A pretty expensive piece of Modern Crap™.

Russ · November 3, 2005 4:01AM

1969-D PCGS MS67 Kennedy Half Dollar - $4025 so far.

Gorgeous coin, but with that mushy reverse strike I'm very surprised that it got in to an MS67 holder.

Russ, NCNE

DHeath · November 3, 2005 4:44AM

I agree.

SDCollector · November 3, 2005 4:46AM

Well thank goodness there isn't a reserve.

DNADave · November 3, 2005 4:49AM

That's one expensive piece of plastic.... errr, I mean coin.

kryptonitecomics · November 3, 2005 4:49AM

That toning sure doesn't hurt the value!!!!

Smittys · November 3, 2005 4:50AM

<< That's one expensive piece of plastic.... errr, I mean coin. >>

sinin1 · November 3, 2005 4:52AM

pop 3/0 ?

and sweet obverse toning

won't it go for more than 5K?

Russ · November 3, 2005 5:09AM

<< pop 3/0 ?

and sweet obverse toning

won't it go for more than 5K? >>

It might. Frankly, though, I'm surprised it's as high as it is. The last 1970-D in MS67 to sell brought $2695, and it's a pop 2/0.

Russ, NCNE

RYK · November 3, 2005 5:22AM

Gorgeous coin, but with that mushy reverse strike I'm very surprised that it got in to an MS67 holder.

The Dahlonega grading team must have been on the grading floor the day it was processed.

DHeath · November 3, 2005 5:31AM

To spend big money for a conditionally rare common coin, I have to have an emotional reaction to the quality, to see the coin and know it is the standard bearer for the series, and that's what your entire collection should look like in a perfect world. I like that coin, but my personal emotional reaction is around $250.

Barry · November 3, 2005 5:33AM

You're too generous. I wouldn't pay $5 for it.

DHeath · November 3, 2005 5:38AM

BTW - those pictures are fantastic. Credit where credit's due.

RYK · November 3, 2005 5:42AM

I think Heritage's imaging is recently much-improved. They are in the lead for the 2005 Most Improved Imaging--Auction House Division--Award.

tjkillian · November 3, 2005 5:49AM

For the same amount of money, one could get a Bust dollar, large eagle, in a PCGS XF holder. Kennedys are nice, but not worth more than $5.00, in my humble opinion.

Tom

LincolnsRule · November 3, 2005 5:53AM

I sooo want that coin. I jsut bought a 67rd 69-s cent (pop 8/0). What a start to a 1969 mint set I would have! I can't really afford it though. I think the price is more than fair provided the coin is accurately graded. I went through 400 1969 mint sets and couldn't even get pcgs to give me an ms65.

Russ · November 3, 2005 6:01AM

<< I think the price is more than fair provided the coin is accurately graded. >>

It isn't. There's no way a coin with that reverse strike should be in an MS67 holder.

Russ, NCNE

Steve27 · November 3, 2005 6:06AM

"Gorgeous coin, but with that mushy reverse strike I'm very surprised that it got in to an MS67 holder."

I agree, I've never seen a strike that bad on a Kennedy; the shield blends right into the eagle.

DHeath · November 3, 2005 6:10AM

I've got a 74-P at home I'll dig up a pic of that has a similar look. The obverse is extremely clean, and the reverse is about as incomplete as this one. I bought it in an old PCI green label holder graded MS65 with a notation about the weak reverse on the label. I bought that coin primarily because of the holder notation. I really dislike weak devices on moderns.

clackamas · November 3, 2005 6:58AM

It is a hard to get type coin in high grade. They are not common by any stretch of the imagination in GEM+ They are heavy and the reeding is sharp, bust coins in XF are not hard to find. I think it is a nice coin although the weakness on the reverse is hard to get by. Maybe it is so stellar that the weakness kept it out of a 68 holder, or higher?

doughmaking · November 3, 2005 7:07AM

What does the pop 3/0 pop 8/0 mean? I tried to search it but nothing really explained it? Does anyone have a link i can read about it?

Oh and I sure want to find one of those in my coin rolls...Think its possible?? haha

cladking · November 3, 2005 7:37AM

<< For the same amount of money, one could get a Bust dollar, large eagle, in a PCGS XF holder. Kennedys are nice, but not worth more than $5.00, in my humble opinion.

Tom >>

Pop 8/ 0 means that there are eight coins graded at that level and zero higher.

It's funny that collectors think nothing of stretching to buy a classic coin in a little higher grade
and having it cost them tens of thousands of dollars extra but let a modern cost a few hundred
dollars in the next higher grade and some won't even touch it and will laugh at those who do.

You can't actually assemble a Kennedy set if you aren't willing to spend more than $5 for a coin
so perhaps you're already collecting the right things.

paigowjohnny · November 3, 2005 7:42AM

That is some serious

DHeath · November 3, 2005 7:50AM

I was forgetful. It was a 71-D. Here are the pics. I liked the notation on the holder concerning the weakness. The upper shield is very weak, and the eagle missing all breast detail.

BigD5 · November 3, 2005 7:56AM

To each their own, but man I can't help but think of all the real coins you can buy for that kind of dough.

A nice Pine Tree Shillling?

Branch mint gold?

Some draped bust coinage?

Must be that 24k impregnated plastic.

Someone really LOVES those half dollars.

RayJay · November 3, 2005 8:02AM

<< 1969-D PCGS MS67 Kennedy Half Dollar - $4025 so far.

Gorgeous coin, but with that mushy reverse strike I'm very surprised that it got in to an MS67 holder.

Russ, NCNE >>

its only a crappy coin because Russ doesnt own it

Russ · November 3, 2005 8:04AM

Comparison to a nearly fully struck example:

Russ, NCNE

keets · November 3, 2005 8:11AM

what i think, if anyone cares..................

i don't think it's sensible to make the Classic vs. Modern arguement with regard to strike and/or value for a particular issue. there are several Classic issues(see RYK's $5 Dahlonega thread) which are given consideration for strike weakness. another entire series that comes to mind would be Buffalo Nickels and branch Mint issues or the entire Walking Liberty Half-Dollar series, all with weak central obverse detail on most MS66's. these coins are all understood to have strike problems and they're graded accordingly. then we come to......................Moderns!!!!

anyone who's done some looking at coins from the start of the SMS issues through the early 1970's shopuld be painfully aware of deficiencies in strike quality. much of it is due to the new compositions being used and much is due to the fact that the Mint was a mess back then, poor management more interested in thwarting collectors from "hoarding" all the coins they were making. look through thousands of coins and i bet you'll be surprised at what you find and might even view this coin differently.

with all that said, i think the coin got the Market Grade bump because it's exceptionally clean, has nice luster and eye appealling tone. i see it as a PQ MS66 and i have about 10 such coins spanning from 1964-1984, both MS and PR with tone similar on both sides, all but one raw. i assume they picked up the tone from Dansco or Whitman folders and whenever i find a nice one i buy it, usually for well under $10. Kennedy's often have weak shield detail and numerous marks scattered throughout the shield and the hair; this coin seems absent those marks even with the strike weakness.

perhaps the day will come when Modern issues are given consideration for strike weakness as some classic issues are already given consideration. i assume it'll happen about the same time that collectors who don't study a series offer the "i'll give $5 for it" answer, somewhere around the time when donkeys start to fly!!!

keets · November 3, 2005 8:15AM

hey Russ

i was typing while you were listing the two pictures and i think you highlighted some of what i said. looking at the shield area of both pictures, neither is weakly struck, one just has more wear from use than the other. in fact, the MS67 discussion coin looks to have less in the way of unstruck planchet flaws even though it shows less apparent detail.

this is kinda like the beer commercial, less filling/tastes great.

al h.

blastpak · November 3, 2005 8:18AM

Does Heritage bring higher prices compared to other auction houses? It seems to me that this is the case and if so, is it because of the recognized name?

fc · November 3, 2005 8:20AM

russ,

will the pops just continue to grow in this series? I mean the top pops.

your thoughts on the long term rarity of the high end coins, MS67 68 etc...

Russ · November 3, 2005 8:34AM

<< will the pops just continue to grow in this series? I mean the top pops.

your thoughts on the long term rarity of the high end coins, MS67 68 etc... >>

Well, over the last three years the 1969-D MS67 pop has tripled. The 1970-D hasn't changed, though.

Russ, NCNE

LindeDad · November 3, 2005 9:03AM

By tripled you are saying one per year. Wonder how many people tried, with how many coins, to make another MS67? And even with the toning this one is moon money.

Russ · November 3, 2005 9:16AM

<< By tripled you are saying one per year. >>

Yeah, I was being a little facetious.

<< Wonder how many people tried, with how many coins, to make another MS67? >>

The under pop (MS66) has gone from 38 to 65 (one of those was me). I'd guess a lot of submitters of those were hoping for the big MS67.

No matter how you slice it, the 1964 to 1970 business strikes are damned tough at this level.

Russ, NCNE

Myqqy · November 3, 2005 10:14AM

it'll happen about the same time that collectors who don't study a series offer the "i'll give $5 for it" answer, somewhere around the time when donkeys start to fly!!! <http://forums.collectors.com/i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif>

clackamas · November 3, 2005 1:27PM

That is not "fully struck" Russ - this is Fully struck.

keets · November 3, 2005 1:35PM

earlier i said weak strike when what i should have been saying was late die state. i think this last picture of the 1968-D is a good example of a fully struck EDS coin. i can only imagine how many Mint Sets you looked through to find it, didn't you say it was about 1500 before you found the FS Jefferson??

clackamas · November 3, 2005 3:26PM

<< i can only imagine how many Mint Sets you looked through to find it, didn't you say it was about 1500 before you found the FS Jefferson?? >>

Naa, I am marginally more insane than that .. 1800..LOL

A pretty expensive piece of Modern Crap™.

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