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Mercury Dimes and Questions
fooswolf
Posts: 29
Hello everyone,
I am a new to numismatics, but I am grading my deceased fathers coin collection for sale in the near future. So far I have graded 3500 coins and I have about 12 lbs of FDR Dimes yet to grade. I just recently figured out that just because a coin has been circulated does not mean it can’t be graded higher than AU. I have been using the 1972 Photograde Guide to grade the coins, but the grading stops at AU, therefore so did I. However, I don’t care about going back and re-grading the AU’s I have because there are probably not to many that would grade very high in the MS range and I am getting to the point where I just want it done.
Having said all of that, of the roughly 2000 Mercury Dimes I have couple that have not yet been graded and with the information that coins can be graded higher than AU I wanted your opinions on the grades of the coins. I would also appreciate any insight on the best way to sell an entire collection. The reason I am grading them is so that I am reasonably compensated and am not just paid the silver value (OK for crappy coins), ie screwed. Just as important to me that I don’t get screwed is that I want to new owner to be satisfied that they received a good deal.
Also the PCGS designation FB for Full Band, what does that stand for, ie what bands in reference to the Mercury Dimes?
Thanks for your responses.
Here are the Dimes.
Dan
I think the following dime could be graded as a MS-65? The photographs do not show the actual like new brilliant color, ie mint state.
I think the following dime could be graded as a MS-63? The photographs do not show the actual like new brilliant color, ie mint state.
I think the following dime is either an EF-40 or an AU-50 and it still has a brilliant like new color.
I think the following dime is either an EF-40 or an AU-50 and it still has a brilliant like new color.
Please respond as I am very interested in your opinions.
I am a new to numismatics, but I am grading my deceased fathers coin collection for sale in the near future. So far I have graded 3500 coins and I have about 12 lbs of FDR Dimes yet to grade. I just recently figured out that just because a coin has been circulated does not mean it can’t be graded higher than AU. I have been using the 1972 Photograde Guide to grade the coins, but the grading stops at AU, therefore so did I. However, I don’t care about going back and re-grading the AU’s I have because there are probably not to many that would grade very high in the MS range and I am getting to the point where I just want it done.
Having said all of that, of the roughly 2000 Mercury Dimes I have couple that have not yet been graded and with the information that coins can be graded higher than AU I wanted your opinions on the grades of the coins. I would also appreciate any insight on the best way to sell an entire collection. The reason I am grading them is so that I am reasonably compensated and am not just paid the silver value (OK for crappy coins), ie screwed. Just as important to me that I don’t get screwed is that I want to new owner to be satisfied that they received a good deal.
Also the PCGS designation FB for Full Band, what does that stand for, ie what bands in reference to the Mercury Dimes?
Thanks for your responses.
Here are the Dimes.
Dan
I think the following dime could be graded as a MS-65? The photographs do not show the actual like new brilliant color, ie mint state.
I think the following dime could be graded as a MS-63? The photographs do not show the actual like new brilliant color, ie mint state.
I think the following dime is either an EF-40 or an AU-50 and it still has a brilliant like new color.
I think the following dime is either an EF-40 or an AU-50 and it still has a brilliant like new color.
Please respond as I am very interested in your opinions.
Dan
0
Comments
The second coin looks to me like an AU-53, maybe.
The bottom two are kind of fuzzy with mushy obverses. They look to me like on the lower edge of AU, maybe.
The split bands are the split between the two bands in the center of the reverse. None of these are split bands.
I am eager to hear others' views on these coins.
Yeah I know these photos are a poor representation of the actual luster, especially in the first two coins. In fact these coins were photographed on a white table and as you can see it looks bronze in the photograph. I took the photographs under halogen light and I think that may have magnified the marks you mentioned. These marks are not visible with the naked eye and aren't distracting under well light magnification, well at least not to me. You'll have to take my word for the strong luster of the first two coins. The luster compares favorably to my 1963 and 1963 proof sets. The top coin does have pretty good split center band.
I don't think I zoomed properly on the obverse of the fourth coin hence the fuzzy look, but the mushy look is due to wear and tear.
AU-50: Light wear on many of the high points, At least half of the mint luster is present.
AU-55: Evidence of friction on design high points. Most of the mint luster is still present.
MS-60: No trace of wear but may show a number of contact marks, and surface may be spotted or lack some luster.
MS-63: Some distracting contact marks or blemishes in prime focal areas. Luster may be impaired.
Merc Dimes: No wear, Light blemishes, Attractive Mint Luster.
MS-65: Above average uncirculated coin that may be briliant or lightly toned and has very few contact marks on the surface or rim.
Merc Dimes: Only light scattered marks that are not distracting. Strong luster, good eye appeal.
Having said all that I do think your comments and grades are fair and I wouldn't have a problem grading these coins as such. After having looked at the PCGS registry it does seem that the Mercury dimes that are MS-65 or higher have the center split band more defined than in any of my photographs. After your comments I think I would grade the coins as follows:
#1: MS-63 This coin looks as good (in person) as the PCGS MS-63 Mercury Dimes in the registry. It has very attractive luster
#2: MS-60 I don't see any evidence of friction, but it is definitely not as nice as #1. It has very attractive luster, but just a couple of hairs below #1.
Since I didn't see any friction, that is why I'm thinking it is out of the AU range. If an MS it is definitely a low one.
#3: AU-50 I think that is fair since there is slight wear/friction on the hair braid. It has very attractive luster, below #2.
#4: AU-50 I think that is fair since there is slight wear/friction on the hair braid. It has very attractive luster, below #2.
What about the designation FB (Full Band) in reference to Mercury Dimes. What does this mean.
Dan
Yeah I've been busy. It is even worse than you think. I entered each and every coin into an Excel Spreadsheet with Red Book prices and PCGS prices so that I can get a reasonable estimate of what the total collection is worth. I need to do a little fine tuning on some of the prices. I will probably do that by talking to a local numismatist to see what general prices he'd pay per category of coin and then update the spreadsheet. The spreadsheet even calculates the total silver value and face value in dollars. My ultimate goal is to sell the whole collection to one person, give them a fair deal and not get screwed in the process. However if someone were willing they could easily use the spreadsheet and enter the numbers they were willing to pay for the coins. Heck I may sell the collection at the price we negotiate favorable to me and give him a 12 lb bag of FDR dimes not yet graded. I probably wouldn't accept selling the coins at $0.40 each because right now each dime is worth $0.51 in silver value alone (based on July Market $7.11/oz silver).
In the end everything is negotiable.
Dan
And since we've all overlooked it in our rush to talk about coins . . . I'm sorry your having to do all this work on top of your father's death. I am sorry for your loss.
I agree with your statements, I don't have problem with giving a dealer a reasonable percentage off of the value. After all they are in business to make money, so I wouldn't expect them to play full red book prices. However, my bargaining power increases due to the level of effort I have undertaken to grade and estimate reasonable prices. I am not sure about my local numismatist yet, he has said a few things that I thought were a bit off, but I think he's honest which is the most important thing.
What about selling these coins on Ebay. If I did so I would provide the spreadsheet collection in an Adobe Acrobat format so people would easily know what they are getting and can bid accordingly.
Thank you for your comment regarding my fathers passing, he lived to be 73 and had a very good life and it was time.
In my opinion, from these pictures, all the coins look to have been cleaned. They may be "Mint State" but they have been harshly cleaned (As evidenced by all the hairline scratchs that cover the coins). A mint state coin is defined as having no wear at all. The highest points of the coin is where the coin starts to wear first. On the Mercury dimes, this is the hair over Miss Liberty's ear. Wear is most easilly seen has a dulling of the luster. Rotate the coins in the light, and see if there are flat spots with no luster on the hair. Sometimes there are flat areas on the hair, from a weak strike, and this can be easilly mistaken for wear. Again, a dulling and usually a slight color variation, is the easiest sign of wear, imo.
As for Full Bands, a Mercury must be Mint State, and the middle bands on the fasces (The axe with rounds bound to it on the reverse) must be fully split and rounded. There must be a straight, unbroken line across the bands, there can be no hits across the bands. Sometimes the line can be unbroken, but still not be called FB, because the bands need to be fully struck up and rounded. This is kind of a grey area.
Further advice as to selling, your best bet is going to be a dealer, and going to several dealers to get bids. If the Mercuries pictured are typical of the rest of the coins, you're pretty much going to get melt value or maybe a little bit more for them... 4-5x face value. As for the Roosevelts, same story, except it's going to be 4x face, except maybe for uncirculated coins. Again, the highest point of the design is the first place wear appears (I really can't definately tell you where exactly that is
Good luck
42/92
To me, most of the lines in the top photo look like flow lines. I think the lighting exacerbates their presence. This does not look like harsh cleaning to me.
Unless there is a bunch of semi-key dates in this lot, there is not a significant difference between what a group that grades F to EF with an average grade of VF and a group that grades VF to AU with an average grade of EF sells typically sells for.
<< <i>To me, most of the lines in the top photo look like flow lines >>
I see the flow lines you're talking about, very evident in the fields of both sides of the first coin. There are a great number of lines going horizontal across Libertie's neck that couldn't be flow lines and look much more like cleaning to me. I also see what I think are cleaning lines below "E PLURIBUS UNUM" and to the right of the fasces.
Assuredly none of those coins look Unc. There's quite visible/obvious rub even on the top one, but the hairlines tell the tales all on to themselves.
The top one could grade Unc at NGC -- a great number of NGC MS60-63 Mercury Dimes are AU58. However, doubtful even the top one would go Unc at PCGS, but anything could happen on any given day.
I don't see the necessity for getting these slabbed as the slab/plastic will be worth more than the coin inside. The 44-D is the most common Merc, where you can buy a stunning MS67FB in PCGS plastic for under $100 on any given day.
Comparing one coin to another to establish a grade for a non-slabbed coin is a sure fire way to loose a lot of $$. Just because a coin is in plastic that says MS63 doesn't mean it is and doesn't mean a comparable coin can ever find it's way in to an MS63 holder. The MS63 coin can be AU58, and the graders made a mistake...this happens because everyone is human...and if cracked out it might never find its way back in to an MS63 holder, neither would a comporable raw one be able to get in to a 63 holder likewise.
Just a data point/observation, and a lot of experience/$$ behind making the above statement.
Here's what a 63FB should look like (plastic or raw, still should be the same coin):
That photo you provided helped a bit. I will grade the top one at an AU-58, the second at AU-55 and the other two at AU-50. My dad got a lot of his coins through metal detecting and I recall that he used water to remove the soil. I have not cleaned any of them as I am opposed to the general idea of cleaning anything, lol.
As far as the rest of my collection here is brief summary
2 Morgans 1896/1921 (Dad says they are MS-65, I think he bought them)
1 Peace Dollar
5 Eisenhower Dollars
1 Columbian Exposition Half Dollar
4 Barber Half Dollars 1907 to 1912
63 Liberty Walking Half Dollars 1917 to 1937
46 Franklin Half Dollars
45 Kennedy Half Dollars
19 Barber Quarters 1899 to ?
7 Standing Liberty Quarter Dollar 1916 to 1930
286 Washington Quarters
7 Liberty & Barber Dimes
2400 Mercury Dimes 1917 to 1945
2500 Approx Roosevelt Dimes
2 Indian Head Nickles
75 Jefferson Nickles
2 Indian Head Pennies
388 Wheat Ears Pennies
2 1963 Proof Sets (1 unopened)
2 1964 Proof Sets
1 gold tooth cap
That totals to around 5864 coins with some miscellanious commemoratives and tokens that I didn't mention.
I don't like the idea of just selling my coins for silver value unless they are junk. Certainly not when someone wants to pay me 40 cents per Roosevelt Dime when the actual silver value is 51 cents based on recent market prices. At what grade is it appropriate to call a coin junk? I know this varies based on coin type and year. Take for example the bottom two mercury dimes possible rated at AU-50. I would sell those for the Red Book EF-40 price of $1.50 each. Heck even for Roosevelt dimes a dealer would get 80 cents for an EF-40. At what point is a coin considered a real coin and nice? What about your comments on the Red Book and it's prices?
What about your comments on the Red Book and it's prices?