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Best MLB Catchers Ever - Your Top 5 In Order
DirtyHarry
Posts: 1,914 ✭✭
in Sports Talk
Catchers are a unique breed of players in Baseball ... Besides their offensive contributions, they must be able to perform defensively at a high level, throw out runners, direct players in the field and "manage" the pitching staff on a game day basis.
Who are your top 5 of all time and why ??
Who are your top 5 of all time and why ??
"A man's got to know his limitations...." Dirty Harry
Unfocused, impulsive collector of everything ...
Unfocused, impulsive collector of everything ...
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1. Johnny Bench
2. Mike Piazza (best hitting catcher of all time, IMO)
3. Yogi Berra
4. Ivan Rodriguez
5. Carlton Fisk
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>Off the top of my head, here are my top 5:
1. Johnny Bench
2. Mike Piazza (best hitting catcher of all time, IMO)
3. Yogi Berra
4. Ivan Rodriguez
5. Carlton Fisk >>
What? No Jerry Grote there?
1. Johnny Bench
2. Mike Piazza (best hitting catcher of all time, IMO)
3. Yogi Berra
4. Ivan Rodriguez
5. Carlton Fisk >>
What? No Jerry Grote there?
He asked for top 5, not top 6.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
2. Carlton Fisk
3. Rich Gedman
4. Doug Mirabelli
5. Tony Pena
NAME YRs G TC SC PO A E DP FLD PB
CLEMENTS, JACK 17 1073 6251 5859 4780 1079 392 93 0.937 417
TROTT, SAM 8 272 2236 2025 1635 390 211 33 0.906 249
TATE, POP 6 202 1368 1238 918 320 130 18 0.905 128
SUTCLIFFE, SY 6 186 1131 1003 722 281 128 21 0.887 142
HARBIDGE, BILL 6 128 820 701 561 140 119 6 0.855 115
HINES, MIKE 4 99 935 838 662 176 97 12 0.896 157
HUMPHRIES, JOHN 2 75 598 524 407 117 74 11 0.876 96
TENNEY, FRED 5 71 328 307 236 71 21 7 0.936 19
TWINEHAM, ART 2 52 266 249 195 54 17 2 0.936 26
BAKER, PHIL 3 50 325 296 256 40 29 5 0.911 41
DONAHUE, JIGGS 3 45 227 214 160 54 13 2 0.943 17
OLDFIELD, DAVE 3 35 259 222 176 46 37 1 0.857 29
HOUSEHOLDER, CHARLIE 2 34 219 196 153 43 23 5 0.895 56
MALONE, FERGY 2 21 150 117 87 30 33 0 0.780 30
McMAHON, JACK 2 16 70 63 52 11 7 1 0.900 9
KREHMEYER, CHARLIE 2 12 66 57 45 12 9 0 0.864 16
WALL, JOE 2 7 31 28 25 3 3 0 0.903 3
FOSTER. ELMER 1 5 34 28 19 9 6 0 0.824 13
DISTEFANO, BENNY 1 3 2 2 2 0 0 0 1.000 1
HILLEBRAND, HOMER 1 3 9 8 7 1 1 0 0.889 2
EGAN, JIM 1 2 15 15 13 2 0 0 1.000 5
SQUIRES, MIKE 1 2 1 1 1 0 0 0 1.000 0
LONG, DALE 1 2 1 1 0 1 0 0 1.000 1
EDEN CHARLIE 1 1 1 1 1 0 0 0 1.000 2
CASSIDY, JOHN 1 1 3 3 2 1 0 0 1.000 5
MULLEN, JOHN 1 1 7 5 3 2 2 0 0.714 2
SHORTEN, CHICK 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.000 0
MARR, LEFTY 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.000 0
SHORT, CHRIS 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.000 0
SHIRLEY, MULE 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.000 0
WRIGHT, JOE 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.000 0
POWELL, MARTIN 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.000 0
REDMOND, BILLY 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0.000 1
Campanella
Berra
Pudge
Fisk
1) Bench
2) Bench
3) Bench
4) Bench
5) Bench
Slight bias of course!
J Gibson
Campanella
Cochrane
Dickey
Berra
Modern Era
Bench
Rodriguez
Fisk
Piazza
Carter
Overall - Very tough to narrow down, but here is my list:
Bench
Rodriguez
Gibson
Campanella
Cochrane
Bench
Gibson
Campanella
Berra
Pudge
2. Berra
3. Piazza
4. Fisk
5. Cochrane
If you ask me next week, I might switch Bench and Berra, but those are the top two for sure. Piazza is the best hitting catcher ever, but his fielding just doesn't cut it; I'd take Bench or Berra over Piazza on my team any day. Fisk took forever to put together the numbers he did, but he did put them together without ever becoming a liability to his team. Number 5 comes down to Cochrane, Campanella, Carter or Pudge and I pick Cochrane; Campy's career was just so short and Pudge's offensive stats were just so inflated by his park while Carter's offense never hit the peaks of the others. Still, any one of the four has a decent claim to number 5. I'm sure Gibson belongs in there somewhere, too, but I have no idea where; could be as high as #1.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
2.gibson- great hitter from the C spot
3.berra- great post season C
4.campanella- solid but career cut short
5.the pudge's - fisk/rodriguez
honable mention
piazza- great hitter
collecting RAW Topps baseball cards 1952 Highs to 1972. looking for collector grade (somewhere between psa 4-7 condition). let me know what you have, I'll take it, I want to finish sets, I must have something you can use for trade.
looking for Topps 71-72 hi's-62-53-54-55-59, I have these sets started
Dimes: 54S, 53P, 50P, 49S, 45D+S, 44S, 43D, 41S, 40D+S, 39D+S, 38D+S, 37D+S, 36S, 35D+S, all 16-34's
Quarters: 52S, 47S, 46S, 40S, 39S, 38S, 37D+S, 36D+S, 35D, 34D, 32D+S
74 Topps: 37,38,46,47,48,138,151,193,210,214,223,241,256,264,268,277,289,316,435,552,570,577,592,602,610,654,655
1997 Finest silver: 115, 135, 139, 145, 310
1995 Ultra Gold Medallion Sets: Golden Prospects, HR Kings, On-Base Leaders, Power Plus, RBI Kings, Rising Stars
"Kelly, who played every position, was one of the greatest players of his era and baseballs first superstar. He started his career with the Reds in 1878, and soon was given the title "King of Baseball", becoming the number one idol of the nation. Joining Cap Anson's Chicago team in 1880, he helped lead a group of hard drinking, fast living men to five NL titles.
A man who loved the limelight, he could be found most every night about- the-town, enjoying what Chicago had to offer. A strikingly handsome man, his baseball celebrity only amplified his touch with the ladies. He could have his pick of almost any woman he wanted, and usually did. He didn't have to frequent whore houses like some players because the ladies came to him, a real accomplishment during those conservative Victorian times of the 1880's. An impecable dresser, he wore silk shirts and spats, and was once named one of Americas' best dressed men".
In an era when all games were played during the day and schedules were only about 120 games a season, there was plenty of time for someone like Kelly to carouse and nightcrawl. Cap Anson once sent out a detective to tail Kelly and came back witht a report that he had seen "Old Kel" drinking lemonade at 3 am. When confronted, Kelly angrily replied, "It was straight whiskey! I never drank lemonade at that hour in my life!"
Lost in all the mystique of his legend is the fact the King Kelly was one hell of a ballplayer. He hit .300 or better eight times, leading the NL in hitting with a .354 average in 1884 and a .388 in 1886. He also led the league three times each in doubles and runs scored, and once scored six runs in one game. He also was a daring baserunning, stealing at least 50 bases for four successive years, once stealing six bases in one game. His baserunning feats led to a popular song in 1889 entitled "Slide, Kelly, Slide".
One interesting tail about Kelly goes like this. In a a game in Chicago one terribly hot summer day in the mid-1880's, Kelly was playing rightfield. Tired and hot he brought a mug of beer with him to the outfield. He decided to take in a few sips as the Stockings Pitcher Larry Corcoran, heaved a fastball right down the middle of the plate The hitter, who's name is lost to time, swung, and sent a screaming shot to right! Without missing a step, Kelly, mug in hand, ran and made a one handed catch, and according to some witnesses, never spilled a drop of the precious liquid.
Cap Anson traded Kelly to the Braves in 1887 for a record $10,000 in one of the biggest deals in baseball's early history, Chicago fans were so upset they boycotted their team, except when Boston played there. As basball entered the&baseballay Nintiethenbsp;Nineties the Boston Players' League Club in 1890 as player-manager, his team capturing the pennant. He hung around for a few more years but was pretty much through as a player, winding up his career with the Giants for a spate of games in 1893
He managed in the minors for a while but his love of the night life made it a short stint in the "bushes" Mike went back to work doing what he did best, being "King Kelly". He opened a saloon in New York that actually made decent money for a while, but eventually folded because Kelly was more interested in being a customer than an owner. Never known as a man who held onto his money, he was generous to a fault with his friends.
In late 1894, he was invited to go to Boston to appear at the Palace Theatre. Hopping a steamer from New York, he caught cold. The cold eventually turned into pneumonia which took his life on November 8th. He was only 36 years old.
One thing can be said about Mike "King" Kelly though, he definately enjoyed life. Although one could never condone his bad habits, he still was one of the most colorful and interesting characters in baseball history."
How could you not like him?
The first thing I would do is take Ivan Rodriguez off all the top five lists....heck, Ted Simmons was better than Ivan Rodriguez.
For comparison sake, here is where Ivan Rodriguez and Piazza rank in the Situational batter runs....
Ivan Rodriguez...70
Piazza................497
No amount of defense can make up that astronomical gap.
Ted Simmons(in a tougher era to accumulate them) got 293.
My quickie top five
Bench
Berra
Piazza
King Kelly(the first super star of baseball). We need an old time representative.
Fisk
<< <i>I STRONGLY disagree with Piazza being ranked over Pudge. Defensively, Piazza couldn't carry Pudge's jock strap (or his TWELVE Gold Gloves), and for catchers that's what counts more. >>
In some bizarro universe, if you are managing a team that can either play Babe Ruth at catcher or Johnny Bench and the other has to sit out - pick Ruth. For that matter, if your only chance to get Ruth in the lineup is to play him at SS and bench Ozzie Smith - play Ruth. No player in history who lasted more than a couple hundred games contributed more in the field to his team winning than he did at the plate - not even Ozzie.
That fact is obscured by rating systems that use +x and -y since a player can be + on defense and - on offense. But those +'s and -'s are relative to the average, and something like 75% of a player's value consists of being average. Some systems arbitrarily assign that average value the number "0", but to say that is the same as having no value couldn't be further from the truth. A shortstop who is -1 is almost certainly a better fielder and more valuable to his team (in the field) than a first baseman who is +1. But of those two, the player who is contributing to more wins for the team will be the one who is the better hitter 999 times out of a thousand. It takes a phenomenal fielder to be as valuable to his team as any player who is a significantly better hitter; and no player in history has fielded well enough to make themselves as valuable as Babe Ruth - no matter where you put him in the field. I loved Pudge when he played here in Dallas and he was a great player, but guys who play in hitter's parks who refuse to take a walk (like Pudge) are the most overrated hitters year in and year out.
That's my looooooong way of saying that Piazza wasn't enough better than Bench at the plate to pass him for best overall, but he was more than enough better than Pudge at the plate to pass him.
It's not like generations past between Fisk and Ivan..
Maybe it's just me but I think the real Pudge deserves a tad more respect.
Perhaps Fisk doesn't mind and makes jokes about it.. I don't know.
Like I said, maybe it's just me.
As Skin has already detailed in his very thorough fashion, Piazza was far better than Pudge, even with his problems throwing out runners. Though that deficiency was always highly publicized in the press, Piazza actually called a great game behind the plate, was a very good fielder, and knew how to handle his pitchers (Clemens being the exception, of course). Piazza is also, arguably, the greatest hitting catcher who ever played the game of baseball.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
2. Bench
3. Campenella
4. Fisk
5.Carter
My selections are based soley on who I personally saw play.
1957 Topps PSA
1961 Fleer SGC