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Need help screening 20th anniversary SAE sets for grading.
Lionel
Posts: 536 ✭
Hi everybody.
This is a follow-up to my "what to do with 20th Anniversary SAE sets" post.
The background is that I have ten sets, and I opened the box and looked at a set before I found out about the "first strike" thing. I've kicked myself until my backside is numb and I'm ready to get on with life.
I don't want to break up the sets (I want to preserve history, not destroy it), but I would like to know if I've got a reverse proof PF70 in there, and grading is the only way.
Some of you suggested that I look at them myself and send in the ones that have a chance at PF70 grades. That would certainly save some money, and I would be willing to do that if I knew how.
I don't want to become a coin grader in general. I just want to be able to tell if a proof SAE type coin is or is not worth getting graded.
So, what do I need? Special magnifying glass? Fancy lamp? Hi-Rez digital camera? (Maybe I could take pics and enlarge them on my computer). Electron microscope?
Even with this stuff, what do I look for in proof coins that come right from the Mint in capsules? Aren't we just talking about manufacturing anomalies here? What could cause grade differences, unless an employee dropped one and picked it up with sweaty hands and then wiped it off on his/her shirt before putting it in the capsule? Of course, the whole process is likely automated, so how do different grades happen, other than dies slowly wearing out as coins are struck?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Ya' all are a wealth of knowledge.
This is a follow-up to my "what to do with 20th Anniversary SAE sets" post.
The background is that I have ten sets, and I opened the box and looked at a set before I found out about the "first strike" thing. I've kicked myself until my backside is numb and I'm ready to get on with life.
I don't want to break up the sets (I want to preserve history, not destroy it), but I would like to know if I've got a reverse proof PF70 in there, and grading is the only way.
Some of you suggested that I look at them myself and send in the ones that have a chance at PF70 grades. That would certainly save some money, and I would be willing to do that if I knew how.
I don't want to become a coin grader in general. I just want to be able to tell if a proof SAE type coin is or is not worth getting graded.
So, what do I need? Special magnifying glass? Fancy lamp? Hi-Rez digital camera? (Maybe I could take pics and enlarge them on my computer). Electron microscope?
Even with this stuff, what do I look for in proof coins that come right from the Mint in capsules? Aren't we just talking about manufacturing anomalies here? What could cause grade differences, unless an employee dropped one and picked it up with sweaty hands and then wiped it off on his/her shirt before putting it in the capsule? Of course, the whole process is likely automated, so how do different grades happen, other than dies slowly wearing out as coins are struck?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Ya' all are a wealth of knowledge.
Anyone can make a difference, but most people probably shouldn't. -- Marge Simpson
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Comments
You either learn, one way or another, or you pay for it one way or another.
If you learn to grade, you won't (usually) lose money on grading fees for items that suck and aren't worth it.
If you don't learn, you pay to have them graded for you.
In general, though, take a look, in the light, at your coins. Tilt them and move them around in the light. If you have any glitteries, dings, spots, stains, etc, then you don't have a PR70.
It may help to have a loupe (5x should be fine, 10x if you want to really look for things), but if you spot issues with your bare eyes, don't expect a "perfect" coin.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
If you insist on doing it yourself, if you are near-sighted you may need no tools at all. Otherwise a 5x loupe or magnifier may be helpful. That said, examine each coin without any aids first. Take 10 to 30 seconds carefully looking at the obverse and then the reverse. Look for obvious contact marks, haze, distractions. Any coins with those have close to zero chance at 70 at PCGS. Maybe do this twice or three times with some kind of blind labeling system to see if you are imagining things or spotting real flaws.
After the naked eye screen, go over all the coins with the loupe/magnifier. This will take longer. Again, it may be helpful to use some kind of blind labeling system to see if the same coins look nice during each process. The coins that have no obvious flaws, marks, distractions are the coins that may have the best chance. It depends on how good your untrained eye is. Again, a specialist will be light years ahead of what you can see and discern. It takes time to learn how to grade, that and looking at a lot of coins.
Not a 70, a tiny hit below I, and a hit next to the lower serif on the letter T. All 10 have identical marks, figures.
morgans
<< <i>In general, though, take a look, in the light, at your coins. Tilt them and move them around in the light. If you have any glitteries, dings, spots, stains, etc, then you don't have a PR70.
It may help to have a loupe (5x should be fine, 10x if you want to really look for things), but if you spot issues with your bare eyes, don't expect a "perfect" coin. >>
What Bochiman said.
Obviously you do not feel comfortable evaluating them youself. I would send in all the Reverse proofs UNLESS there is an obvious issue as Bochiman listed. These coins in 69, and of course a 70 will be worth grading. Most should grade 69 ($300 coin)
As for the other 2 coins I would pick out maybe 1 or 2 of each that I thought looked 100% perfect and send them in also, these will not get the 20th anniversary designation. This will give you an idea of your eye for grading and only cost a little.
Whatever Reverse proofs you don't send in make up a set and sell on eBay ($200 set)
Wish you luck whatever you do.
Rookie Joe
edited for spelling
I'll look into getting a loupe.
I'm rather detail oriented. I've done computer artwork at 600dpi where I can see a single pixel that's out of place.
I never once thought I could identify a PF70, but I really just wanted to screen out the ones not worth submitting.
Here is the new Pop report
799977 2006-P $1 Eagle-20th Anniv. Rev Pr PR 438 852 58 1,348
58 of 1348 PR70 %4.3
910 of 1348 PR69 or PR70 %67
Joe
Great picture! I see exactly what you're talking about.
I'm anxious to see what these do on ebay now that they are sold out.
I agree with you.
I think it's just a matter of common sense to at least wait until the Mint is no longer shipping them, and that will likely be through the end of this year. Next year at this time things could be very different.
The people who have been flipping them on EBAY for the past month have about as much common sense as the people who've been buying them there, in my opinion.
<< <i>TommyB,
I agree with you.
I think it's just a matter of common sense to at least wait until the Mint is no longer shipping them, and that will likely be through the end of this year. Next year at this time things could be very different.
The people who have been flipping them on EBAY for the past month have about as much common sense as the people who've been buying them there, in my opinion. >>
Don't know why you have to insult people who are selling them. nor those buying them.
You do realize that some people have turned a 60-2000+% profit in a month's time, right? Much better than the stock market or anything else like that.
Not everyone can afford to hold and wait, yet, you wish to disparage them without knowing all the details?
As for those buying on ebay......why disparage them? Maybe they believe in the sets and have exhausted all other avenues of purchase from the Mint (using friends/relatives, etc) and want more for speculation/investment.
I just don't understand why you have to disparage like that....
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
In the world of PCGS most eagles are 68 or 69's
I'm sorry that my words were mistinerpreted to mean....
Oops. I mean I'm sorry for any feelings I hurt by my post. I was thinking just as a cold hearted profix maximizing intermediate-term trader and was obvoiusly not taking every EBAY'ers possible situation into account.
You're right, some have made huge profits, but I think you'll agree that those phenominal profits were made by those who knew how the "first strike" rules worked (I didn't at the time, and I destroyed a lot of value by simply opening the package I got from the mint.) and got their coins graded (and happene do get some really good grades) to market right away. I actually just saw a set that PCGS graded at all 68, and it went for less than most of the recent raw sets did.
I was referring to only the raw three coin sets, not graded coins.
And, I was referring to the frenzy of the first couple of weeks, where some were selling these raw sets on EBAY for amounts that seemed like they would barely cover their listing fees and the EBAY comission (those take a bite!). It makes no sense to me to buy something like a limited edition coin set from the Mint if I couldn't afford to keep it for more than a few weeks. I'd just go do something else, but that's me.
It was like a collision of the "quick flippers for whatever reason" with those who simply don't know that the Mint sells coins direct and the big-timers who want way more than the 10 per household so they're buying up lots of the sets up front to get a long-term supply of that Reverse Proof coin.
Anyway, I'm sorry for my disparaging comment, and that I even had to learn how to spell that word.
<< <i>Go ahead and send them all in. I hope everybody does, then I will have the last ten in OMP, and a lot of people pay bigger bucks for those than they do graded coins. The more people that send theirs in, the better.
I'm anxious to see what these do on ebay now that they are sold out. >>
you'll have 10 of the last 11.........
FYI that, in principle, I agree with you. One thing that I had in mind (and, I can afford 10 sets if I want), is that some people buy the max, sell a handful, make the profit, and then have "free" sets left to hold onto. If they go up more, great, if not, then there is no cost in them anyway, right?
I've done that on a few. Made a few winners, held a few turkeys. But, overall, the cost to me was $0 as I had sold enough to do that.
Same for these sets. I sold 1 set on ebay to test the water and 3 for a friend of mine who wanted to get some profit locked and order a few more. (I received 10 sets so far...and friend has ordered 10 more for me, last month). I sent 5 unopened sets off for grading (see other thread from yesterday for results). Some did excellent. Some where turkeys. I made my money back though.
So, there are many reasons for many actions....that was the only point I was trying to make. Everyone has reasons.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment