When bidding by phone at an auction--how is it arranged, do you select the rep, and is the rep impar
Longacre
Posts: 16,717 ✭✭✭
I have never bid by phone in a major auction before, but I think the concept is cool. On the coolness scale (in ascending order), bidding in an auction goes as follows:
(1) You go and bid yourself (if you do this, people know you're a wannabe)
(2) You hire a dealer to represent you (sounds cool in concept, but the dealer is there anyway, and probably is just going for the free meal)
(3) You are an anonymous phone bidder (by far, the coolest method of them all)
I've been to a few live auctions, and no one knows the power of the auction process until the bidding gets heated, and the eyes of the room turn toward the phone bank, and everyone knows that some big wig is calling the shots on the other end. Nothing (and I mean nothing) goes on until the phone bidder determines that he is either in or out of the bidding. It is a powerful position to be in.
For those who have bid by phone:
(a) Do you get to select the representative that you want to deal with on the phone? For example, if you are a really Big Fish, can you ask (politely) that QDB himself field your phone bidding?
(b) What sort of arrangements need to be made before hand?
(c) Can the representative offer any advice during the bidding process? For example, if the bidder was present in the room, he would be able to see the whites of the eyes of other bidders. Can the phone bidder ask the rep who is bidding in the room against him? Or is the phone rep required to just relay the bids from the phone bidder to the auctioneer?
(d) Do phone bidders usually go at it alone, or is he in a room full of numismatic advisors (or on a conference call) where he could get real time advice from his advisor before submitting a bid?
(e) In this situation, does it ever get confusing for a rep as to whether the phone bidder has authorized a bid or not?
(f) Is there a numismatic minimum that you must meet in order to be a phone bidder? Somehow, I don't think an auction firm would field my phone bids if I was bidding on a raw XF quarter eagle (value $150), and the rep had to deal with screaming kids in the background during the call. What are the rules for signing up for phone bidding?
(1) You go and bid yourself (if you do this, people know you're a wannabe)
(2) You hire a dealer to represent you (sounds cool in concept, but the dealer is there anyway, and probably is just going for the free meal)
(3) You are an anonymous phone bidder (by far, the coolest method of them all)
I've been to a few live auctions, and no one knows the power of the auction process until the bidding gets heated, and the eyes of the room turn toward the phone bank, and everyone knows that some big wig is calling the shots on the other end. Nothing (and I mean nothing) goes on until the phone bidder determines that he is either in or out of the bidding. It is a powerful position to be in.
For those who have bid by phone:
(a) Do you get to select the representative that you want to deal with on the phone? For example, if you are a really Big Fish, can you ask (politely) that QDB himself field your phone bidding?
(b) What sort of arrangements need to be made before hand?
(c) Can the representative offer any advice during the bidding process? For example, if the bidder was present in the room, he would be able to see the whites of the eyes of other bidders. Can the phone bidder ask the rep who is bidding in the room against him? Or is the phone rep required to just relay the bids from the phone bidder to the auctioneer?
(d) Do phone bidders usually go at it alone, or is he in a room full of numismatic advisors (or on a conference call) where he could get real time advice from his advisor before submitting a bid?
(e) In this situation, does it ever get confusing for a rep as to whether the phone bidder has authorized a bid or not?
(f) Is there a numismatic minimum that you must meet in order to be a phone bidder? Somehow, I don't think an auction firm would field my phone bids if I was bidding on a raw XF quarter eagle (value $150), and the rep had to deal with screaming kids in the background during the call. What are the rules for signing up for phone bidding?
Always took candy from strangers
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
0
Comments
a P-51 Mustang that was removed from the jungle of Borneo and was being auctioned in Sydney Australia.
It was a night mare because of International Date Line/time zones/International Bidding & Buying Restrictions
on War Materials/money conversion tables...the list went on and on.
Much correspondence and phone calls...lots in writing where signatures, agreements and certified funds
had to be allocated just to be able to bid.
It was set up where the auction house called the phone number provided a full twenty minutes before
the item to be bid on went up for sale. You got a random floor bidder (I think they called it a consignment bidder)
with bid number placard. Really all you knew was his name and he would give a blow by blow of what
was the going price by the auctioneer entering Aussie dollars converting into American dollars. You agreed
on a word that both parties understood for the phone bidder to relay to the floor bidder the “right” to bid
on their behalf. We weren’t sure if this phone conversation was recorded…it was a transpacific call and there
was always noise in the back ground, but I’m sure it was.
There was a minimum bid which everyone knew and it soon escaladed into hundreds of thousands of dollars.
My boss was doing a lot of listening and then said “Go!” Nobody knew what that meant, but he just put a bid
of about $248,000.00
He had no idea who he was bidding against, whether they were on the floor or on the phone also. Mind you,
this is a crashed P-51 that sat in the jungle for 40 years and could not even fly. But there again, they do not
pop up for auction very often so you need to take advantage of situations when your able. Me, I have no idea what one is worth, so you need to be in the know, before taking a plunge like this.
Needless to say, he won the plane…now he had the added expense of the “juice“, storage fees till he could
get it out of Australia, shipping and restoration costs. All big $$$$
Very complicated process, if you ask me, he should have flown to Sydney and took care of it, but then again
he had the “delegation of authority” behind him.
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
I call the company three or four days before the auction and review the lots that I want to bid on. The most important thing here is making sure you know where you are going to be when the item goes off, since they call you when the lot is approaching. I do not ask for any particular person to bid, it really doesn't matter. They are all well trained. The Heritage representative will basically give you a heads up as the lot approaches, and tells you how to verbalize your intent to bid. The ANR rep. did discuss how strong I intended to bid on a number of lots. What's important is you can usually hear the auctioneer over the phone, so you can hear the lot numbers and bids being announced. While I love being at an auction, if I cannot be there phone bidding is a great substitute, much better than trying to get a bid placed over the internet. The coolness factor is obvious. No one knows who bought the coin!
I bid by phone exactly once, with B&M if that matters. I set the whole thing up by email, and I didn't really do much more than ask nicely. I did make sure that they knew that I knew what the lot would sell for (and that I wouldn't be wasting their time on the phone). Somewhere along the line they got my credit references, so they knew I was good for that amount of money. Other than that, they simply wanted to know where to call me when the time came.
On the day of the auction, they called me on the phone with about 10 lots lead time. As coinut1799 mentions, I was able to hear the auctioneer in the background (although not well), so I had some idea of what was going on. I could see the absentee bidding on the Internet, but the highest Internet bid was roughly 1/10 what I thought the lot would sell for, so I told the rep that he should just keep bidding until he reached what I thought would be the right ballpark, and then I'd have to make some fast decisions. He seemed comfortable with that.
As it happens, the lot closed for much less than I expected, so I had enough surprise cash to bid on the next couple of lots also.
I asked to bid by phone only because I would have been really annoyed to be the underbidder, and I wanted the flexibility to make a split-second decision to increase my bid. For that sort of bidding, I didn't need any particular person on the other end of the phone, just someone to act as go-between. In this particular case an absentee bid would have had the same effect, but I didn't know that in advance.
Needless to say, I was very pleased with the outcome. I'm also just as pleased that I haven't had to repeat the situation. I don't bid on a lot of auctions in "live" situations, and it's better for my nerves if it stays that way...
jonathan
Phone - can't see other bidders (minus), other bidders can't see you (plus or minus), no travel cost.
Internet - service or entire Internet can go down, bids sometimes aren't accepted, no travel cost. I've been in an auction when the Internet went down. Fortunately, I was bidding by phone and I won the lot.
Dealer rep - will look at the coins for you (plus), rep fee, but no travel cost. Also, dealer shouldn't be competing with you on the same lot. In this way, if you hire the right dealer, you might be able to buy a lot for less than the dealer would bid on it for his own stock. This has happened to me several times!
Live - travel cost, you can look at the lots yourself, better feel for the auction, others can see you (plus or minus), you can see others (plus or minus). If you're bidding against a known big-time collector or dealer, you might decide to stop bidding if you think your competitor will bid it up to any price to win. For example, would you want to be bidding against Laura on a J-1776?
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.