Are these 2 1880-O VAM Morgans?

crazy4coins2005 · June 22, 2006 8:46PM

I'm new to collecting and have recently purchased 2 1880-O morgans in the last week and noticed identical marks on the reverse of both coins. It's the mark on the united states motto and was wondering what it is? Thank you.

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MAD4MORGANS · June 22, 2006 9:20PM

All Morgans are VAMs unless they are not yet discovered and attributed.

The images you are showing are ones with die cracks and is possible that one followed the other off the minting press.

Die cracks are common on Morgan Dollars unless the dies break leaving a clump of metal or have retained cuds left on the coin like some of the 1921Ds found in my sig line.

But some die cracks are Pick Up Points (PUP) for finding other collectible VAMs.

crazy4coins2005 · June 23, 2006 4:04AM

Thanks for the response.

DennisH · June 23, 2006 4:10AM

There are several significant 1880-O VAMs that involve the date, or Liberty's ear, or the eagle's tailfeathers. Post pictures of those areas if you can.

Coxe · June 23, 2006 4:17AM

All you can say from the pics is that both coins share the same reverse. It is likely that they are the same variety (VAM) as the reverse crack progression is nearly identical and thus would be probably from the same production run with a common obverse. The cracking is unique to a die. Once you ID its variety, any others that match it are the same die and the same variety if both sides match (well, all three sides match technically).

kwmorgan · June 23, 2006 5:16AM

Die cracks like what you show are very common on New Orleans and Philadelphia Morgans. I have a 1900-O and an 1888-P that look like the reverse die was about ready to fly apart. New Orleans and Philly were the high production mints and thus let the dies run the longest. Carson City and San Francisco changed the dies much more often and usually offer the best strikes. Compare an uncirculated 1880-S to to one of those 1880-O's and you'll see the difference immediately.

TwoSides2aCoin · June 23, 2006 5:20AM

I must humbly admit....

I am ignorant when it comes to the many die variances that are associated with Morgans.

kwmorgan · June 23, 2006 5:33AM

I hear you. I bought the VanAllen-Mallis book. Some Morgans are very easy to "VAM". The MS-60 1891-CC I just got was easy, its a VAM-3 "Spitting Eagle". Others VAM's are much more subtle. I need to get a photgraphic setup, so I can post the ones that confound me.

crazy4coins2005 · June 23, 2006 6:42AM

<< <i>There are several significant 1880-O VAMs that involve the date, or Liberty's ear, or the eagle's tailfeathers. Post pictures of those areas if you can. >>

Sorry for the crappy pics.

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DennisH · June 23, 2006 9:09AM

Nice scans!

Neither coin is either a doubled ear, overdate, or tailfeather "hangnail". It could still be one of the checkmark overdates, but I have a hard time figuring those out even when I have the silly things in my hands.

MAD4MORGANS · June 23, 2006 9:16AM

Did I hear someone mention "hangnail"

Are these 2 1880-O VAM Morgans?

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