All Time Gold Glove Team Voting Ended

fur72 · August 22, 2007 8:52AM

The all time gold glove team was announced by Spalding which i guess was voted on by fans. Anyone see somone who doesn't belong? My sig might give it away.

Position Winner Gold Gloves
C Johnny Bench 10
1B Wes Parker 6
2B Joe Morgan 5
SS Ozzie Smith 13
3B Brooks Robinson 16
OF Willie Mays 12
OF Roberto Clemente 12
OF Ken Griffey Jr. 10
P Greg Maddux 16

Brian48 · August 22, 2007 8:55AM

Well, if the criteria is the most Gold Gloves awarded, there really isn't any one else who can be on this team (unless there's a tie that they forgot about). Jim Kaat won like 14 or so GGs, but Maddox has two more.

BunchOBull · August 22, 2007 9:04AM

Ryne Sandberg's 9 straight GGs at 2nd base? Maybe?

Goot · August 22, 2007 9:13AM

Although he's having a disgustingly attrocious year, if Andruw Jones keeps up the defense and stays healthy, he'll probably tie and maybe surpass 12 GG's. I think he's at 9 and he's only 31.

fur72 · August 22, 2007 9:20AM

BunchOBull you crystalized my thoughts

Its Joe freakin Morgan, 5 gold gloves? Granted it was a fans vote I believe but that and the fact the Joe Morgan has no respect or Sandberg what so ever make is worse. In Ryno's book he talks about Morgans dislike for Ryno and he can't figure out. But granted in my slanted opnion the greatest defensive second baseman of all time was Ryne Sandberg. If Ozzie Smith wasn't on the list you would really see me fired up...

Edit: Goot you are correct Jones was close Story Link

Brian48 · August 22, 2007 9:30AM

<< Ryne Sandberg's 9 straight GGs at 2nd base? Maybe? >>

Did Ryno win any of those GGs in any other position but 2B? I don't remember him playing any other position. I don't understand Joe Morgan being on the list either.

Mind you, I think GGs are somewhat dubious, popularity awards anyway. Anyone remember Raphael Palmiero winning one for only playing 28 games at 1st base?

nightcrawler729 · August 22, 2007 9:30AM

How about Bill Mazeroski at 2B?

digicat · August 22, 2007 9:43AM

<< Anyone remember Raphael Palmiero winning one for only playing 28 games at 1st base? >>

Oh wow... there's a big "WTF" if there ever was one.

As for 1st base... The fans voted for these guys? How many of you folks knew anything relevant about Wes Parker before reading this post?

TNP777 · August 22, 2007 10:33AM

<< 

<< Anyone remember Raphael Palmiero winning one for only playing 28 games at 1st base? >>

Oh wow... there's a big "WTF" if there ever was one.

As for 1st base... The fans voted for these guys? How many of you folks knew anything relevant about Wes Parker before reading this post? >>

Never trust a Giants fan to be objective about anything a Dodger wins!

I liked Parker's quote:

<< "I'm thrilled to be recognized as one of those who worked hard at what is an under-appreciated skill," Parker said. "I'm particularly pleased to be the lone representative of the Dodgers and the only awardee who is not and will not be in the Hall of Fame. This is my Hall of Fame." >>

Geordie

digicat · August 22, 2007 10:47AM

<< Never trust a Giants fan to be objective about anything a Dodger wins! >>

Heh, I'll take J.T. Snow, thank you very much.

thriller13 · August 22, 2007 10:49AM

I think Keith Hernandez at 1st, Ryno or even Frank White at 2nd. I am sure Maz and Parker were great too but before my time.

I cant agree that Jones should be here though, he was great his first few years but lately his range has really fallen off as he bulked up. I can't figure out why he keeps getting GG's at this point.

grote15 · August 22, 2007 10:49AM

I'd say Morgan is arguably the best secondbaseman of all time, but not sure he is the best fielding secondbaseman of all time.

CDsNuts · August 22, 2007 11:22AM

Roberto Alomar is by far the best fiedling 2B to ever play the game. It's not even close.

To put everything into perspective, Brooks Robinson only got 61% of the vote at 3rd when he should've gotten 135%. This poll of the American public can't be taken seriously.

Goot · August 22, 2007 12:52PM

<< I think Keith Hernandez at 1st, Ryno or even Frank White at 2nd. I am sure Maz and Parker were great too but before my time.

I cant agree that Jones should be here though, he was great his first few years but lately his range has really fallen off as he bulked up. I can't figure out why he keeps getting GG's at this point. >>

I never said that he should be on it, just that he's approaching 12 GG's and is only 31 years old.

DeutscherGeist · August 22, 2007 5:32PM

Who is Wes Parker?

For first base, it should have been Don Mattingly or Keith Hernandez. Even Steve Garvey was an excellent fielding first baseman. Wes Parker just came out of no where. I am surprised there were so many fans that even know about him.

For second base, I thought for sure Roberto Alomar would get it. Morgan is not a bad choice. Sandberg would have not disgraced either.

DerekD · August 22, 2007 9:13PM

<< As for 1st base... The fans voted for these guys? How many of you folks knew anything relevant about Wes Parker before reading this post? >>

Wes Parker did an episode of the Brady Bunch. That's how you get the fan vote!!!

TomGshotput · August 22, 2007 10:45PM

Hernandez and Mazeroski have to be there, easily the best at their position. Even Jackie Robinson ahead of Morgan

Outfield is three positions: Bonds in left, Mays in center, Clemente in right

fiveniner · August 22, 2007 10:47PM

Maz at second.

Morgoth · August 22, 2007 10:57PM

For the stats guys Maz is clearly the best ever according to Bill James. He is the Ozzie Smith of 2B's. Got into the Hall on mostly a defense basis.

itzagoner · August 22, 2007 11:04PM

many years ago, i think it was at a National, Wes Parker came up to our table to purchase some baseball cards of none other than the GREAT Wes Parker!

as a young kid growing up in L.A. during the 60's, i got to see him play a lot and hear Vin Scullys' glowing descriptions of his defensive play......that being said, this one is straight outta left field, must have been a grass roots Los Angelino effort to win Wes this prestigious honor

mkg809 · August 22, 2007 11:24PM

1B Buckner

digicat · August 23, 2007 3:21AM

<< 1B Buckner >>

I think a player would to have won a Gold Glove at some point in his career before he could be considered as part of the "All Time Gold Glove Team".

itzagoner · August 23, 2007 3:23AM

<< 

<< 1B Buckner >>

I think a player would to have won a Gold Glove at some point in his career before he could be considered as part of the "All Time Gold Glove Team". >>

i'm guessing it was equivalent of suggesting Jose Canseco as the right fielder

digicat · August 23, 2007 3:48AM

USELESS STATS WARNING!!!

Well, I did a quick look at the stats.... Wes Parker was pretty solid as a 1st baseman if you compare his fielding percentage vs the average of his league during his Gold Glove years.

Wes Parker averaged .0046 above the league in his 6 GG years.

In comparason...

.0039 = Don Mattingly (9 GG)
.0036 = Vic Power (7 GG)
.0032 = J.T. Snow (6 GG)
.0031 = Keith Hernandez (11 GG)
.0024 = Bill White (7 GG)
- .0006 = George Scott (8 GG) (Yes, his FP was usually worse than the league average)

CDsNuts · August 23, 2007 4:02AM

Fielding ability is really hard to determine by using stats. What about a guy like Alomar who was always in position because he knew every batter's tendency? Certainly he's going to make more outs than Ryne Sandberg even if they both have the same amount of errors. He'll also probably have a few more errors because he's already in position to make the error, whereas a guy who dives and misses won't be hit with the E. And not to keep pounding on the Alomar argument, but what about a guy like him who has a much quicker turn to make the double play? I think the best fielder should be determined by who makes the most outs for his team, and I'm not sure there's any way to show that through stats.

I guess what I'm saying is that the best fielders are already in position to make the play and don't necesarily need to always make the diving catch.

DeutscherGeist · August 23, 2007 7:22AM

I see what digicat is getting at with the stats.

Wes Parker played in an era where first baseman were not coveted for fielding ability. During the Mattingly and Hernandez era, the defensive first baseman started coming into vogue. Coaches paid more attention to fielding ability and used the DH for players who would been first baseman in the past. Therefore, it was hard for Mattingly to be that much more above the league average than Wes because bad fielding first baseman got shuffled at the DH position. Context is everything.

Still, Mattingly is in second place with all that said. But given what I have presented and considering he got more gold gloves than Wes, I say it should have been Mattingly at first base for the All-Time team.

When comparing Hernandez to Mattingly, the stats above favor Mattingly not just by sheer numbers. Mattingly's points above league average was already tainted by the fact that really bad fielders were relegated to DH. Hernandez competed with more bad fielders, comparatively speaking, since there was no DH position in the NL. Hernandez competed with a more dilute talent than Mattingly.

itzagoner · August 23, 2007 7:26AM

<< Fielding ability is really hard to determine by using stats. What about a guy like Alomar who was always in position because he knew every batter's tendency? Certainly he's going to make more outs than Ryne Sandberg even if they both have the same amount of errors. He'll also probably have a few more errors because he's already in position to make the error, whereas a guy who dives and misses won't be hit with the E. And not to keep pounding on the Alomar argument, but what about a guy like him who has a much quicker turn to make the double play? I think the best fielder should be determined by who makes the most outs for his team, and I'm not sure there's any way to show that through stats.

I guess what I'm saying is that the best fielders are already in position to make the play and don't necesarily need to always make the diving catch. >>

John Hirschbeck sez Robbie ain't worth a spit

digicat · August 23, 2007 7:55AM

<< I see what digicat is getting at with the stats. >>

Thank you. However, I still must wonder how the fans ended up voting for Wes Parker. Was he a big star in his day? Bigger than Mattingly or Hernandez?

Mattingly and Hernandez have the benifit of being somewhat recent players. Maybe we've got some sort of an anti-New York undercurrent among the voters?

mkg809 · August 23, 2007 10:44AM

All Time Gold Glove Team Voting Ended

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