A NEW mint finish on 2005 proof cents! opinions?

tincup · November 26, 2005 5:46AM

OK, I can use some input from you experts out there. I started checking some of the coins in my Legacy sets that I have received.... and noticed that the cents appear to have a different look to them. Most, if not all of the cents in my Legacy sets show the same characteristics. The fields have a 'brushed" look to them.... at first I thought it was the alloy, and perhaps some toning effects. But upon magnification, these actually appear to be etched lines across the entire fields. Both obverse and reverse have them. At first glance the coin appears to be a regular frosted proof, but when tilted in the light, the brushed lines reflect the light differently, and thus appear to be physically there (as compared to toning, etc). I do not see any of the lines in the devices.

Proof sets that I received earlier in the year definitely did not have these; the proof sets were the usual mirror/frosted coins we normally see. I have provided links to some photos I have on one of the coins.

So what is your opinion? Is the mint experimenting with a new 'brushed matte' type of finish and using on the cents for a trial run? Or is this a 'normal' effect that has been seen for some time? If so, how did this happen? Any info you can give me will be appreciated......

fc · November 26, 2005 7:48AM

it does look odd. i am curious now too.

could it be a combination of the planchet and how they polished
the die?

CarlWohlforth · November 26, 2005 7:51AM

Are those lines raised? If so they might be from a polished die. From those good photos it kind of looks like some sort of rinse or something. Interesting.

Any other info? I'd like to hear more opinions about this Cent.

tincup · November 26, 2005 11:08AM

Carl, the best I can tell is that the lines are in fact raised. When the coin is tilted in the light, the fields then become 'hazy' due to the light reflected in a different angle. Or so it seems to me. Under a magnifier, they also appear to be raised.

I don't think it is caused by the planchet.... if it was, I would have thought I would have seen some traces in the devices also. But so far have not seen any. But.... that does not necessarily rule it out.

Also.... one of the cents in another Legacy set actually seems to be a hybrid between the usual frosted mirror finish, and this type that I am describing. The inner portions of this coin are 'brushed' finish; but around the outer edge, it has the mirror finish. Looks like the outer perimeter of the die was polished up but not the center portion; perhaps as the die wore somewhat?

Any other ideas would be appreciated! I may try to contact the Mint for some info.... but not too optimistic about that!

tincup · November 26, 2005 11:40AM

As I also mentioned.... these were found in Legacy sets that I just received last week. If any of you have just received these sets.... take a look and see if yours have anything like them.

coinnut86 · November 26, 2005 11:49AM

I have a 2000 D with the same look... Is it the same thing?

CarlWohlforth · November 26, 2005 11:54AM

If those lines are raised it is possible the die was polished. Incuse polish lines on the die would cause raised lines on the Cent. They seem too regular and parallel to be the hand polishing I am familiar with.

tincup · November 26, 2005 11:59AM

Now that you mention it coinnut86, I have seen a few unc cents that had a similar effect.... but not quite as fine or brushed as these proof cents. So I suspect it is something about how the die is prepared... but that is what the mystery is to me. I just haven't seen this effect on any proof coins up to now. The other proof coins in the sets do not show any of this brushed effect.

rich · November 26, 2005 12:02PM

If you are shooting the picture through the plastic,could the lines be in the holder?

If you tap the edge on your hand can you get the cent to rotate a bit to see if the lines follow the rotation. Just a thought.
Very interesting post !

tincup · November 26, 2005 12:05PM

I have to agree that it probably isn't a hand grinder/polisher that would have been used.... that would certainly have irregular lines and patterns. These lines are so orderly. Perhaps a stationary belt type polisher/abrasion equipment was used?

tincup · November 26, 2005 12:12PM

Rich, the photos were in fact shot through the plastic. But the holder can probably be ruled out... all the other coins in the set have no trace of this effect, which should show on them also if the holder was causing it.

That is a good point though.... I have been initially fooled in the past by some holders!

tincup · November 27, 2005 12:46AM

Any other opinions? Something new going on at the mint, or just a quality control problem?

coinnut86 · November 27, 2005 3:58AM

<< <i>Now that you mention it coinnut86, I have seen a few unc cents that had a similar effect.... but not quite as fine or brushed as these proof cents. So I suspect it is something about how the die is prepared... but that is what the mystery is to me. I just haven't seen this effect on any proof coins up to now. The other proof coins in the sets do not show any of this brushed effect. >>

Mine isn't as brushed as your's but you can tell that it definatly is brushed. Except

mine looks as though it was made like a proof. Mirror field, no frost, but it is very mirrored.
I have never sent in a coin to be graded but I was talking to TwoSides2aCoin about sending this one in. I'll see if I can get a good picture of it posted.

BuffaloIronTail · November 27, 2005 7:11AM

That effect doesn't come from the planchet......it comes from the die.

In the picture you provided that shows "LIBERTY"........notice how the effect does not go entirely to the rim.

It stops, uniformly, just short. Real strange......and it stops uniformly at about the same place.

It also looks like the rim also has the same effect as the field of the coin.

I believe that the die was prepared with the satin finish to impart to the coin. The mint must have either "brushed on" the finish, or used some kind of "universal abraider" to prepare the die for use.

Either way it did impart the satin finish, as was intended, but the pressure needed in the corners to raise up the wire rim obliterated it.

I think we're on the right track. The mint is up to something in the way they prepare the satin finish dies.

Hope this helps..........

Pete

tincup · November 27, 2005 11:20AM

Thanks for all the input... I really appreciate it! The more I look at the coin, the more convinced I am that the Mint has certainly done something different to it, whether a mechanical brushing or applied chemical finish or whatever. I intend to try to find out more about it.

coinnut86, if you get a chance, I'd like to see a photo of the coin you are talking about. I'd like to see how it compares.

If anyone else has any info or comments on the coin, all will be appreciated!

A NEW mint finish on 2005 proof cents! opinions?

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