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Hypothetical: eBay "Rip"
RKKay
Posts: 3,017 ✭✭✭
Dealer A and Dealer B are in a very esoteric field (such as patterns), where it is often possible, because of the rarity of the coins involved, that coins are readily identifiable. Dealer A lists a high-R7 pattern and describes it as J-ABC, PCGS PR66. Along with the listing showing a J-ABC (clearly visible on the slab) in an NGC PF67 slab. Dealer B sees it and notices the BIN price is $1,500, a super rip, as the coin is worth at least $8,000. He also knows that Dealer A must have made a mistake, because both dealers are specialists. He hits BIN and immediately pays with Paypal. Is Dealer A obligated to sell the coin, which was accurately pictured, but inaccurately described? Should Dealer B concede he knew all along and apologize for the "rip?"
Edited to add: What if the buyer were an experienced pattern collector? What if he were a collector who had no clue as to the value, but just liked the coin?
Edited to add: What if the buyer were an experienced pattern collector? What if he were a collector who had no clue as to the value, but just liked the coin?
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in a perfect world
IMHO
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<< <i>Dealer A and Dealer B are in a very esoteric field (such as patterns), where it is often possible, because of the rarity of the coins involved, that coins are readily identifiable. Dealer A lists a high-R7 pattern and describes it as J-ABC, PCGS PR66. Along with the listing showing a J-ABC (clearly visible on the slab) in an NGC PF67 slab. Dealer B sees it and notices the BIN price is $1,500, a super rip, as the coin is worth at least $8,000. He also knows that Dealer A must have made a mistake, because both dealers are specialists. He hits BIN and immediately pays with Paypal. Is Dealer A obligated to sell the coin, which was accurately pictured, but inaccurately described? Should Dealer B concede he knew all along and apologize for the "rip?"
Edited to add: What if the buyer were an experienced pattern collector? What if he were a collector who had no clue as to the value, but just liked the coin? >>
If Dealer A and Dealer B know each other, why doesn't Dealer B just pick up the phone/shoot off an e-mail/hit "Contact this Seller" and warn them of the mistake? Dealer A could just go in and adjust the BIN price accordingly, couldn't he?
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
As a side note, in my experience NGC pr 67 is typically equivalent to a PCGS pr 66 when it comes to grading patterns so the only meaningful error in the listing is the BIN price.
I can't imagine a dealer getting sloppy listing a coin of that value?
This same thing happened a few weeks ago on eBay with Superior and a bunch of forums members. Superior erroneously listed about 50 auctions with BIN's of $1.00, they were quickly snatched up, some paying instantly some not. Superior quickly refunded the amount with emails stating "the BIN price was an obvious mistake". The result was a massive thread that Samuel started by asking about the ethics, morals, rights, obligations, etc. of buyers and sellers.
It was very similar to your question in theory...just a few 0000's were missing.
Link to Samuel's thread
<< <i>Rick,
This same thing happened a few weeks ago on eBay with Superior and a bunch of forums members. Superior erroneously listed about 50 auctions with BIN's of $1.00, they were quickly snatched up, some paying instantly some not. Superior quickly refunded the amount with emails stating "the BIN price was an obvious mistake". The result was a massive thread that Samuel started by asking about the ethics, morals, rights, obligations, etc. of buyers and sellers.
It was very similar to your question in theory...just a few 0000's were missing.
Link to Samuel's thread >>
Is plagiarism legal?
Specializing in 1854 and 1855 large FE patterns
<
<< <i>Are you asking if dealer B is ethically or legally obligated to apologize for the rip? I have never sold anything on EBAY so I haven"t read the CYA "fine" print re: errors and omissions. I am not sure if the seller is legally on the hook to deliver the goods but if dealer B wants to have any future business relationship with dealer A, it would be best to void the sale.
As a side note, in my experience NGC pr 67 is typically equivalent to a PCGS pr 66 when it comes to grading patterns so the only meaningful error in the listing is the BIN price.
I can't imagine a dealer getting sloppy listing a coin of that value? >>
Ethically. Legality is a lot looser standard. I agree on NGC 76 usually equaling PCGS 66 in patterns.
Specializing in 1854 and 1855 large FE patterns
<
<< <i>Rick,So what happened in this hypothetical transaction,hypothetically of course.
Specializing in 1854 and 1855 large FE patterns
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There are local dealers that I would rip and hold their feet to the fire and sleep very well that night. There are other local dealers I would not...it really depends on my take of the dealer in question...
Edited to add: What if the buyer were an experienced pattern collector? What if he were a collector who had no clue as to the value, but just liked the coin?>>
Under Ebay's terms and conditions, I believe that the seller is obligated to complete the transaction. However, ethically, dealer B should not try to force dealer A to complete the sale.
Should dealer B apologize? If he was sleazy enough to try to take advantage of dealer A in the first place
Even a collector who was not trying to take advantage of the seller, should not try to profit from an honest mistake.