Intrigue from Burdette's Renaissance book-- how much would Lincoln cent patterns be worth, and do t

Longacre · September 25, 2007 3:11AM

I was reading the Burdette "Renaissance of American Coinage 1909-1915" book, and it is chock full of great information. In the chapter entitled, "Patters and Proofs", he writes,

"The Lincoln cent, like its immediate predecessor the half eagle, has left us with no known pattern coins. One or two lead impressions of the obverse without motto exist to tempt the collector, but little else. Contemporary documents attest to the creation of pattern pieces, and also to director Leach's zeal in having them destroyed. Nothing was saved for posterity--not even for the mint's own cabinet of coins. ... All that remains of the bronze cent Lincoln patterns is a short list of pieces struck, distributed, and presumably returned for destruction. Over the century since the coin's introduction, there have been a few rumors of extant pieces but nothing tangible."

**********

(1) Does anyone have any comments about the text above? Were all of the pattern coins really destroyed?
(2) If one came out of hiding and went up for auction, what would its selling price be?
(3) Would these patterns run into any legal ownership issues, similar to the 1933 Saints, or is that a different matter?
(4) How were these coins returned for destruction? Were they specifically requested to be returned? If so, is that similar to the 1933 Saints? Or was there no specific request to return them, and therefore there should be no question about legal ownership?

dbldie55 · September 25, 2007 3:36AM

Unless they were gold and the year was 1933, they have nothing in common with the 1933 Saint. There is nothing even remotely in common between them other than they are round.

Longacre · September 25, 2007 3:47AM

<< Unless they were gold and the year was 1933, they have nothing in common with the 1933 Saint. There is nothing even remotely in common between them other than they are round. >>

If there was an administrative order from the mint to return the Lincoln patterns and someone did not, would you consider that to be similar to a presidential order? Are you focusing on the enforceability of the order, or the type of order itself? Just curious.

MrEureka · September 25, 2007 3:49AM

I bought the uniface lead piece at the Loye Lauder auction in the mid-80's. It was about $1000, and I resold it soon thereafter. It's worth a lot more today.

CoinRaritiesOnline · September 25, 2007 4:48AM

<< I bought the uniface lead piece at the Loye Lauder auction in the mid-80's. It was about $1000, and I resold it soon thereafter. It's worth a lot more today. >>

It was hard to make a mistake buying something -- anything -- at the Loye Lauder auction. There were some incredible rarities that went for an absolute song in that sale.

I wish I attended that sale.

RWB · September 25, 2007 5:03AM

Director Leach made it clear that he wanted no pattern or experimental pieces to get out. He also said he was being asked for examples from people in prominent positions, but I could not find any correspondence about who the requests came from. President Taft is the only person outside the mint and treasury who saw all of the Lincoln patterns. There’s no mention that he kept one for himself, as Roosevelt had done with the pattern half eagle in Sept. 1908. (The coin he gave to Bigelow – whereabouts now unknown.)

Considering what the Fraser electros sell for, the lead splashers are likely worth $50,000+ and a real pattern $150,000+. (Just my guess…)

66RB · September 25, 2007 5:20AM

<< Director Leach made it clear that he wanted no pattern or experimental pieces to get out. He also said he was being asked for examples from people in prominent positions, but I could not find any correspondence about who the requests came from. President Taft is the only person outside the mint and treasury who saw all of the Lincoln patterns. There’s no mention that he kept one for himself, as Roosevelt had done with the pattern half eagle in Sept. 1908. (The coin he gave to Bigelow – whereabouts now unknown.) >>

Excellent info RWB, thank you!

<< Considering what the Fraser electros sell for, the lead splashers are likely worth $50,000+ and a real pattern $150,000+. (Just my guess…) >>

this is from my March Baltimore report----

<< I met Julian Leidman, and I looked through his case and saw quite a bit of patterns and a lot of gold. Seeing all the patterns made me think to ask Julian where all the Lincoln cent patterns were. He told me there are a few 5c nickel Lincoln patterns out there but none that were designed by Brenner. I lamented the fact that even if there were some, the prices would most likely be exorbitant anyway. I was glad to meet Julian, and yes, he was the only one I noticed with a high backed executive chair on wheels. He looked pretty comfy

>>

I guess I was right that the prices would be crazy!

CaptHenway · September 25, 2007 5:41AM

<< I bought the uniface lead piece at the Loye Lauder auction in the mid-80's. It was about $1000, and I resold it soon thereafter. It's worth a lot more today. >>

I remember you offering it to me for $1000 at a show in Atlantic City in 1983 or 1984, and I have kicked myself for not buying despite the massive ugliness......
TD

RWB · September 25, 2007 8:43AM

Director Frank Leach evidently learned to dislike coin collectors in 1907/8 when he was being badgered for examples of the special Saint-Gaudens $10 and $20. I think he referred to collectors as “pests.” With TR not interested in either the Pratt half eagle or Brenner’s cent, and Taft showing no interest at all, the lead splashers probably escaped as souvenirs or “trash.”

He was also a fan of Charles Barber’s design sharpening work, and had Barber work on the Washington nickel, evidently as a companion for the Lincoln cent. There are even a few letters from banks in late 1909 asking when the Washington nickels will be released. The 1909-1915 book has a section stating just about all that is known about these pattern pieces.

It is amazing to me that Barber could do such completely awful work as the Washington nickel designs, or the Lewis/Clark and McKinley, yet also create the very nice PPIE $2.50.

Intrigue from Burdette's Renaissance book-- how much would Lincoln cent patterns be worth, and do t

Comments

Leave a Comment