Credit Card Fraud Case update - guy STILL there (4/1/07)

nencoin · April 23, 2007 11:30PM

See my latest post below for update

Do NOT ship any coins to a Jack Young, Jack Youngs, or anyone for that matter with a shipping address of 4357 East Oak Street, Phoenix, AZ, which is a hotel (room 311). Actually, no one should be shipping credit card orders to any address other than the billing address, unless you know the customer. Anyway, the guy is CURRENTLY at that location and is waiting on $10,000 of gold coins that he actually thinks we're shipping to him. I say he's currently there because he emailed last night asking when his coins were arriving. He's used two different stolen credit cards (including the true name and billing address of the owners of the cards) to place these orders. My local police have been contacted....I'm just hoping they act quick enough to nab this guy. I seriously doubt it...this happens frequently, and the bad guys always get away.

The idiot couldn't even remember to use the same last name when he placed the order, which is presumably the false name he's registered under at the hotel. If you are a dealer and HAVE shipped coins to this person or address, contact your local PD immediately. You can try the Phoenix police, but they are most likely going to tell you to contact your local PD first.

Chris

CoinRaritiesOnline · April 23, 2007 11:33PM

Thanks for the head's up, Chris. Nail him!

poorguy · April 23, 2007 11:53PM

Very much appreciate the info. You've probably helped someone save thousands of dollars with your post.

nencoin · April 24, 2007 2:36AM

Just one bumpage before it slips too far down the pages and some sellers might miss it.

StampAlarm · April 24, 2007 2:55AM

Is this an ongoing criminal investigation? I hope the thief doesn't read this thread.

Jerry

MidAtlanticCoins · April 24, 2007 3:34AM

Thanks for the heads up. I supplied a link to this thread on some of the dealer networks also.

CoinOnTheCob · April 24, 2007 3:37AM

Maybe Phoenix PD can swing by with a set of handcuffs or something.

nencoin · April 24, 2007 3:46AM

<< Is this an ongoing criminal investigation? I hope the thief doesn't read this thread.

Jerry >>

Unless he's already a suspect in the Phoenix area, I'm guessing he recently acquired the stolen credit cards and billing addresses, setup temporary shop at the Phoenix Airport hotel and made his orders in a 24 hour or so period. I doubt he's been staying at this hotel for very long. Just a side note (it means nothing other than additional proof of his attempt to scam and hide from the law), he forgot to hide his IP address on the first order he placed with us, but then hid it the second time. The IP address traced back to that hotel.

These guys pull this stuff all the time....we get so many fraudulent orders it's terrible. They never get caught (not in the cases we've been involved in), and I'm sure this guy won't get caught either. While I doubt he's reading the PCGS message boards, I really don't care (that's how disgusted I am with how easily these guys get away with this). I'm more interested in stopping someone from sending him coins, hence the post here and on CCE. Thanks for the additional posting of the link elsewhere, MidAtlantic.

mrearlygold · April 24, 2007 5:35AM

Thanks for the heads up. That's one reason why I will not accept credit cards/paypal on the first order from someone.

itsnotjustme · April 24, 2007 5:47AM

Well I'm glad he only thinks you are shipping the coins.

When I had a high value sale to a person I was not familiar with, I used Google Earth maps to look at the address I was shipping to. It looked like a residential apartment complex in a nice neighborhood (gated security, nice pools, nica green area between buildings.....)

If my customer is reading this, sorry for checking you out!

VTCoins · April 25, 2007 1:04AM

Thank you for the info.

I received a bogus bank check today.

Writersblock · April 25, 2007 5:51AM

It's probably too late now but how about contacting the hotel and advise them that he may be using a stolen credit card to pay THEM. That would establish a local crime to get the local police involved.

Russ · April 25, 2007 6:01AM

<< Actually, no one should be shipping credit card orders to any address other than the billing address >>

Sage advice that far too many internet merchants fail to heed.

Russ, NCNE

wayneherndon · April 25, 2007 6:19AM

Interesting. I got a fake Western Union money order from Phoenix a few months back. Link

Odds are it was the same guy.

WH

mrearlygold · April 25, 2007 6:22AM

Here's one way to deal with these types

"Leave the gun, take the cannoli"

Longacre · April 25, 2007 6:24AM

Everybody has a racket. Doesn't anyone work for an honest wage anymore?

nencoin · April 26, 2007 4:58AM

THIS IS INSANE. The guy is STILL there. He called us 15 minutes ago looking for his package. We put him off by saying FedEx was down and that we'd have the tracking number for him soon. He said he'd call us back. I then immediately called my local PD to inquire about the investigation, and got transferred to the detective squad...and got their VOICE MAIL. I called the front desk of the hotel and told the clerk the situation. He said he thought something was funny with the guy, because they received a package for him and opened it by mistake, and it was chock full of calling cards. He was going straight to his manager to discuss the situation. I then call the Phoenix PD line and hung up after being on hold for over a minute. I can't call 911, since it's not a true emergency. ARGH!

Quick Edit: I tried Phoenix PD again and got through this time...and got response that I knew I'd get. I was told that my local police would have to call them, otherwise there was nothing they could do.

Bochiman · April 26, 2007 5:24AM

Ok, trump the local PD then.
Call the local newspapers and talk to a reporter there. Let THEM get the story and print it about how the creep is doing this and it is largely because the cops are being ineffectual.

I am NOT a cop (I know we have a few on the boards here) and I know more do a great job, so I am not sure of the redtape or what, but I would assume they could at least look into it.

ziggy29 · April 26, 2007 5:29AM

There's the system at work...deliver a crook on a silver platter and they can't be bothered to come and take out the trash.

How's that for mixing metaphors?

hiyosilver · April 26, 2007 5:33AM

I know a couple of guys in that area that would enjoy visiting this azzbag just for the practice.....problem is, they may not leave much of him for the P.D. to pick up.

nencoin · April 26, 2007 10:48PM

Additional update, for anyone who cares. My local detective called me this morning and said he had placed two calls to the Phoenix PD and had not heard back. He said he'd call again this morning to see if he could get them to go pick the guy up. If my PD has truly called twice, then it sounds like Phoenix PD is dropping the ball. Maybe they just have bigger fish to fry than someone stealing credit card information and committing credit card fraud. I talked to the hotel again and they said there's nothing they can do, since the guy hasn't done anything against them. I said he's checked in under a bogus name and likely using a stolen credit card to pay for the room and is definitely using their internet connection to place the fraudulent orders. They said he paid in cash, and they did NOT take a credit card for incidentals (very odd). I didn't know that some hotels (real chain hotels) are still willing to accept cash as a form payment without taking a credit card.

notwilight · April 26, 2007 10:53PM

<< Additional update, for anyone who cares. My local detective called me this morning and said he had placed two calls to the Phoenix PD and had not heard back. He said he'd call again this morning to see if he could get them to go pick the guy up. If my PD has truly called twice, then it sounds like Phoenix PD is dropping the ball. Maybe they just have bigger fish to fry than someone stealing credit card information and committing credit card fraud. I talked to the hotel again and they said there's nothing they can do, since the guy hasn't done anything against them. I said he's checked in under a bogus name and likely using a stolen credit card to pay for the room and is definitely using their internet connection to place the fraudulent orders. They said he paid in cash, and they did NOT take a credit card for incidentals (very odd). I didn't know that some hotels (real chain hotels) are still willing to accept cash as a form payment without taking a credit card. >>

Many cheap hotels take cash and allow you to sign in as John Doe for various reasons but sex with at least one of the parties married to some one else is the major reason for anonymous hotel visits. I pay by cash sometimes when I'm staying a cheap hotels on motorcycle trips just to keep my credit card secure in an unsavory location.

coindeuce · April 26, 2007 11:05PM

Maybe a call to all of the Phoenix newspapers to place a classified ad would be effective. Something to the effect that Joe Smoebody is buying your coins for cash at the Hotel XXXX, room XX will trump him.

flaminio · April 27, 2007 2:19AM

This is an amazing story. nencoin totally has the goods on this guy, and can't get anyone to drive over and pick him up.

We all complain about the rampant fraud on eBay and the Internet, but what can be done if law enforcement is unwilling to get involved? It's the wild wild west all over again.

bluespaceant · April 27, 2007 2:59AM

Russ · April 27, 2007 3:01AM

<< Quick Edit: I tried Phoenix PD again and got through this time...and got response that I knew I'd get. I was told that my local police would have to call them, otherwise there was nothing they could do. >>

When my shop got hit back in the fall of 2002, one of the things that was stolen was the checkbook for my money market account. The scumbag managed to cash a $3250 check at a bank in Seattle. Besides calling the bank, (who didn't seem to give a crap), I called the Seattle PD. They told me that since the burglary happened in Kent, my local PD would have to handle it. I called my local PD, and they told me since the stolen check was cashed in Seattle, the Seattle PD would have to handle it.

Russ, NCNE

Cladiator · April 27, 2007 3:02AM

<< Maybe a call to all of the Phoenix newspapers to place a classified ad would be effective. Something to the effect that Joe Smoebody is buying your coins for cash at the Hotel XXXX, room XX will trump him.

>>

Takes too long. Post it on Craigslist and he'll have folks knocking on his door in minutes.

fc · April 27, 2007 3:05AM

i would call back the hotel and get the person there to call the cops
ASAP. tell them to give it a sense of urgency. the person is creepy
and threatening. ;=)

hm, u tried that it seems. well how about calling back the pd and asking
for a person in charge. not just the cop flunky answering the phones...

sad state of affairs for the pd down there huh? no wonder cc theft is
rampant.

Cladiator · April 27, 2007 3:10AM

On a more serious note, interstate crimes and internet fraud both fall under the jurisdiction of the FBI. It might be worth a call to their Pheonix office.

602-279-5511

Phoenix FBI Regional Field Office Website

basestealer · April 27, 2007 3:19AM

wrong thread

ebaytrader · April 27, 2007 6:37AM

<< On a more serious note, interstate crimes and internet fraud both fall under the jurisdiction of the FBI. It might be worth a call to their Pheonix office.

602-279-5511

Phoenix FBI Regional Field Office Website >>

WinPitcher · April 27, 2007 9:38PM

Maybe they just have bigger fish to fry than someone stealing credit card information and committing credit card fraud.

But I bet if anyone walked in to a grocery store and tried to shoplift a can of tuna and was caught they would be let out in handcuffs to a patrol car!

I think the problem here is that you are in one state and he in another. The hotel should and could do something with 1 call to the police but they are afraid of being sued if they are wrong.

Steve

nencoin · May 1, 2007 3:14AM

An update from last week. The crook placed ANOTHER order over the weekend. Used another stolen billing address, but this time used a different name and shipping address in Phoenix. However, I traced the IP back to the SAME hotel he's been staying at. Then, get this, he calls our office today looking for the package. But he uses the new name from his latest order.

Unbelievable. This guy is incredibly stupid AND bold to have stayed at that location that long.

Cladiator · May 1, 2007 3:16AM

<< Unbelievable. This guy is incredibly stupid AND bold to have stayed at that location that long. >>

He must know that local law enforcement doesn't give a crap what he is doing. Has anyone ever thought that perhaps he reads this forum?

frostbyte · May 1, 2007 3:58AM

This doesn't surprise me at all. My brother use to live in Phoenix and knows 1st hand that over 1/2 the cops are corrupt. They are all receiving pay under the table to leave certain people alone. Then if 2 different groups collide the one with the most $ to give the cops can get the other group arrested. Needless to say, my brother was in the group with less influence and is now in jail. Very sad that you can't trust local law enforcement....almost anywhere.

Just drive down there and find the guy and give him a boot to the head or a bag over it and a boot off a cliff.

Bochiman · May 1, 2007 3:59AM

<< This doesn't surprise me at all. My brother use to live in Phoenix and knows 1st hand that over 1/2 the cops are corrupt. They are all receiving pay under the table to leave certain people alone. Then if 2 different groups collide the one with the most $ to give the cops can get the other group arrested. Needless to say, my brother was in the group with less influence and is now in jail. Very sad that you can't trust local law enforcement....almost anywhere.

Just drive down there and find the guy and give him a boot to the head or a bag over it and a boot off a cliff. >>

So, the police are corrupt and people are paying them off. Your brother was in one of the criminal groups paying off the cops, but at a lesser amount than another criminal group bribing the cops, so your brother, the criminal, is in jail?

Ok.

skeeterhawk · May 1, 2007 4:10AM

<< 

<< This doesn't surprise me at all. My brother use to live in Phoenix and knows 1st hand that over 1/2 the cops are corrupt. They are all receiving pay under the table to leave certain people alone. Then if 2 different groups collide the one with the most $ to give the cops can get the other group arrested. Needless to say, my brother was in the group with less influence and is now in jail. Very sad that you can't trust local law enforcement....almost anywhere.

Just drive down there and find the guy and give him a boot to the head or a bag over it and a boot off a cliff. >>

So, the police are corrupt and people are paying them off. Your brother was in one of the criminal groups paying off the cops, but at a lesser amount than another criminal group bribing the cops, so your brother, the criminal, is in jail?

Ok. >>

This exchange might be worth watching..stay tuned.......

frostbyte · May 1, 2007 4:14AM

I wasn't saying that he didn't deserve to be in jail. Just that he knows the cops are almost all corrupt. He deserves to be in jail. Drug's ruin our society.

Not really worth the watch, huh.

Texast · May 1, 2007 7:07AM

<< I wasn't saying that he didn't deserve to be in jail. Just that he knows the cops are almost all corrupt. He deserves to be in jail. Drug's ruin our society. >>

Your a freakin idiot, you probably wouldn't last a day on the streets

fc · May 1, 2007 7:22AM

why do people dismiss corruption charges against public
officials when we see it happen time and time again!!

http://phoenix.fbi.gov/pxcorrup.htm

The FBI's highly sensitive public corruption investigations focus on all levels of government (local, state and federal) and include allegations of judicial, legislative, regulatory, contract and law enforcement corruption. Law enforcement corruption accounts for more than one-third of the current corruption investigations. These cases typically involve law enforcement officers accepting money to protect or facilitate drug-trafficking and organized criminal activity. Corruption strikes deeply at the public's trust in government.

in my opinion, our govt at all levels is in bad shape. i do not trust
anyone for my welfare.

Bochiman · May 1, 2007 7:33AM

<< 

<< I wasn't saying that he didn't deserve to be in jail. Just that he knows the cops are almost all corrupt. He deserves to be in jail. Drug's ruin our society. >>

Your a freakin idiot, you probably wouldn't last a day on the streets >>

Nah....I can believe that some cops, in some places, are corrupt. They don't get paid much, many cops have a big ego, and it must be hard to see scum make a lot more money than honest, hard-working, folks.

coindeuce · May 1, 2007 7:43AM

So now can we get back on topic and try to help the OP? I know Tom C. and his associates are reputable in the business and would like to do the right thing to see that this scourge is prosecuted and justice is served...

Suggestion: Tom, would a call from the District Attorney's office in your locality to the DA's office in the municipality where the suspect is located be an option? If that doesn't get the ball rolling with law enforcement, I don't know what else would.

PerryHall · May 1, 2007 7:50AM

<< 

<< 

<< I wasn't saying that he didn't deserve to be in jail. Just that he knows the cops are almost all corrupt. He deserves to be in jail. Drug's ruin our society. >>

Your a freakin idiot, you probably wouldn't last a day on the streets >>

Nah....I can believe that some cops, in some places, are corrupt. They don't get paid much, many cops have a big ego, and it must be hard to see scum make a lot more money than honest, hard-working, folks. >>

Are you saying that if you can't beat them, join them?

ILikeMercs · May 1, 2007 7:54AM

I bet if someone put a bullet in that guy, the Phoenix PD would pay attention.

Bochiman · May 1, 2007 8:30AM

<< 

<< 

<< 

<< I wasn't saying that he didn't deserve to be in jail. Just that he knows the cops are almost all corrupt. He deserves to be in jail. Drug's ruin our society. >>

Your a freakin idiot, you probably wouldn't last a day on the streets >>

Nah....I can believe that some cops, in some places, are corrupt. They don't get paid much, many cops have a big ego, and it must be hard to see scum make a lot more money than honest, hard-working, folks. >>

Are you saying that if you can't beat them, join them?

>>

Maybe....

When I was younger and got out of active duty (Army), I thought of going the route of becoming a cop.
Due to a few physical things that happened when I was in, I put it off (disabled vet) but thought of a few other areas that interested me.....I didn't like a lot of the "hot dog" attitudes though. The type that "I have a badge so you have to do what I say no matter what".

There are some good/cool cops too....don't get me wrong. It is just like any other profession....good and bad. Just the good is expected and the bad is more pronounced.
Kinda like the cop who would pull women over and offer to let them go if they "performed" certain acts on him. Was abuse of power/badge/etc, and illegal. He thought he could get away with it due to the badge though.

numisma · May 1, 2007 11:30AM

<< So now can we get back on topic and try to help the OP? I know Tom C. and his associates are reputable in the business and would like to do the right thing to see that this scourge is prosecuted and justice is served...

Suggestion: Tom, would a call from the District Attorney's office in your locality to the DA's office in the municipality where the suspect is located be an option? If that doesn't get the ball rolling with law enforcement, I don't know what else would. >>

I agree. Let's help the OP. I am DT2 on Certified Coin Exchange if you want to call. i have a couple of ideas on how to nail this guy.

coindeuce · May 1, 2007 11:36AM

I'm GT6 at C.C.E. And I'm also available with additional suggestions.

BigE · May 1, 2007 1:07PM

My wife is agent 99 and I am Maxwell Smart, so do something-------------------------------BigE

frostbyte · May 1, 2007 11:45PM

<< 

<< I wasn't saying that he didn't deserve to be in jail. Just that he knows the cops are almost all corrupt. He deserves to be in jail. Drug's ruin our society. >>

Your a freakin idiot, you probably wouldn't last a day on the streets >>

I may not know where this is coming from by your ignorant response, but you seem to be the one that needs the street smarts if you think this doesn't go on all around you in all aspects of life. I don't need to resort to calling you names. You did that yourself by your response.

Boothill40 · May 2, 2007 1:02AM

<< 

<< 

<< I wasn't saying that he didn't deserve to be in jail. Just that he knows the cops are almost all corrupt. He deserves to be in jail. Drug's ruin our society. >>

Your a freakin idiot, you probably wouldn't last a day on the streets >>

I may not know where this is coming from by your ignorant response, but you seem to be the one that needs the street smarts if you think this doesn't go on all around you in all aspects of life. I don't need to resort to calling you names. You did that yourself by your response. >>

Based on an Inmates statement(your brother wouldn't lie to you would he) you slander an entire department on a public forum, not the brightest thing to do but I would agree that name calling is not warranted, as for how they are handling this case I can't answer for them but see the negative image it gives off.
Cross jurisdictional cases are a pain the *$$ and very time consuming so this case may not be a high priority for them but it will be cleared one way or another, the OP needs to stay in contact with the handling Detective and he/she will stay in contact with P.P.D. until the case is dispoed.

ModernCrapNut · May 2, 2007 2:22AM

White collar crime does pay, and very well.

Credit Card Fraud Case update - guy STILL there (4/1/07)

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