Honestly, do dealers really have to do anything for this hobby?
Longacre
Posts: 16,717 ✭✭✭
There were a few threads today that complained about dealers (what else is new). Some threads asked if it was possible to have a numismatic organization that is not run by, controlled by, or had dealer participants. There were other threads indicating that the ANA would be better off if solely collectors were on the board, and not those dastardly dealers. However, people in general think that dealers don't do enough for the hobby.
Honestly, do dealers really have to do anything for this hobby? To them it is just an industry, and there is no obligation that they need to support it actively outside the business aspect of things. Let's take some examples. There are lots of doctors on these boards. We have all types. I don't know a lot about board members' external activities, but percentage wise, I think there are very few doctors that do a significant amount of volunteer work in the medical profession on a yearly basis, like volunteering in a low income clinic. I am a lawyer. The Bar reccomends that all lawyers try to do 40 hours of pro bono work per year. I try really hard to do that, but sometimes I don't reach the 40 hours. Lawyers, like other professionals, are mainly concerned with the day to day business, rather than helping the downtrodden. The same probably holds true for any other industry. For the members of the machinists union on these boards, how much time do you donate to the union?
What I am trying to say that it is not an outrage when dealers for the most part do not do a thing for this hobby. The coin hobby continues anyway, as does the medical, legal, and other professions.
Honestly, do dealers really have to do anything for this hobby? To them it is just an industry, and there is no obligation that they need to support it actively outside the business aspect of things. Let's take some examples. There are lots of doctors on these boards. We have all types. I don't know a lot about board members' external activities, but percentage wise, I think there are very few doctors that do a significant amount of volunteer work in the medical profession on a yearly basis, like volunteering in a low income clinic. I am a lawyer. The Bar reccomends that all lawyers try to do 40 hours of pro bono work per year. I try really hard to do that, but sometimes I don't reach the 40 hours. Lawyers, like other professionals, are mainly concerned with the day to day business, rather than helping the downtrodden. The same probably holds true for any other industry. For the members of the machinists union on these boards, how much time do you donate to the union?
What I am trying to say that it is not an outrage when dealers for the most part do not do a thing for this hobby. The coin hobby continues anyway, as does the medical, legal, and other professions.
Always took candy from strangers
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
0
Comments
Are dealers different ?
Ken
Would WalMart be willing to negotiate on their prices? No.
Would WalMart buy random items from you? No.
It's big business. They don't have to do anything. Dealers are great assets to this hobby, IMO.
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If all of a sudden you had no dealers doing US type coins where do you think prices would go to?
roadrunner
In this day and age, it is becoming difficult to distinguish between a dealer and a collector. Let's face it; some "collectors" trade on a daily basis and some do more volume (dollar-wise) than most dealers. I think the question should be: "should people have to do anything for this hobby?" It really comes down to what kind of person you are.
<< <i>No. And I think that this is what people miss. It's a business for them. Do you see people at WalMart handing out free money to youngsters, and giving helpful advice to others? No.
Would WalMart be willing to negotiate on their prices? No.
Would WalMart buy random items from you? No.
It's big business. They don't have to do anything. Dealers are great assets to this hobby, IMO. >>
Apples and oranges, no corralation between a mega corp and the typical brick and mortar guy. Yes thay do have to do something thay should do, for one very simple reason. Dealers need collectors(which make up a very very small percentage of the pop) to keep their doors open and while mega corps like walmart have lots of advertizing to bring in customers dealers need a good reputation to bring back the few customers avallible in their marketplace. The internet has helped create another outlet for the dealer but a good local base of customers should be his bread and butter.
Chris
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
<< <i>I have noticed from my 40 plus years of working that people that are in a certain trade try to make that trade better, easier to work in and as problem free as possible.
Are dealers different ?
Ken >>
Look at the dealers who choose to personally and regularly spend time on this forum and the one across the street. I know some people get heartburn from a few of them but that isn't the point. The ones who post the most here don't come here trawling for business. They are genuinely interested in coins, education, a fair market, etc.
This whole forum is a great club itself. Where else will collectors with clearly millions in classic rarities, esteemed numismatic luminaries, kids in high school, folks with grease under their nails from work all interact as peers with about the same levels of variable respect that many of us remember among others on the street corner growing up in the city? (Some have thinner skin than others though and don't handle it as well.) Don't need to name names, but it is really nice how well we do all associate. A shame some of the others are gone but I don't want to turn this into a Free Coinguy thread.
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I'm a lawyer too. Here in Texas we have no problem getting the recommended Pro Bono. I simply work all year, and whatever client doesn't pay their bill, well that was the pro bono!
Rex
<< <i>Longacre,
I'm a lawyer too. Here in Texas we have no problem getting the recommended Pro Bono. I simply work all year, and whatever client doesn't pay their bill, well that was the pro bono!
Rex >>
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i>
<< <i>No. And I think that this is what people miss. It's a business for them. Do you see people at WalMart handing out free money to youngsters, and giving helpful advice to others? No.
Would WalMart be willing to negotiate on their prices? No.
Would WalMart buy random items from you? No.
It's big business. They don't have to do anything. Dealers are great assets to this hobby, IMO. >>
Apples and oranges, no corralation between a mega corp and the typical brick and mortar guy. Yes thay do have to do something thay should do, for one very simple reason. Dealers need collectors(which make up a very very small percentage of the pop) to keep their doors open and while mega corps like walmart have lots of advertizing to bring in customers dealers need a good reputation to bring back the few customers avallible in their marketplace. The internet has helped create another outlet for the dealer but a good local base of customers should be his bread and butter.
Chris >>
If you buy a can of peas at Wal-Mart and the can has a dent in it you get your money back. Wal-Mart deals in widgets - no gray areas. Coin dealers sell a product that is subject to interpretation - how honest or dishonest they are will determine how successful they will be. What they "do" for the hobby is in large part the advertising budget of the business. When coin dealers are giving away Washington dollars at a show it is for the potential future business as a result of the goodwill. Are they obligated to do it? No. Is it in their best interest to do it? Yes. Simply a good business decison.
Collector of Early 20th Century U.S. Coinage.
ANA Member R-3147111
Do some donate a lot of time and money? Yes.
Are some dealers (and collectors) just greedy people that would do just about anything to make a quick buck? Yes.
Is this true in most industries, most professions? Yes.
That said, Americans in general, are generous and giving folks. Many coin dealers contribute time and money to other worthy causes. The world doesn't revolve about coins and collectors. Some collectors are on the level of the worst of the dealers and some of these low lifes are the very first in line for any donated time or coins made available. Seeing that kind of behavior probably makes a lot of dealers cynical about giving back to the hobby. The analogy might be ball players that used to sign autographs for all the kids, until they found out that the kids were selling the autographs the next day, or were paid by some dealer shark to get them.
P.S. Longacre: I was required to do 45 hours pro-bono for my daughter's school each year. If I didn't meet my quota that was just fine, all I and to do was donate $50/hr to the school. Perhaps lawyers should be able to donate money if they can't meet a minimum commitment?