Poll: Does this forum influence prices of coins at auction?

RYK · October 24, 2006 11:58PM

In a tangentially related thread earlier this week, Coinguy1 asked what is our responsibility, as a community, to sellers of coins that are currently being auctioned.

What obligation do we owe to sellers/owners of coins listed on Ebay, those offered my major auction firms or on dealer websites, when making comments here? We often question and discuss grades, authenticity, whether toning is natural or artificial, whether a coin is attractive or ugly, whether Ebay sellers are scammers, etc.

I ask, now, does this forum have any influence on prices realized of coins in a public auction (ebay, Heritage, or wherever), and, if so, is it more positive or more negative. I have my own opinion on the matter which I will post later.

ziggy29 · October 25, 2006 12:02AM

It could go either way. Sometimes it helps bust a scam. But if it's a nice coin from a seller who looks legit, I've seen the hit counters skyrocket. That would have to translate into additional interest and possibly more/higher bids.

garsmith · October 25, 2006 12:06AM

This forum does well in outing AT's, fakes and scams so that effects some sellers by having thier auctions pulled. We also out bad buyers and sellers so they can be blocked. And we have people pointing out and bringing attention to some good auctions and good sellers as well, so I would say the forum has a slight effect in both directions.

By the way don't forget to look at the coins I have on the BST boards (link in sig line)

curly · October 25, 2006 12:09AM

I voted for #1. Sometimes I think we take ourselves way too seriously.

Longacre · October 25, 2006 12:10AM

I think we have almost no influence in large auctions, and minimal influence in ebay type auctions.

kranky · October 25, 2006 12:17AM

I think the forum could have a marginal influence on certain auctions.

Suppose it's a coin that shylock pointed out has been played with and later upgraded a point and went from RB to Red. There could be a few potential bidders here who would then choose to bypass the auction. The coin might have brought more if a member here would have bid strong, but there's no way of knowing if it actually made a difference.

On the other hand, a coin may be a desirable variety which is not noted in the auction. If the coin gets discussed here, it could potentially bring more money than it would have absent the discussion. But most times that doesn't get mentioned until the auction ends and the eagle-eyed winner gets to crow about the great cherrypick here.

Coxe · October 25, 2006 12:37AM

This forum has as much influence as any other internet source of coin information. Looking at some of the prices realized recently for mediocre toners and overhyped (elsewhere) ultramodern condition rarities, despite the ridiculing of both on a regular basis here, you have to discount the overall influence of the forum.

HighRelief · October 25, 2006 12:38AM

<< I ask, now, does this forum have any influence on prices realized of coins in a public auction (ebay, Heritage, or wherever), and, if so, is it more positive or more negative. I have my own opinion on the matter which I will post later. >>

Look what happened to the toned coin market, after a member here caught someone selling the AT Morgan in the older PCGS holder.

Also, I think Coinworld uses the Coin Forum to collect information for their articles.

cladking · October 25, 2006 12:43AM

<< 

Also, I think Coinworld uses the Coin Forum to collect information for their articles. >>

I'm sure you're right but keep in mind that Coin World has always kept abreast or ahead
of things in the hobby. This site tends to be very up to date so there is little surprise that
the same subjects get discussed. Also to some extent both CW and this site define what's
up in the hobby so they feed off each other.

TwoSides2aCoin · October 25, 2006 12:43AM

Robert , please update the poll to say : YES, and it can be negative for some and positive for others. If it's a modern, it will more likely be influenced in a negative fashion. If it's a classic, it will more likely be influenced in a positive one.

I could vote with a clearer conscience

Joe

mgoodm3 · October 25, 2006 12:45AM

Big auction as a whole... very little.

A few individual lots... sure for bad or good.

coinguy1 · October 25, 2006 12:46AM

<<Look what happened to the toned coin market, after a member here caught someone selling the AT Morgan in the older PCGS holder. >>

I'm not aware of the "toned coin market" having been influenced in the least by that.

In answer to your question, Robert, I believe that on occasion, this forum can affect prices in either direction, but that many more times than not, it's to the upside, as opposed to the downside.

RYK · October 25, 2006 12:58AM

In answer to your question, Robert, I believe that on occasion, this forum can affect prices in either direction, but that many more times than not, it's to the upside, as opposed to the downside.

That's my opinion, as well. This forum brings a lot of auction coins to our attention that we might otherwise miss. Some people will like some of these coins and bid on them, as a result of the discussion here. Even if most of the respondents pan a coin, someone here might still like it and bid on it.

OTOH, if a coin is not liked by a majority of the forum members, the worst thing they can do is not bid on it. This does not exclude the vast majority of potential bidders who would not read the thread about the coin and will bid or not bid based on their own opinions and preferences. It might occasionally happen that a potential bidder is influenced to not bid on a coin but a believe that this is much, much more unusual than the case of a non-bidder becoming a bidder.

Barry · October 25, 2006 1:01AM

All it takes is 2 bidders to infuence the price of an auction coin. If a coin is brought to light on this forum that was otherwise missed by a potential bidder, it can make a difference in the outcome.

BAJJERFAN · October 25, 2006 1:01AM

I suppose it depends on just who is doing the commenting and opinionating/opining.

ziggy29 · October 25, 2006 1:03AM

<< OTOH, if a coin is not liked by a majority of the forum members, the worst thing they can do is not bid on it. >>

Actually, the *worst* they could do is try to interfere with the auction if they felt it was deceptive, that problems haven't been disclosed, if they have a hunch it's a scam, et cetera.

Barndog · October 25, 2006 1:07AM

When the prices realized in a public auction depend on just two bidders, I am sure that in many instances this forum has influenced prices. Smoetimes, someone will post an ebay item that is still open and the price rises dramatically (maybe forum members were watching it anyway?) or the price stays stagnant or low (witness the numerous "outing" of counterfeits here). I've shared my thoughts in threads and via PM with others on certain coins -- I guarantee that information was used in formulating bidding strategy.

HighRelief · October 25, 2006 1:07AM

<< <<Look what happened to the toned coin market, after a member here caught someone selling the AT Morgan in the older PCGS holder. >>

I'm not aware of the "toned coin market" having been influenced in the least by that. >>

After reading the reports from the members attending the latest Coin Shows, they were saying that the toned coin market had taken a dive. Maybe you did not get to read that thread.

coinguy1 · October 25, 2006 1:15AM

<< 

<< <<Look what happened to the toned coin market, after a member here caught someone selling the AT Morgan in the older PCGS holder. >>

I'm not aware of the "toned coin market" having been influenced in the least by that. >>

After reading the reports from the members attending the latest Coin Shows, they were saying that the toned coin market had taken a dive. Maybe you did not get to read that thread. >>

I've read such comments and disagree strongly with that assessment. If anyone thinks that the episode you mentioned has had any meaningful impact on the toned coin market, I think they are kidding themselves.

I haven't had an easier time picking up attractive/beautiful toned pieces, I don't know other dealers who have, and, as just one general example, a group of colorfully toned Morgan dollars mentioned in a thread here brought very strong $ on Ebay recently.

seanq · October 25, 2006 1:21AM

I chose #3 only but I kinda wish there was a way to pick #2 also. I don't think either is wide-ranging, just that things posted to the Forum do influence people's decisions to bid or not bid on certain items.

Sean Reynolds

Coxe · October 25, 2006 1:24AM

<< All it takes is 2 bidders to infuence the price of an auction coin. If a coin is brought to light on this forum that was otherwise missed by a potential bidder, it can make a difference in the outcome. >>

Very true. Sometimes the price realized depends greatly on who the last two participating bidders are exactly though.

ABC123 · October 25, 2006 5:31AM

Dream On !

michael · October 25, 2006 5:38AM

Does this forum influence prices of coins at auction?

for crappy common generic coins in holders and also in holders that are problematic

sometimes yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Russ · October 25, 2006 5:42AM

I think our influence is marginal at best. Some influence with eBay, but basically zero in the rest of the coin world.

Russ, NCNE

PhillyJoe · October 25, 2006 5:47AM

<< I think our influence is marginal at best. Some influence with eBay, but basically zero in the rest of the coin world.

Russ, NCNE >>

If the buyer is getting ripped we're all over it and it may influence the outcome.

If the seller is getting ripped, we find out after it ships.

Joe

tcmitssr · October 25, 2006 5:49AM

I cannot entertain for a second that this forum has any influence, whatsoever, on the price of a coin at auction.

The only possible way would be if two or more members said they were going after the same coin.

As for Russ' comment about Ebay, I don't see that either. If something is in error in an auction, I know forum members have gotten corrections stated or auctions removed but that is not, technically, influencing prices as I think the poll suggests.

RYK · October 25, 2006 7:19AM

I cannot entertain for a second that this forum has any influence, whatsoever, on the price of a coin at auction.

So you do not think it is possible that when someone links a coin here for auction at ebay or Heritage (or Teletrade or wherever) that someone else here, who was not previously interested, might get interested and bid on it? Or perhaps the forum member looks around the ebay store and find something else he/she would not have seen? I think it happens all the time.

tradedollarnut · October 25, 2006 7:48AM

I wonder if PCGS would have involved itself in the sale of the 1963 PR70DCAM Lincoln without the general outrage expressed in this Forum? I suspect the coin would not have sold without them stepping up...

Coxe · October 25, 2006 7:56AM

<< I cannot entertain for a second that this forum has any influence, whatsoever, on the price of a coin at auction.

So you do not think it is possible that when someone links a coin here for auction at ebay or Heritage (or Teletrade or wherever) that someone else here, who was not previously interested, might get interested and bid on it? Or perhaps the forum member looks around the ebay store and find something else he/she would not have seen? I think it happens all the time. >>

It happens sometimes at the worst possible times. A few of us on here will recall a recent 21-S Morgan with a collar error that happened to be a rare thornbird variety. Some of us knew this and were mum on it. Some posted about it here while the auction was still in progress, drawing in more bidders. In that particular case, I don't think the winner paid more because of it since the two underbidders (I was one of them) were already on the coin. But there are other cases.

mozin · October 25, 2006 8:16AM

If a current auction lot is discussed on CU in a positive light, I don't see how one could think it would not affect the auction bidding. As a few members have already stated, all it takes is two bidders to make the price realized soar.

I think that when a current auction lot is discussed here in a negative fashion, it makes little difference in the price realized.

BobaFett72 · October 25, 2006 8:20AM

Regarding Ebay auctions sure it certainly might draw some eyes and some bids (i saw a board member or two bidding on some stuff of mine last week, and it's always appreciated) Ive def. had some sales to board members and the BST led them to my auctions or private sales.

Regards
Leo

TorinoCobra71 · October 25, 2006 8:45AM

Minimal influence AT BEST..................

TorinoCobra71

Connecticoin · October 25, 2006 8:56AM

I say a slight positive effect, even for "controversial" coins, as it gets a few more informed eyeballs looking at them.

Petarded · October 25, 2006 9:40AM

Right off, I thought yes, in a positive way. But, after thinking about it, perhaps in a slightly negative way for the buyer, but positive for the hobby. Those that are in the market for the coins at auction (not talking ebay here), that board members wish to snag, are more than likely in tune through this board (or at least their agents are), or across the street. For those that dont know its up for auction, they learn about it here/there (and this may/does generate more interest in the particular coin, as we all know about the 'I gotta have it' mentality), more than likely causing higher bidding action, and as a result, a higher hammer. I cant imagine that anyone playing the Registry game isnt in tune on the boards, whether here or across the street. So, while it can be a positive for the seller, for the buyer, it means more $$ to pony up. If it's a scarcer or rarer or low pop coin, this just means that a new, higher price is in place for similar examples, and they come out of hiding, with the seller hoping to get all the money. I cant imagine that those who are buying/ripping/hoping on coins from ebay are the same ones really digging for nice examples on other auction sites, such as Heritage or TT (or Stacks, ANR, etc...)...two different types of buyers, and definitely two different types of collectors (yes, there are always exceptions). I, as well as a number of members, do use ebay, but we arent the ones bidding/winning ALL those coins on ebay, because they are predominantly dogs that no informed collector would build a collection/set with..unless it was just nowhere else to be found (and if its that tough to come by, it probably isnt going to find its new owner through ebay anyway). This forum makes for better, more informed collectors, and as such, I would think it DOES influence prices...not greatly, but at LEAST in a moderate way. How many times have we seen 2/3 members slug it out for a certain coin?

Poll: Does this forum influence prices of coins at auction?

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