Grade this Gobrecht, please...

MrEureka · February 9, 2007 5:13AM

ziggy29 · February 9, 2007 5:15AM

+1

Barndog · February 9, 2007 5:15AM

too much for my budget

Aegis3 · February 9, 2007 5:16AM

Well, the non-existent one is an 1893-S Morgan, while the imaginary one is a 1888 Honduran 20 pesos. Of course, I'm not sure how to compare to unreal objects, so they may technically be the same afterall.

coinmickey · February 9, 2007 5:17AM

Yes?

nencoin · February 9, 2007 5:18AM

*poof*

BobGreene · February 9, 2007 5:19AM

fivecents · February 9, 2007 5:19AM

I think i'm going to cry.

Sad, Very sad.

petescamp · February 9, 2007 5:31AM

Julian · February 9, 2007 5:42AM

The Gobrecht looks nice, Andy, but I am not too sure about the color without seeing it in person.

richardshipp · February 9, 2007 5:51AM

BigMoose · February 9, 2007 5:57AM

PCGS PR63

longtimecollector · February 9, 2007 6:01AM

Please enter me in your most generous give-a-way

RichieURich · February 9, 2007 6:35AM

PR64 is my guess, maybe PR65, but I'm not too keen on the color.

speety · February 9, 2007 6:45AM

PF-65

jdimmick · February 9, 2007 6:50AM

Pf-65, I am not big on the color though, it kind of looks on the borderline of questionable.

291fifth · February 9, 2007 7:13AM

Premium Quality BU

TahoeDale · February 9, 2007 7:45AM

I like it. Pr 63 or 64

BlindedByEgo · February 9, 2007 7:48AM

AT, NT, 63 or 64 - I don't care. I like the coin for the piece of history that it is.

Lakesammman · February 9, 2007 8:31AM

P64

IGWT · February 9, 2007 8:38AM

Those of you who researched the grade by tracking Andy's image to Heritage made a mistake. Right coin, wrong auction.

Edited to add: Interesting.

relicsncoins · February 9, 2007 8:41AM

What's wrong with the color? I personally like the color and the coin, and I'll say PF-64.

JJ

Musky1011 · February 9, 2007 8:45AM

Wowee Zowee

NumisOxide · February 9, 2007 8:51AM

Me likey

PR64

messydesk · February 9, 2007 8:57AM

PR63. Me likey.

JRocco · February 9, 2007 9:00AM

Interesting.....

poorguy · February 9, 2007 9:25AM

Proofs are IMPOSSIBLE to grade from images in the PR64-PR66 range unless there is some amazingly distracting feature. You need to see the hairlines on the mirrored surfaces to accurately determine the grade. I would have to say PR64.

IGWT · February 9, 2007 9:26AM

<< Interesting..... >>

Maybe "interesting" is too subtle a word. Or is there another reason why this thread hasn't yet hit 100?

JRocco · February 9, 2007 9:37AM

<< 

<< Interesting..... >>

Maybe "interesting" is too subtle a word. Or is there another reason why this thread hasn't yet hit 100?

>>

Good point...

Hey Andy--what slab does this little beauty reside in???
At the present time that is?

Russ · February 9, 2007 10:33AM

<< Edited to add: Interesting. >>

That goes way beyond interesting! More of the seamy underbelly of the coin biz.

Russ, NCNE

Russ · February 9, 2007 10:41AM

For those who don't wish to wade through the thread IGWT linked, here are the relevant details posted by MikeinFL:

<< Here's the rest of the story...

Coin #2 graded Improperly Cleaned--NCS Proof, sold in April 2006 for just shy of $20k.

Coin #1 graded PCGS PR 63 sold in Jan 2007 for a cool $46k. >>

Coin #1 refers to the image Andy posted in this thread. Coin number two was the same coin when it was bright, shiney, and untoned.

Russ, NCNE

Lakesammman · February 9, 2007 10:52AM

There seem to be more marks that don't line up than "marks" that do.

Tassa · February 9, 2007 10:53AM

<< For those who don't wish to wade through the thread IGWT linked, here are the relevant details posted by MikeinFL:

<< Here's the rest of the story...

Coin #2 graded Improperly Cleaned--NCS Proof, sold in April 2006 for just shy of $20k.

Coin #1 graded PCGS PR 63 sold in Jan 2007 for a cool $46k. >>

Coin #1 refers to the image Andy posted in this thread. Coin number two was the same coin when it was bright, shiney, and untoned.

Russ, NCNE >>

If it's the same coin, that is interesting...and disturbing.

Russ · February 9, 2007 10:59AM

<< There seem to be more marks that don't line up than "marks" that do. >>

If you compare the jumbo sized images, they are clearly the same coin. For example, both have an indentical gouge in Miss Liberty's neck.

Russ, NCNE

Russ · February 9, 2007 11:03AM

Russ, NCNE

RYK · February 9, 2007 11:05AM

The pendulum should be about to swing toward "White is Right" when you start seeing this kind of thing happening.

tradedollarnut · February 9, 2007 11:11AM

They are clearly the same coin. Pretty damn sad the experts can't keep this crap out of holders if you ask me.

coinkat · February 9, 2007 11:17AM

I think this one needs to be seen...

PokerGenius · February 9, 2007 11:29AM

bestclser1 · February 9, 2007 11:37AM

Killed by harsh cleaning job.Damn shame.

Toning is funky too.JMO

Russ · February 9, 2007 11:41AM

<< Killed by harsh cleaning job.Damn shame. >>

Then artificially toned and graded.

Russ, NCNE

GoldenEyeNumismatics · February 9, 2007 11:52AM

Pr64

IGWT · February 9, 2007 11:53AM

<< Killed by harsh cleaning job.Damn shame.

>>

And resurrected by an AT job and a slab. I don't know of any small-time collector who can buy into a coin for $20K, work it over and into a respected TPG slab, and flip it for $46K.

JRocco · February 9, 2007 11:58AM

<< 

<< Killed by harsh cleaning job.Damn shame.

>>

And resurrected by an AT job and a slab. I don't know of any small-time collector who can buy into a coin for $20K, work it over and into a respected TPG slab, and flip it for $46K. >>

I wonder how long it took this person to work this coin???
Figure that he or she made a cool 26 THOUSAND DOLLARS on this one coin flip alone. Say 3 hours....4 hours....8 hours or 1 actual day of work...jeeze even lawyers don't make that kind of money.....

Lakesammman · February 9, 2007 12:01PM

Thanks for the closeups - you're right.

I shouldn't be looking and posting w/o my glasses.

So, is anyone surprised? Or is it just more shocking to see proof?

RYK · February 9, 2007 12:22PM

Well, nothing really new here. I nearly got burned today in a similar circumstance with a much more subtle "recoloring over a cleaned coin" job. This example just happens to be much more dramatic and expen$ive.

stman · February 9, 2007 12:38PM

I thought I heard green was the toughest to duplicate? They were talking about Morgans I think. Well, green coming to a Morgan near you, or has it already?

Newmismatist · February 9, 2007 12:40PM

<< 

<< Killed by harsh cleaning job.Damn shame. >>

Then artificially toned and graded.

Russ, NCNE >>

That coin may have been expertly "lasered" which would account for the "Odd" look of the white coin - then re-colored to fool the experts - almost as bad as the doctored MS65RD Indian cent I wrote about after last years FUN show - also a 5 figure hatchet job.

mirabela · February 9, 2007 12:45PM

My guess is that this was not a 2-hour job. More like someone knew exactly the right kind of tissue paper to wrap the poor thing in & sock it away in the nook over the furnace for a year or so, misting the whole package lightly each day. Or something. (Note -- this is hypothetical. I have not tried this procedure, nor do I recommend you to do so). My point is just that the color, however sketchy, does look like the kind of thing that took some time.

What was the time lag between the two auctions?

clw54 · February 9, 2007 12:51PM

What a fuddernuttering racket this all is. Operators and suckers.

RYK · February 9, 2007 12:58PM

<< What a fuddernuttering racket this all is. Operators and suckers. >>

Yeah, but I got in trouble last time you said that.

Grade this Gobrecht, please...

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