For all of you hi vol sellers that hate paypal..

slipgate · September 17, 2007 11:45PM

Have you investigated Visa/Mastercard to open an account so you can accept credit cards directly? If a big majority of power sellers and other high volume sellers accepted credit cards directly, I know I wouldn't use paypal anymore!

commoncents05 · September 17, 2007 11:49PM

I would only do it if their fees are less than PayPal's.

-Paul

COINB0Y · September 17, 2007 11:55PM

Visa/Mastercard's rip is the same as Paypal, isn't it?

slipgate · September 17, 2007 11:58PM

<< Visa/Mastercard's rip is the same as Paypal, isn't it? >>

Possibly, but I don't think you lose all your rights like Paypal makes you do. As a buyer, I hate using paypal because I am marginally protected. I would much rather use a credit card directly with the seller. Credit card companies should have a "special" for online auctions with fees below paypals. Of course, most people are probably using a credit card with paypal, so they make more than way anyway.

seemyauction · September 18, 2007 12:04AM

From the research I've done, Paypal has the lowest fees.

Now if you have over $5000 a month in sales you have more protection with some of the other merchant accounts.

But under 5000 paypal is imposible to beat.

AL

jdimmick · September 18, 2007 12:09AM

I dont use pay-pal becuase the fee's at 3% on 150k in sales covers my shop lease for a year practically.

jim

ttown · September 18, 2007 12:10AM

I think if your selling coins with value and don't offer PayPal your missing out on bids that would more than pay for PayPal. I brought a PCGS 1807 Capped Bust XF40 from a board member here off Ebay. It's a really nice coin I was was glad to take it off thier hands for around $1100.

mrearlygold · September 18, 2007 12:53AM

Paypal stands by the merchant much more so than others. I had an account with Cardservice International for 6 years.

Then try terminating the account with them. These sleazeballs have banged my bank account for a year after I closed it. I finally filed a complaint with various government agencies against them.

While paypal seems high and whose shopping cart isn't the easiest in the world, from a merchants perspective, they're better than Cardservice (one of the biggest)

For whatever it's worth, I do not accept credit cards for orders over $1,000.00 from new customers

Russ · September 18, 2007 1:05AM

<< Visa/Mastercard's rip is the same as Paypal, isn't it? >>

That depends on the merchant contract, which varies by volume. My merchant contract for Visa/Mastercard is right about the same as PayPal. Big time retailers pay less than PayPal.

<< I dont use pay-pal becuase the fee's at 3% on 150k in sales covers my shop lease for a year practically >>

At that sales level, PayPal is 2.2%.

Russ, NCNE

RBinTex · September 18, 2007 2:24AM

Good luck finding coin hawkers with good enough credit to get approved for non-swipe &/or web-based merchant accounts.

wayneherndon · September 18, 2007 2:50AM

I accept MasterCard, Visa, Discover and American Express through a merchant account. The fees are about the same as PayPal for all but Amex which is higher. However, the risk is much lower with the credit cards and they work with the merchant much better than PayPal (which as far as I can tell is not at all in the case of PayPal). If I had my preference all of PayPal transactions would be processed through one of the credit card merchant accounts. I only accept PayPal because because it is eBay buyers' preferred method of payment.

WH

wayneherndon · September 18, 2007 2:57AM

RBinTex has a good point. There is a lot of paperwork and background checking required to get a merchant account (even a swipe one). I've bought houses with less paperwork than it took to get my first merchant account (non-swipe, web based). I then got a swipe account (to use at shows) and had to go through it all again even though the two accounts were with the same host I'd been with for years.

PayPal and eBay basically have the doors wide open and let anyone have an account without really doing any real verification, hence the shenanigans you see.

Related question: has anyone used Google Checkout as an alternative? I realize mentioning it on eBay will get your listing pulled but how about elsewhere either using or accepting Google Checkout?

WH

notwilight · September 18, 2007 3:09AM

Sorry but Ebay and Paypal (same company) have made it much easier to accept paypal than any other form of payment. When a payment comes in on paypal it automaticly shows as paid in ebay and then you can easily print out the shipping label with paypal shipping. Fees are charged (at a lower rate than the USPS charges) to your paypal account and you print out the shipping label without having to type a single key, let alone re-entering the address which is error likely in itself.

And 98% of my customers pay by paypal. Even when one of them says "I hate paypal, can you take a check" and I say sure, often a week later when they haven't gotten around to sending a check the payment shows up in paypal--because they can do paypal late at night or even at work.

So paypal and ebay are in my opinion limiting competition and generating revenue for paypal somewhat unfairly but it works easiest for me and it works easiest for my customers. I wouldn't want to have to transpose addresses into a shipping system so if I take credit cards, I want it to have a shipping option.

So I used to discourage paypal but for 2.2% the shipping convenience is worth it on sales less than a couple hundred bucks. But even on large sales customers sometimes prefer it because it lets them put it on their credit cards. I tried selling my $1000+ MS70 gold buffalos w/o paypal for a while and it hurt sales.

--jerry

TomB · September 18, 2007 3:16AM

At one point in time you could appeal directly to your credit card issuer if you had a problem in a PayPal transaction, perhaps this is no longer the case. I had a bad buying experience from ebay three or four years ago where I used PayPal and the merchant was giving me a story and delay about a refund so I finally called my credit card company. I had my refund within a day after calling VISA directly and PayPal then sent me an email telling me not to do that again.

RBinTex · September 18, 2007 3:21AM

Personally, my swipe AND non-swipe rate is 2.2% + .35 per transaction + $5 flate rate per month. You'd have to do a whole lot via PP to get a better deal (rate-wise) with arguably much less protection from lowlifes. Even if you got it down to 1.9% you'd only save $25 per month for each 100k annually & I doubt the increased chargeback risk via PP makes it worth it if one were to have the choice.

When you have your own merchant account YOU get to do an AVS (address verification - i.e. match street number and zip) and get the CVV (or CVV2) code (i.e. the last 3 digits in the signature panel on the back of a MC or Visa - or the 4 non-raised #'s from an Amex card) and whatever else YOU feel prudent. You also have a much better chance of fighting a chargeback since you will be in direct contact with the issuing bank (AND might have some help from your bank as well). No reliance on PP. Much better (if you can swing it) to have this as an option for buyers in addition to PP only.

"I dont use pay-pal becuase the fee's at 3% on 150k in sales covers my shop lease for a year practically."

If you're eBay sales are that high as it stands, I'm sure you're losing more than that for not taking it. I know for sure, sellers that do take PP love guys like you as the competition.

Your unawareness of the actual fee (1.9%) is kinda hilarious.

Heck, close your shop and save all the rent too.

"At that sales level, PayPal is 2.2%."

Actually, it is 1.9% over $100k (plus 30 cents per transaction).

Frankcoins · September 18, 2007 3:31AM

Paypal is worth the cost on my ebay sales. It's better than trying to collect a bad check in a distant city.

jdimmick · September 18, 2007 3:43AM

I used to beleive that and was convinced that accepting pay-pal brought higher prices, but I am not so sure about that anymore at least enough to make up the percentage, becuase I have two freinds who sell very similar items as me, and have been taking pay-pal since inception and the prices realized on there auctions are no higher than mine routinely.

jim

jdimmick · September 18, 2007 3:44AM

Thanks for the info on the correct percentage quotes, I did not know that.

I am thinking about trying it starting Oct 1, and see what happens???

jim

mrearlygold · September 18, 2007 3:52AM

Poll! Poll! Poll!

wayneherndon · September 18, 2007 3:54AM

My merchant account is 1.6% on swipe plus 20c per transaction. It rises to 2.0% on non-swipe transactions. So, it is both less expensive and less risky than PayPal. Yet, PayPal remains the eBay standard which essentially mean I will keep accepting it for eBay transactions.

WH

mrearlygold · September 18, 2007 3:56AM

Wayne, my basic monthly fee with Cardservice International/Linkpoint was a little over 60 bucks. Do you accept cards online? If so what's your monthly gateway charge?

wayneherndon · September 18, 2007 3:59AM

I don't use a gateway. I process the card manually offline in software instead. I don't have a monthly fee but there is a monthly minimum of $25 which I always exceed many times over. I pay my host ~ $5 a month for the software license.

WH

Russ · September 18, 2007 4:43AM

<< "At that sales level, PayPal is 2.2%."

Actually, it is 1.9% over $100k (plus 30 cents per transaction). >>

Incorrect. It is 1.9% over $100K per month, not year. His $150K a year works out to $12.5K per month, which is 2.2%.

Russ, NCNE

Russ · September 18, 2007 4:46AM

<< Wayne, my basic monthly fee with Cardservice International/Linkpoint was a little over 60 bucks. Do you accept cards online? If so what's your monthly gateway charge? >>

My gateway fee is $10 a month.

Russ, NCNE

jdimmick · September 18, 2007 5:08AM

Thanks Russ for clarification,

Man Id Love to be at 100k a month in sales, there no way in the world I could find enough to buy at a decent price around her to sell to even begin to do 25k a month, much less 100k.

AskRaq · September 18, 2007 5:16AM

In the 90's I ran the online portion of my grandparents business (Schmidt-GoldTrap... gold sluices & dredges), and not many people were using PayPal as it was new... so I also used another online service that was similar. I could take credit cards online & over the phone, and go online to our account and process them immediately with a small percentage fee (2%??). It's been many years, and I don't recall the name off-hand, but it was a similar name to PayPal. If I recall, I'll post it for the members who a sellers.

Russ · September 18, 2007 5:38AM

<< Man Id Love to be at 100k a month in sales, there no way in the world I could find enough to buy at a decent price around her to sell to even begin to do 25k a month, much less 100k. >>

You bring up an excellent point that many don't understand. Selling coins is easy. It's the buying that is tough.

Russ, NCNE

RBinTex · September 18, 2007 6:41AM

Wow!!! You're right (of course) Russ. I missed the monthly vs. yearly. Man, that's some volume to hit for a tiny break.

VicThrust · September 18, 2007 7:17AM

I have an on-line business. Here are my experiences with these CC vendors. My site sells decals and our sales volume is substantial.

1 - Paypal API - This integrated with our cart (OS comerce) nicely and the fees are very straightforward and easy to understand. Any user puchasing through our site has no idea paypal is the cc processor. We also have virtual terminal which allows us to take phone orders. This servie is $20.00 a month.

2 - Propay - Very good and resoanable fees - al ot like paypal however they do require a deposit. Good for phone orders - our cart is not tied into this vendor. yearly fee for higher end account $55.00 or something like that. They have been good to work with.

3 - Linkpoint - Tried them for one month and could not pull the plug on them fast enough. My statements needed a decoder ring to figure it out and there are so many hidden fees it would blow your mind. They were costing me $70.00 more per $1,000 than either of the first two. Took a long time to get through to kill my account. Their phone menu actually has an option for vendors who want out because fees are to high. There was a recent article in Inc. magazine about vendors like this and how hard they are hitting the restaurant industry. The linkpoint fee was in excess of $50/month and the hidden fees they do not tell you about when you open an account are mind blowing.

In light of that we stay with Paypal.

tyler267 · September 18, 2007 12:01PM

Costco Warehouse club has really low rates on credit card processing fees.

1.64% plus .20 per transaction For Swipe
1.99% plus .27 per transaction For Non Swipe and Internet

Link Costco Nova Merchant Services Costco Merchant Services[/L]

I'm about to switch over for my company. But I'll stay with Paypal for my ebay sales - The convience is just to great - easy to ship items and customers are accustomed to it

fcloud · September 18, 2007 12:08PM

Your link doesn't work.

Paypal is better for the small seller. Merchant accounts are better for big sellers.

<< Costco Warehouse club has really low rates on credit card processing fees.

1.64% plus .20 per transaction For Swipe
1.99% plus .27 per transaction For Non Swipe and Internet

Link Costco Nova Merchant Services Costco Merchant Services[/L]

I'm about to switch over for my company. But I'll stay with Paypal for my ebay sales - The convience is just to great - easy to ship items and customers are accustomed to it >>

ca0100000 · September 18, 2007 12:33PM

Google looks like it has a good system. Just can't use it for ebay.
http://checkout.google.com/seller/fees.html
When you sell with Google Checkout™, you can process all of your Checkout sales for free until 2008. And there are no monthly, setup or gateway fees.

Standard credit card processing fees (Applicable January 1, 2008)
Beginning January 1, 2008, when you use Google Checkout to process your sales, you'll only be charged a low 2% + $0.20 per transaction. With Google Checkout, there are no monthly, setup, or gateway service fees.

WTCG · September 18, 2007 12:46PM

I have another business that accepts American Express, Visa, and Mastercard for payments, and the fee that is charged per transaction is less than that of PayPal. In contrast to almost everybody else, payments using American Express cards are lower in fees for us. Discover is not accepted due to the outrageous fees they want to charge. Fortunately, most people who in their right minds do not have the courage to whip out a Discover card in public.

For my numismatics business all financial accounting is handled by an outside accounting firm, and my accountant despises PayPal transactions because PayPal transactions, especially those transactions that are for small monetary amounts (less than $1000) tend to cause more confusion than they should be entitled to. That is the primary reason why I do not accept PayPal.

notwilight · September 18, 2007 12:51PM

<< Google looks like it has a good system. Just can't use it for ebay. http://checkout.google.com/seller/fees.html When you sell with Google Checkout™, you can process all of your Checkout sales for free until 2008. And there are no monthly, setup or gateway fees. Standard credit card processing fees (Applicable January 1, 2008) Beginning January 1, 2008, when you use Google Checkout to process your sales, you'll only be charged a low 2% + $0.20 per transaction. With Google Checkout, there are no monthly, setup, or gateway service fees. >>

I set up Google checkout for one customer that flaked on me so I've never used it. I've suggested it to several people who don't do paypal and they weren't interested...I'd like to try it someday.

bestday · September 18, 2007 1:44PM

Costco has a program with an under 2% fee. ..used them in the past with no hassle

For all of you hi vol sellers that hate paypal..

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