Ebay is Really Just So F-d Up Right Now...
VamGuy
Posts: 1,624 ✭
<< <i>The auction-style listing was removed because it violated the eBay Counterfeit Currency and Stamps policy. All fees related to this listing have been credited to your account. We also notified members who placed bids on the item that the listing has been credited to your account. We also notified members who placed bids on the item that the listing has been canceled. >>
Since their violation letter does not include the actual reason for the removal of the listing, aside from informing me that my item is fraudulent or counterfeit And just to ensure that I lose future business, they notify all of the bidders that I'm a piece of countefeit selling scum.
The link below is an exact duplicate of the cancelled auction listing. Keep in mind that I had ponied up the extra $19.95 for Featured Plus on the auction that was cancelled! Apparently my violation was so severe that the geniuses at eBay decided they didn't want this money. Can somebody kindly tell me which regulation I am guilty of violating?!?!?!?!?!?!
LINK
0
Comments
Did you have Obv & Rev of the slab?
<< <i>Did you have Obv & Rev of the slab? >>
Bingo. You need a reverse slab photo.
fishy.
<< <i>Since their violation letter does not include the actual reason for the removal of the listing, aside from informing me that my item is fraudulent or counterfeit And just to ensure that I lose future business, they notify all of the bidders that I'm a piece of countefeit selling scum. >>
Put that way, it sounds like they're slandering your business. Where's Jackie Chiles when you need him?
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
<< <i>
<< <i>Did you have Obv & Rev of the slab? >>
Bingo. You need a reverse slab photo. >>
Seriously? A human being, whom we'll assume has a functioning brain, made a conscious & intentional decision to kick back a $21.10 listing fee, an estimated $30.00 final value fee, and a $33.00 paypal fee, a total of $84 in fees on a single coin sale, all because I don't have an image of the plastic around the reverse of the coin.
I guess the large image of the reverse of the coin was insufficient. And all this time I thought I was selling coins, not the backs of plastic coin holders.
PCGS, ANACS, & NGC Certified Coins on My Website.
<< <i>A human being, whom we'll assume has a functioning brain, made a conscious & intentional decision to kick back a $21.10 listing fee, an estimated $30.00 final value fee, and a $33.00 paypal fee, a total of $84 in fees on a single coin sale, all because I don't have an image of the plastic around the reverse of the coin. >>
Yep, that's it. Why would some eBay drone care about collecting fees? His boss told him that front and back pictures have to be there- he'd probably get in trouble if it was discovered he used some common sense and let the listing run. Besides, he's getting paid every Friday either way.
<< <i>Seriously? A human being, whom we'll assume has a functioning brain >>
No functioning brain involved. What we have here is a combination of some slimey eBayer with nothing better to do but report legit sellers, and an eBay drone who is incapable of logical thought.
Russ, NCNE
.......it sounds like they're slandering your business.
Interesting Point.
implemented this requirement. It is meant to help folks from being ripped from countefeit slabs. There are fake
PCGS slabs, been discussed here on this forum, that you can only tell if they are fake from the reverse of the slab.
It is a precaution and I think a good idea.
bob
<< <i>There is a very valid reason for pictures of the obverse and reverse of the entire slab. Ebay got imput before they
implemented this requirement. It is meant to help folks from being ripped from countefeit slabs. >>
True, but beside the point. Anybody possessed of a minimum amount of common sense could look at his auction and realize it's perfectly legit. Instead of immediately ending it and sending that generic and very poorly written boiler plate eMail, the eBay drone should be allowed to send a "heads up" eMail to the seller and leave the auction to run its course.
Russ, NCNE
folks that are just too susceptible (sp) to fake slabs and even fake coins. I'm with ebay on this one.
bob
<< <i>There is a very valid reason for pictures of the obverse and reverse of the entire slab. Ebay got imput before they implemented this requirement. It is meant to help folks from being ripped from countefeit slabs. >>
<< <i>Russ, good idea but ebay thought, in their own way, that this would solve the problem. Too many new folks that are just too susceptible (sp) to fake slabs and even fake coins. I'm with ebay on this one. >>
Bob, I would really like to let this slide, but your comments, and ebay's logic, are flawed.
As Russ so eloquently put it "Anybody possessed of a minimum amount of common sense could look at his auction and realize it's perfectly legit."
Bob, for years, I've provided large clear images of the obverse of the slab, as well as even larger, clearer images of the obverse and reverse of the coins that I sell. Yes, Bob, the actual coins. You know, those funny little discs that are stuck inside of those plastic slabs. My current imaging is better than more than 95% of all coin sellers on eBay. But my Featured Plus! auction was nuked for failing to include an image of the reverse of the plastic. Brilliant!
Below is a copy of the eBay regulation:
In addition, listings for certified coins: The listing must include an image of the item, showing the coin in its graded holder, front and back.
So let's list a slab under the new rules requiring a full obverse image of the slab and a full reverse image of the slab. The following images are well within the new & improved standards for a coin auction.
Perhaps you can't read the slab label because of the small size of the images and the low resolution. But that's not really my problem, I've properly displayed my slab within full compliance of eBay rules & regulations. Do you feel the warmth of protection it provides?
Tell me Bob, is it counterfeit? Does it look like somebody might have played with the images? In your opinion, is the slab fake? Is the coin fake? Who exactly was protected with these new requirements?
These are the images I actually used to sell that coin:
Sorry Bob, the intent is great, but the application is pathetic. The point of my original post is that eBay makes decisions and changes its rules, regulations, and website, with little regard to the functional reality of the change.
Which coin listing would you feel more comfortable in placing a bid? The eBay approved set, or my rule breaking, piece of counterfeit selling scum images?
Perhaps it would have made more sense to require that the slab label, AND the serial number, be clearly legible in the image? Perhaps it would have made more sense to require a minimum image size as well? Perhaps eBay should not be in the business of trying to protect people from their own ignorance, stupidity, & greed?
Common sense, with a little bit of intelligent & rational thought, goes a long way. Had they been used, my auction would not have been terminated.
PCGS, ANACS, & NGC Certified Coins on My Website.
Gave you a starter bid for your trouble.
Free Trial
That goes for all that have a problem with the new rules requiring a rev. image , NOT a knock on you personally.
much and have not one iota of a problem with it. For me your pics tell all and are expertly done as is your
whole auction format.
Now that we have that clear....It's just that Ebay makes the rules and the rules state that you must post a pic
of the reverse of the slab. Hey, it's the rule baby and if you want to play in their court you got to play by their
rules, right? So, that is the reason you got it pulled. Can't say I disagree with you Larry, it's just that I've got to
play their game and so must you if you want to continue using their format.
I wish everyone would take the time and effort that you do Larry, and spend the money in fees, too. But, not
everyone does such an exempliary job.
bob
<< <i>These new rules are so stupid. I want to know who's covering my a$$ when I buy coins at a coin show? Is ebay checking every other category to make sure there aren't counterfits? I'd bet there are just a few knock-offs in the clothing category. >>
eBay was responsible for the explosion of home-made slabs, not coin shows.
Free Trial
<< <i>Did they nix your auction because you have a 1924 Peace Dollar in a 1921 Morgan Dollar slab?
<< <i>
>>
I was wondering when someone was going to get around to that.
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>
Which coin listing would you feel more comfortable in placing a bid? The eBay approved set, or my rule breaking, piece of counterfeit selling scum images? >>
Those are nice images. How do you take your pictures of slabbed coins so that you don't get glare/reflection from the plastic?
<< <i>It's just that Ebay makes the rules and the rules state that you must post a pic
of the reverse of the slab. Hey, it's the rule baby and if you want to play in their court you got to play by their
rules, right? So, that is the reason you got it pulled. Can't say I disagree with you Larry, it's just that I've got to play their game and so must you if you want to continue using their format. >>
You are right, I do need to play by their rules. But as a multi-billion dollar company, they should have somebody capable of intelligent thought and logical reasoning to enforce those rules. There are coin dealers on eBay that have hundreds of coins listed in eBay stores with no reverse photo. This is likely because the auctions were created before 3 weeks ago and may have even been in inventory for over a year. If we are going to play the "it's their rule" game, then let's enforce "their rule" equally among EVERY eBay user, not via selective enforcement.
The $80 they kicked back by ending my listing could have paid for a half day salary for an intelligent eBay employee to weed through coin listings and cancel those that are actually fraudulent.
<< <i>Did they nix your auction because you have a 1924 Peace Dollar in a 1921 Morgan Dollar slab? >>
No, they didn't. I sold the coin as an error slab... an NGC mistake.
<< <i>Those are nice images. How do you take your pictures of slabbed coins so that you don't get glare/reflection from the plastic? >>
Practice.
PCGS, ANACS, & NGC Certified Coins on My Website.
eBay's rule is ambiguous at best. "The coin in its graded holder" could reasonably be interpreted as meaning simply as meaning that the image must show "the coin." The subject of the prepositional phrase "the coin in its graded holder" is "the coin."
If eBay intended to require images of both "the coin" and "its graded holder," eBay could have written the rule thus:
"The listing must include images of the item showing both the front and back of both the coin and its graded holder."
or
"The listing must include an image of the item, showing the coin and its graded holder, front and back."
Instead, its rule is written in a way that arguably misleads listers into thinking that they need only show an image of "the coin in its graded holder," i.e., the coin.
--csw
Tiger trout, Deerfield River, c. 2001.
Some people contend the entire slab, front AND BACK, is required to be pictured. However, you can find auctions on eBay all over the place that show the coin in its holder and the entire reverse of the slab is not being shown. A coin CAN literally be "shown in its holder, front and back", without the entire slab being shown. That still meets the wording of new eBay rules. The tighter field in this instance allows for better detail of the coin. This dual situation is illustrated by the examples in this thread which show both "distant" and "tighter" shots. Just include a photo of the label when tighter shots are used. Three photos, max. Right?
How does a potential buyer know the slab isn't cracked or chipped if the entire slab isn't shown? As we all know, the coin may be shown in its slab (entire or partial), but scratches or such on the slab, or even the coin, may be photoshopped out. Sometimes scratches on the slab are the only way one can tell that a photo of a coin actually is IN the slab. It seems eBay MUST change its wording in the rules yet again. Leaving interpretation open the way they have is NO DAMN GOOD.
This whole mess initially struck me as a weak, ill-thoughtout method by eBay to increase its revenue through the seeming need to require more photos (which they, ideally, hosted and charged for). It has turned out to be so much more of a fiasco though.
My thinking is rambling as usual, but I know I'm getting real tired of this dual, split, bifurcated lousy situation that eBay has left their coin market, and us, in. I appreciate others views on this matter and thank you for letting me state mine. Whatever it is!!! ...much like eBay's rules.
<< <i>for years, I've provided large clear images of the obverse of the slab, as well as even larger, clearer images of the obverse and reverse of the coins that I sell. >>
Ditto. I now use a composite of the obverse and reverse of the slab in place of the obverse slab image since the rules changed. But, I still think it's silly, and the enforcement in cases such as this even sillier.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Since their violation letter does not include the actual reason for the removal of the listing, aside from informing me that my item is fraudulent or counterfeit And just to ensure that I lose future business, they notify all of the bidders that I'm a piece of countefeit selling scum. >>
I asked my account rep about this, and he informs me that the notice sent to bidders is different and says nothing about counterfeits. It's more generic in nature and is used category-wide, not just coins.
I also suggested to him that the TS people be granted some discretion in situations such as this where a good seller gets dinged for a very minor violation. He said he would pass it along, but wasn't hopeful that it would change.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Did you have Obv & Rev of the slab? >>
Bingo. You need a reverse slab photo. >>
Seriously? A human being, whom we'll assume has a functioning brain, made a conscious & intentional decision to kick back a $21.10 listing fee, an estimated $30.00 final value fee, and a $33.00 paypal fee, a total of $84 in fees on a single coin sale, all because I don't have an image of the plastic around the reverse of the coin.
I guess the large image of the reverse of the coin was insufficient. And all this time I thought I was selling coins, not the backs of plastic coin holders. >>
That's the reason. It's a pain, but you got to do it.
Recipient of the coveted "You Suck" award, April 2009 for cherrypicking a 1833 CBHD LM-5, and April 2022 for a 1835 LM-12, and again in Aug 2012 for picking off a 1952 FS-902.
<< <i>Without pictures I'm not sure we can tell.
Did you have Obv & Rev of the slab? >>
How does failure to provide a pic/pics equate the lister to being a counterfeiter?
<< <i>I also suggested to him that the TS people be granted some discretion in situations such as this where a good seller gets dinged for a very minor violation. He said he would pass it along, but wasn't hopeful that it would change.
Russ, NCNE >>
"Good seller" has a different meaning to eBay compared to what we think of as a good seller.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
It sure is, especially when one can verify the slab from the cert number on the obverse.
As far as an extra 15 cents, I host my pics for free, and give Ebay nothing.
I do use the one free pic though.
I would have felt comfortable buying the op's Vam. A good example of an auction, but not good enough Meg.
p.s. I'm sure all your eBay fees associated with the canceled listing have been refunded.
p.p.s. anyone that spends a dime having eBay host pictures for them is a POOR businessperson.
p.p.p.s. when you think about it, the generic (and agreeably harsh nature - i.e. fraudulent/counterfeit) nature of their notice to bidders provides yet another deterrent to against continuing to infract their rules. Probably not fair but it will also probably work more than if they simply said seller forgot to include a picture of the back of the slab.
<< <i>I had the same crap happen to me yesterday on a peace dollar that was at $2700- with a day to go. Its Pcgs certified but no picture of the whole slab, just the label. Thanks for wasting our time ebay. Maybe the potential buyers come back, maybe they won't. >>
They all got an e-mail that the coin was removed for violation of ebay's counterfeit coin policy.