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Type B Washington quarter reverse
docg
Posts: 528 ✭✭
Will PCGS designate a type B reverse on Washington quarters? If so, which grading tier shoud the submission be made under?
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docg
Posts: 528 ✭✭
docg
Posts: 528 ✭✭
Comments
ttt
Submit under whatever tier you like and pay the $15 variety review fee additional charge per coin (fill in FS-901 under the variety section in the listing).
DLRC has had the Type B on his site on several occassions and in PCGS 65 holders going for around $75-$80.
So, yes PCGS has holdered such pieces.
The deal is, do I now send it back to NGC under Variety Plus or straight to PCGS and ask for the attributuion?
The whole deal involves not losing the grade on such a pretty NT piece AND getting it properly attributed, no matter whose Name is on the Plastic. I've accumulated several of these and they definitely merit a second look.
All just a matter of awareness.
I have only dealt with PCGS since about January.
I would like to see the population reports for these but I need the coin number.
(I suspect these numbers will be small for now. I have seen very few offered in PCGS holders attributed as type B.)
There is no index to the exotic coin numbers. It was sugested I submit it for grading and get the number that way.
What happens if you submit an item they don't recognize? Do you lose your submission fee?
If anybody has a coin number for any of these, please post it and I will make a table of them.
My Odds&Ends eBay Stuff to fuel my coin habit (No Coins)
My Odds&Ends eBay Stuff to fuel my coin habit (No Coins)
I'll tell 'em, the reverse was struck with a proof die.
This is a couple of good pictures of an "A" reverse.
Hopefully the "B" will follow.
http://forums.collectors.com/messageview.cfm?catid=26&threadid=596749
Here is really large picture of a "B" in an eBay item. The "B"matches the proof coins of 1937-1942, 1950-1964, 1969-1972 and some 1968.
As compared to an "A" note that on the "B":
The ES separation in STATES is greater
The top of the M of UNUM brackets IB of PLURIBUS just above it.
The leaf touching the arrowhead points now juts above them
The top and bottom arrowhead barbs are apparently missing (they are still there but overwhelmed by the field deeping there)
The stem end is parallel to the T of Quarter rather than angleing upward
The leaf by A of DOLLAR is connected by a solid bridge. The leaf on "A" is very faint and does not connect.
There are more differences, but I think I hit most of the major ones.
http://cgi.ebay.com/1963-WASHINGTON-QUARTER-25C-TYPE-B-REVERSE-ANACS-MS64_W0QQitemZ190130145692QQihZ009QQcategoryZ39462QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
On page 48 of QDB's "A Guide Book of Washington and State Quarters," is the caption reversed for the photo of the type A and type B reverses? Isn't variety A actually depicted on top, and variety B below it?
Thanks,
-Mike
<< <i>They will grade all of these, and all now have their own PCGS numbers.
Submit under whatever tier you like and pay the $15 variety review fee additional charge per coin (fill in FS-901 under the variety section in the listing). >>
How about the 1964-D C reverse?
<< <i>Hi type B experts
On page 48 of QDB's "A Guide Book of Washington and State Quarters," is the caption reversed for the photo of the type A and type B reverses? Isn't variety A actually depicted on top, and variety B below it?
Thanks,
-Mike >>
Yes, and to top it off, the CPG 4th ed. has the pix all mixed up too. This situation will go a long way towards hurting any potential market for the tyB varieties.
If you use the CPG to attribute the TyA, B, & C varieties, don't even refer to the date by date listings. The pix there are a mix of right and wrong.
Instead, you'll want to refer to the synopsis of the 3 types at the beginning of the Washington quarter chapter.
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
To the two publications mentioned above can be added EVN, Coin World and the Numismatist. All have mixed up type B pictures in the past.
Type C has a PCGS number of 145423 with a Population number of 3. The best then known was sold in Teletrade auction 2332 for $260. I wish I had know that earlier. Then again, it is not the best known today.
Type C has been used to refer to all the early clad quarters until the 1968-S type B shows up. A version of C was still being used in 1974.
The clad B's are slightly different than the silver B's in that the center of the tailfeathers now have a relief line added similiar to type C.
Clad type C can be subdived into several types including one made for proof work (1968-S only) that is very distinctive. It also appears on a few 1969-D, 1970, and 1970-D quarters.
year with the clads. It was 1985 apparently, before type "d" was
used exclusively for production. There were still small modifi-
cations made after this but they were not so dramatic as many
of the earlier ones. The annual changes between '72 and '77
were the most dramatic and there are some mules of one re-
verse paired with an obverse of another year. (none involve
the bicentennial issue.)
1968-S is Type C
1969-S is Type B with that distinct vertical line in the center of the tail feathers.
Also looked at business strike 64-D -- all Type A
Is there such a thing as a business strike 1965 having a 1964 reverse? Is that something to look for?
I read a thread where the OP had found a 1964-D with Type C (1965) reverse.
Type A is the business strike 1964-D reverse
Type B is the proof reverse
Type C is the business strike 1965 reverse
By far the most of the rest of 1968-S quarters are the type C that was modified for proof work.
The field just next to the inside of the eagle's wings are cut very deep on both of these proof styles.
There are yet two more very scarce varieties of 1968-S quarters that match the business strike C's.
Out of the 40 coins in the roll, 34 of them have the Type B reverse.
I do not know if the Type B reverse is a highly sought after variety on 1958 P quarters, but if they are and if the demand for the variety is (or in the future becomes) strong, I will have a nice little stash of goodies.
<< <i>I looked into Type A, B and C Washingtons a while back and looked in Cherrypickers for pictures of the different types of reverses. After looking at the pictures and the different listings in Cherrypickers, I opened a roll of 1958 P MS quarters I had bought a few years ago for something like $50.00-$60.00.
Out of the 40 coins in the roll, 34 of them have the Type B reverse.
I do not know if the Type B reverse is a highly sought after variety on 1958 P quarters, but if they are and if the demand for the variety is (or in the future becomes) strong, I will have a nice little stash of goodies. >>
That is an extraordinary find. 43 years ago a 1958 type B was considered one of the scarcer dates and 1964 a common one.
Come the silver melt, many of the common 1964's were melted including what must have been many B's and C's (make that some C's, that was only a 1 die phenonmen). 1958 Philadelphia was an extraordinary low mintage so many dealers saved this date. So today I think of 1958 B as more common than a 1964 B.
Adding together eBay offerings for the dates of 22 March, 6 April, 19 June and 12 July 2007, I get the following total offerings.
1956 2 (circulated, I have never seen an unc offered this year)(considered the scarcest date, certainly so in unc.)
1957 15 ( a researcher back then said 5% of 1957 Philadelphia's were type B.)
1958 9
1959 28 (included in mint sets of that year)(one dealer has admitted to having at least 2 rolls of this date)
1960 5 (included in some mint sets that year)
1961 5 ( usually considered the second scarcest date)
1962 0 (I find this strange)
1963 19
1964 1
1969D 1 (uncirculated, most unusual to even have 1 offered)
<< <i>
<< <i>Hi type B experts
On page 48 of QDB's "A Guide Book of Washington and State Quarters," is the caption reversed for the photo of the type A and type B reverses? Isn't variety A actually depicted on top, and variety B below it?
Thanks,
-Mike >>
Yes, and to top it off, the CPG 4th ed. has the pix all mixed up too. This situation will go a long way towards hurting any potential market for the tyB varieties.
If you use the CPG to attribute the TyA, B, & C varieties, don't even refer to the date by date listings. The pix there are a mix of right and wrong.
Instead, you'll want to refer to the synopsis of the 3 types at the beginning of the Washington quarter chapter. >>
Thanks for confirming the error
ProofArt's link to Type B reverse
ProofArt's link to thread showing Type A Reverse
Thought I would gather all these together in one spot and make a link for the urls posted
Also, I'd be interested in learning what the 2 scarce varieties are for the 1968-S quarters as mentioned by ProofArt... "There are yet two more very scarce varieties of 1968-S quarters that match the business strike C's. "
IIIo (o for original), RDV-003 The 1964-D Rev C which also appears on only 10 % of 1965 and less than .1% 1966 and 1967.
E PLURIBUS UNUM is thick and flat. Looks good on the 1964-D tho. Definite raised border above the field at the inside edge of the left horizontal wing where it joins the eagle's body (as contrasted with IIIa next.) I will keep referring to this same spot as simply the eagle's wing.
IIIa1 and IIIa2, RDV-004 and RDV-005 appears on MOST 1965, 1966, 1967 some 1968 (including S) and 1969-D. Much weaker outline to eagles wing, EPU is in higher relief and thinner. Some have a incuse outling of the inside of the vertical wing segments, hence the second reference number.
IIIb, RDV-006 used in 1967-1972 including 1968 -S. 1969 Phillys are 100% IIIb and rather sharp. slightly doubled master die most obvious on the inside edge of the top of Q of QUARTER. EPU similiar to IIIo but a bit higher in relief. Inside edge of wing sharper than IIIo.
IIIm, RDV-007 used on most 1968-S and 1970-D mint sets. Otherwise on a minority of 1969D, 1970 and 1970D. Special proof artwork made from a IIIb working hub. It has the same doubling. Inside edges of wings in very high relief even more so than rev B. Inside extreme tips of the wings have outline lines.
IIb, RDV-008 used on some 1968-S and all 1969-S thru 1972-S proofs and a very few 1969-D thru 1972-D. Reverse B with the addition of tailfeather centerlines in relief.
IIIc, RDV-009 used on ALL 1973 and 1974. Again the same doubling as IIIb and IIIm so probably made from a IIIb hub. Wing tips have outlines similiar to IIIm, leaves are touched up.
This is the simplified version. There are many more differences than this. Note that 1968-S has 4 varieties and the same 4 varieties are on 1969-D (IIIa, IIIb, IIIm and IIb ) 1969 Philadelphia is IIIb only and San Francisco is IIb only.