU NEED TO GET OVER IT ALREADY ... Honestly the Fresno Bee should be ashamed for even letting your dumb (bleep) write this article 'Bonds Shouldn't Be Making History'. Also you said most peoples power begans to weaken at age 35. uh key word MOST not ALL but MOST get that through your head. YOU ALSO NEED TO REALIZE HE IS THE BEST BASEBALL PLAYER THAT EVER LIVED PERIOD. I dont know if you are racist or what but come on. YOU ARE A (BLEEP) IDIOT! Get back to me if you want I dont give a (BLEEP)." >>

Is that garbage your qoute, or did someone else say that?

whitesoxmike · January 4, 2008 12:55PM

Someone else said it but he is right

Will McGwire get more support this year?

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