The Proof!!
Bryan1315
Posts: 579
Ok I am in no way bashing ANACS but I have heard the many rumors of how easily the slabs were to crack open but have never seen any proof of it being done, well i decided to do my own experiment and well here is the results
As you can see this is not a 1881-S morgan in the slab anymore and it is not a DMPL Obverse, and as you can tell there is no evidence of the holder being tampered with. I just wanted to show that this could be done to warn everyone that something needs to change with these holders and fast. Someone putting a 1881-S Morgan in a slightly lesser grade (to go unoticed) wouldn't be a big price effective problem (even though you wouldn't be getting what you are paying for) but some coins in these slabs in one grade up sell for thousands of dollars more and could go undetected because grading is so subjective. Another BIG problem is the main reason people use TPG in the first place, "Authentication" someone could take an original coin out of the ANACS new slab and replace it with a counterfit and the authentication goes out the window. Just for verification this is the coin that came in the slab before the 2 minutes of careful removal to make sure I didn't crack the slab
As you can see this is not a 1881-S morgan in the slab anymore and it is not a DMPL Obverse, and as you can tell there is no evidence of the holder being tampered with. I just wanted to show that this could be done to warn everyone that something needs to change with these holders and fast. Someone putting a 1881-S Morgan in a slightly lesser grade (to go unoticed) wouldn't be a big price effective problem (even though you wouldn't be getting what you are paying for) but some coins in these slabs in one grade up sell for thousands of dollars more and could go undetected because grading is so subjective. Another BIG problem is the main reason people use TPG in the first place, "Authentication" someone could take an original coin out of the ANACS new slab and replace it with a counterfit and the authentication goes out the window. Just for verification this is the coin that came in the slab before the 2 minutes of careful removal to make sure I didn't crack the slab
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Comments
Make that six, please.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
<< <i> Please photograph the 4 sides of the slab
Make that six, please. >>
Sorry--edges
Whether or not it had the "right" coin in there, in your pic, I would immediately question the slab because of what the left side looks like.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>Please photograph the 4 sides of the slab >>
Doesn't need to. The cracked seam is obvious in the image. Yes, they are easy to pop open, but it's also easy to detect when it's been done.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Can you confirm for us if this is the Generation 1 or Generation 2 of the new style ANACS slab? There are two distinct versions of the new holder and the Generation 1 is incredibly less sturdy than the Generation 2. >>
I am pretty sure that is the Second Generation- the logo and border decorations are gray instead of gold.
-Amanda
I'm a YN working on a type set!
My Buffalo Nickel Website Home of the Quirky Buffaloes Collection!
Proud member of the CUFYNA
Russ - To those of us that have not seen many new ANACS slabs, it's not obvious. Please explain.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>The cracked seam is obvious in the image.
Russ - To those of us that have not seen many new ANACS slabs, it's not obvious. Please explain. >>
Look at the edge on the left side.
Russ, NCNE
Opposite "In God We Trust"?
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Bryan, can you image it with the two halves separated?
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
<< <i>Can you confirm for us if this is the Generation 1 or Generation 2 of the new style ANACS slab? There are two distinct versions of the new holder and the Generation 1 is incredibly less sturdy than the Generation 2. >>
I am not sure, I can tell you I had a 1909 VDB come before this one and it was alot more flimsy than this one (I wasn't aware there was a version 1 or version 2) but from the information you are stating I am guessing it is a Version 2 because like I said the slab the 1909VDB was in was alot more bendable than this one was. Now as far as taking pictures of all the sides, the slab and is in the big trashcan outside now and since it is dark it may be tomorrow before I will be able to go out there and dig it out and peice it back together to take the other pictures you are requesting, but I can tell you there was absolutely no evidence of tampering with the slab at all that I could see. The slab the 1909 VDB was in I wasn't very careful with it, i just twisted it in my hands and it poped open and it had a crack in it (a small hairline crack but a crack none the less) and when I saw how easy it was to crack open and I already had this one on its way i decided i would take a little better care with this one and see how easy it was and take the picture of the other coin in the slab. I can say it was harder to get the 1971 Dollar coin out after i had super glued the slab in a few spots than it was to get the morgan out of it. Oh yeah here is the auction where this morgan was purchased from (even though in the title it says MS-63 you can clearly see the slab says 64) http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150053474167
Had you left the IKE in the holder, the places where the super glue was applied would have hazed at that precise points of contact. These acrylic cases do not like super glue...yes, it bonds the two components together, but a visible change occurs after a short period of time indicating exactly that it had been tampered with.
Nice test none the less.
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
Good CA glue
kicker
Point is that hazing is not a sure thing with CA.
<< <i>JFYI Some foam safe CA's while used sparingly with accelerator will not haze plastic.
Point is that hazing is not a sure thing with CA. >>
I see your point, you do not even need to be a good coin doctor now days to hide your misdeeds
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
Version 1 the logo is above the grade oval and the oval is larger. Background dark blue
Version 2 logo is to left of the oval, border of oval and fill of logo is gold. Background dark blue
Version 3 Logo to left of oval, border of oval and fill of logo is silver gray. Background dark blue
Version 4 Logo to left of oval, border of oval and fill of logo is silver gray. Background light blue
Version 5 Same as 4 but steps have been taken to make the case stronger and more difficult to crack. No visual difference noted yet.
There is also some playing around with the font sizes and bold/not bold on the angled top of the label. I haven't been able to come up with definite time periods for them. They seem to change at random.
<< <i>I belive the area Russ is talking about is on the side closest to Liberty's nose. See the below photo with the section circled in red. Correct Russ? >>
Correct. Notice that the cracks in the plastic don't appear in the original auction image.
Russ, NCNE