Given the schlock in recent auctions, should the auction firms promote their sales as "no deale
Longacre
Posts: 16,717 ✭✭✭
There have been quite a few posts about how awful the auctions are getting. I understand that the main reason for the horrible auctions is because most are just recycled coins that dealers put into the auctions, in the hope to add some pizzaz around a boring coin (who here among us does not get whipped up into a frothy frenzy when we bid on and win an auction lot?). Do you think a good marketing tool by the auction firms (and to differentiate themselves in terms of quality), should be to promote their auctions as having "no dealer consignments"? Would this fact make you more or less likely to bid in the auction? Should a firm actively promote the fact that all of the coins for sale are from regular Joes, and not dealers' inventories?
Always took candy from strangers
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
0
Comments
impossible
no reserve everything starts at a dollar
not some retail pricing scheme maskerating as an auction and then does not sell then have a buy it now second chance
I still think there are too many numismatic auction firms and expect to see some changes in the near future.
<< <i>With no disrespect meant to collectors - they are just as capable of consigning "schlock" to auction houses as dealers are. Also, a certain % of sellers' reserves will be silly or piggish, regardles of whether the sellers are dealers or collectors.
<<what the auction companies should promote is........... a true auction
no reserve everything starts at a dollar...>>
Michael, that sounds great from the point of view of a buyer, but realistically, how many sellers are willing to part with ther treasures under such conditions? Hint - not too many. >>
There is another factor involved in why auction houses don't want "no reserve" auctions. Many auction houses have retail arms as well and have to protect the value of their inventory. If a portion of the market has collapsed and their retail arm is buried in that part of the market they are not going to want the world to know how low the demand really is. There is a reason why those potted palms are such active bidders.
but a nice thought though
but maybe a compromise of more reasonable reserves like really high wholesale+??
(That's not the same as "no reserve." But when you see a lot of decent but not spectacular coins failing to meet the reserve even after being bid up to 25% above the pricesheets, it does tend to leave a bad taste in one's mouth about auctions.)
1) Will people be interested in this lot?
2) Is the lot likely to sell at or above the minimum price guarantee we offer the consignor?
3) If the lot sells, could we offer to purchase and/or re-auction the coin for the buyers at some point in the future based on the initial description? In other words, do we like the lot enough that we wouldn't mind owning it, and is it accurately graded?
4) Can we make money on this lot?
As for reserves, the most important reason is to ensure that the seller will receive a price he is comfortable with. However, even when the consignor doesn't want to set a reserve, we always set a reasonable starting bid price. If we didn't, the auction would last days instead of hours. Image a $1,000 coin starting at $1. One dollar now two, now two, anybody at two dollars? Two dollars I have now Three....
You would be surprised at how many of our nicest consignments come from dealers, though. It is a total misconception to believe that dealers only consign maxed out, unsellable coins that have been lingering in their inventories. Dealer consignments are almost always recently purchased collections that they spent a large amount of money on and then need to recoup some of that money immediately through an advance. They don't have time to grade, regrade, and then market each of those coins one by one.
Is this always the case? No. But it is the case much more often than not. I have to think the same would be true for the other auction companies.
Yours
Mark M
Scotsman Auction Co.
If an item sells, what you describe as "schlock" is someone else's desired collectible. I think some Pez collectors come from Mars, but if buying old candy dispensers makes their day then let them have just as much enjoyment from it as hobbyists who crave early proof gold or copies of 1940's era Terry-Toons comics.
-donn-
<< <i>As for reserves, the most important reason is to ensure that the seller will receive a price he is comfortable with. However, even when the consignor doesn't want to set a reserve, we always set a reasonable starting bid price. If we didn't, the auction would last days instead of hours. Image a $1,000 coin starting at $1. One dollar now two, now two, anybody at two dollars? Two dollars I have now Three.... >>
Well, it depends on the nature of the venue. For one that has online bidding leading up to the floor bidding, you could start the online bidding at $1 and start the floor bidding at the current high online bid (which would be way more than $1).
And even if you don't have online bidding, let's look at that $1,000 coin again. Too often the reserve seems to be $1,200 or even $1,500. So people think they are putting in $700, $800 and even $1000 bids in good faith and finding out that an unreasonable reserve has prevented the coin from selling. Enough of that, and some people begin to sour on auctions. They've been a great way to get moon money for a lot of nice coins, but some people seem intent on killing the goose that lays the golden eggs with their unrealistic reserves.
I'd just like the opportunity to make a deal before everything moves into auction. Frankly, I don't mind that dealers' in-house auctions are used to blow out stale coins; but I certainly don't want auctions to supplant traditional retail sales. You've warned us about auctions driving prices to unreasonable levels. Collectors' desire for bargain prices at auctions will come back to bite us in the rear.
Edited to add: I see you've changed your post to include the joke "isn't that a cheap supermarket." It wasn't worth the edit.
I would suggest that auction firms should focus on getting good consignments and not worry about who they are from.
<< <i>The issue is not who consigns the coins, its what they consign.
I would suggest that auction firms should focus on getting good consignments and not worry about who they are from. >>
You're always the voice of reason, aren't you?
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i>
<< <i>The issue is not who consigns the coins, its what they consign.
I would suggest that auction firms should focus on getting good consignments and not worry about who they are from. >>
You're always the voice of reason, aren't you?
You bet he is and here is a very recent example
<<When I was Jeremy's age I remember our primary focus was to see who could smuggle a chair out of the library by wearing it under their coat and walking out past the librarian at the door. >>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>The issue is not who consigns the coins, its what they consign.
I would suggest that auction firms should focus on getting good consignments and not worry about who they are from. >>
You're always the voice of reason, aren't you?
You bet he is and here is a very recent example
<<When I was Jeremy's age I remember our primary focus was to see who could smuggle a chair out of the library by wearing it under their coat and walking out past the librarian at the door. >> >>
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
Is this always the case? No. But it is the case much more often than not. I have to think the same would be true for the other auction companies.
From what I've seen in the major auctions the above is not the case.
I often see dealer coins recycled 2 to 6 times until they eventually sell. The majors seem to need consignments of any type to help fill up the auctions, and $5K-$20K dealer coins fill things up nicely, even if they are often over-reserved and do not sell. Any worthwhile collection purchased can be easily regraded by somebody, sectioned up, and sold off for profit if bought within reason. Seems to me you could sell a worthwhile collection at a major show within 1-2 days and people would take tickets to stand in line. Mind you, these would have to be nicely graded coins with eye appeal, no conserved junk here. The major auctions are showing up with less and less unmolested choice to gem bust and seated type. No shortage of dipped out "cameo" proofs though.
roadrunner
Conducting business in this manner will often lead to a lot of money being left on the table. Why sell an entire fresh collection to just a few of your peers who may or may not be the top buyer when for as little as 8% of the take you can have that same fresh collection and expose it in an orderly manner to the top buyer's in the country. That, and you can recoup much of your investment in the form of an advance. An argument can be made for both situations, but I stand by my stance that most dealer consignment that make it in the auction catalog are fresh, the rest are returned to the dealer. It is just that the "stale" items stand out more. Truth be told, it is often the collector who demands the highest reserve.
Mark