Options
.
Fletcher
Posts: 3,294 ✭
.
0
Comments
thanx for the giveaway
Jim
Menomonee Falls Wisconsin USA
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistr...dset.aspx?s=68269&ac=1">Musky 1861 Mint Set
next time change file name
Very nice coin though
Jim
Menomonee Falls Wisconsin USA
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistr...dset.aspx?s=68269&ac=1">Musky 1861 Mint Set
Knowledge is power.......as kranky says, read as much as you can about the coins - buy the book, then buy the coins.
every treasure on Earth
to be young at heart?
And as rich as you are,
it's much better by far,
to be young at heart!
NSDR - Life Member
SSDC - Life Member
ANA - Pay As I Go Member
NEWMAN 104-FF in Brass
We too suspected it might be brass, though I would be cuatious about attributing these by rust patterns. I would
also be cautious about taking the POP report in this area too literally.
Rust patterns are a reflection of the state of the die, and unless all the brass planchets were struck after all the copper planchets (or vice
versa) that isn't an indicator of composition.
Many of these are not attributed correctly in the slabs, and frankly its often difficult to tell which are brass and which are copper.
Happy collecting,
Dave W.
Coin Rarities Online
I knew it would happen.
By the way, what did PCGS attribute it as?
Looking in the Rd Book, it says:
Copper or Brass....................same price in EF, AU, UNC
I'm not up on my early copper(brass), but is there a big price difference or rarity in these for the different compositions???
wes
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
Several things to consider here:
1) These Fugio restrikes were struck in copper, brass, brassy copper, and coppery brass (as well as silver and gold, but we'll ignore those for now). Some look to be clearly copper, some have the golden hue of brass, and many (actually most) are kind of in-between. When they are worn, they all merge into a deep brown and are just about impossible to distinguish anyway.
2) For years, no one made much of a distinction between copper or brass examples because they were difficult or impossible to tell apart, they were worth the same amount and no one (or possibly very few people) collected them by composition or cared.
3) PCGS has, in my experience, slabbed these as copper for years, whether they were clearly copper or if they had a brassy look. The current PCGS POP reports reflect this, as there are today 117 Fugio Restrikes (BN, RB and RD) slabbed as copper, and only 3 so far slabbed as brass.
4) However, if you submitted a brassy one and used the PCGS coin number for brass it was likely to come back labeled as brass. As an aside, there are other colonial issues (which I described to Fletcher by PM) where the attributions were a bit lax in the early years of slabbing (such as Washington Draped Bust Restrikes vs Originals, Machin's Mills coinage, etc.), rendering the PCGS pop reports largely unhelpful in these areas.
5) Brass examples are not great rarities. I believe many of the Fugio Restrikes currently in 'copper' holders could be called brass today.
6) You cannot tell the composition of these by the rust pattern on the coins because that is in the die and has nothing to do with the planchet stock.
Fletcher's coin looks nice to me. And it may be brass. And PCGS might slab it as brass. But I do not believe that brass examples - even if they can be identified - are especially rare or unusual, and I wouldn't pay a premium for one. But someone else might.
I'll close with a picture of a coin we handled last year in a PCGS slab labeled as copper. I have no idea if it is brass or not, but it certainly looks more brassy than some of the copper ones I've seen:
<< <i>I wasn't going to post in this thread, but I changed my mind.
Several things to consider here:
1) These Fugio restrikes were struck in copper, brass, brassy copper, and coppery brass (as well as silver and gold, but we'll ignore those for now). Some look to be clearly copper, some have the golden hue of brass, and many (actually most) are kind of in-between. When they are worn, they all merge into a deep brown and are just about impossible to distinguish anyway.
2) For years, no one made much of a distinction between copper or brass examples because they were difficult or impossible to tell apart, they were worth the same amount and no one (or possibly very few people) collected them by composition or cared.
3) PCGS has, in my experience, slabbed these as copper for years, whether they were clearly copper or if they had a brassy look. The current PCGS POP reports reflect this, as there are today 117 Fugio Restrikes (BN, RB and RD) slabbed as copper, and only 3 so far slabbed as brass.
4) However, if you submitted a brassy one and used the PCGS coin number for brass it was likely to come back labeled as brass. As an aside, there are other colonial issues (which I described to Fletcher by PM) where the attributions were a bit lax in the early years of slabbing (such as Washington Draped Bust Restrikes vs Originals, Machin's Mills coinage, etc.), rendering the PCGS pop reports largely unhelpful in these areas.
5) Brass examples are not great rarities. I believe many of the Fugio Restrikes currently in 'copper' holders could be called brass today.
6) You cannot tell the composition of these by the rust pattern on the coins because that is in the die and has nothing to do with the planchet stock.
Fletcher's coin looks nice to me. And it may be brass. And PCGS might slab it as brass. But I do not believe that brass examples - even if they can be identified - are especially rare or unusual, and I wouldn't pay a premium for one. But someone else might.
I'll close with a picture of a coin we handled last year in a PCGS slab labeled as copper. I have no idea if it is brass or not, but it certainly looks more brassy than some of the copper ones I've seen:
Very informative post. Thanks.
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)