It's a shame we won't be able to post photos any longer

stev32k · August 4, 2005 10:07AM

I really enjoyed looking at other peoples coin images and discussing the photography involved. Guess that won't be possible any more.

tradedollarnut · August 4, 2005 10:09AM

Huh?

My eyes glazed over about 2 sentences into the new rules - where's the Executive Summary version?

Russ · August 4, 2005 10:12AM

<< My eyes glazed over about 2 sentences into the new rules >>

Don't worry, TDN, it does NOT say we can't post images any more.

Russ, NCNE

Blackhawk · August 4, 2005 10:12AM

I didn't see that part...maybe you just can't use others photos without permission.

dthigpen · August 4, 2005 10:13AM

Just someone being overdramatic about a standard disclaimer.

LeeG · August 4, 2005 10:14AM

Sure you can post pic's. Anything posted PCGS can use it in any manner they see fit.

ldhair · August 4, 2005 10:24AM

Is there a short version of just the changes?

CalGold · August 4, 2005 10:24AM

TDN, these new terms include the Blackhawk rule: you are not allowed to post pictures of coins that make the rest of ours look like rusty washers.

CG

stev32k · August 4, 2005 10:29AM

Yeah, that was the wrong title. Nothing says you can't post photos. It just says you give up all rights to any photo you do post. Maybe it does not apply to everyone but I make part of my living from photography and all my images are copy righted my me. I'm not giving that away to PCGS just because I post an image on their website. I will abide by the T&Cs so that means no photo posting for me.

Russ · August 4, 2005 10:35AM

<< It just says you give up all rights to any photo you do post. >>

The paragraph to which you refer is standard boiler plate used by forums all over the internet.

Edited to add: And, it does NOT say you "give up all rights" to any photo you post. Sheesh!

Russ, NCNE

librtyhead · August 4, 2005 10:36AM

I have no problem posting the coins I own and when I grow up I will post a few!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

topstuf · August 4, 2005 10:39AM

Come to MY forum. I allow photo posting without limit.

However the COIN becomes my exclusive property.

stev32k · August 4, 2005 10:40AM

<<The paragraph to which you refer is standard boiler plate used by forums all over the internet.>>

I post on quite a few internet sites and read all the T&Cs about rights to the posted images and have never seen one that claims they own them if you post there. Can you provide some references?

Russ · August 4, 2005 10:51AM

<< and have never seen one that claims they own them if you post there. >>

And the TOS here doesn't say they OWN them if you post them here. It says they have the right to USE them.

<< Can you provide some references? >>

From the NGC forum TOS:

<< By providing any Content to our web site:

(a) you agree to grant to us a worldwide, royalty-free, perpetual, non-exclusive right and license (including any moral rights or other necessary rights) to use, display, reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, distribute, perform, promote, archive, translate, and to create derivative works and compilations, in whole or in part. Such license will apply with respect to any form, media, technology known or later developed; >>

I can give you dozens from all over the web.

Russ, NCNE

stev32k · August 4, 2005 11:00AM

<>

Okay, I'd like to see them. maybe I'm putting photos out there for others to use without paying for them and just don't know it.

After reading that I won't post photos on the NGC site either.

coinkat · August 4, 2005 11:05AM

magikbilly · August 4, 2005 11:08AM

<< <>

Okay, I'd like to see them. maybe I'm putting photos out there for others to use without paying for them and just don't know it.

After reading that I won't post photos on the NGC site either. >>

<<Maybe it does not apply to everyone but I make part of my living from photography and all my images are copy righted my me>>

NO OFFENSE at all, but I am surprised you did not know that about posting stuff online. There are a few sites that I post to that are not like this (truly rare image theft is a huge problem) but most have this kind of agreement - just like auction catalog photos and descriptions (even if you write them yourself) = property of the auction house. As far as copyright - anyone that takes a photograph has just technically copyrighted it as Author as soon as the shutter clicks. As long as there are no TM problems with the subject. But, like you, granting use is something I am normally paid for - so I too will consider what I post here but I doubt it will affect me much.

Best,
Billy

Russ · August 4, 2005 11:09AM

<< <>

Okay, I'd like to see them. >>

I picked a forum at random:

http://www.justlinux.com/forum/index.php

From their TOS:

<< By posting messages, uploading files, inputting data, or engaging in any other form of communication through this service (collectively "the content"), you are granting Jupitermedia Corp., its successors and assignees, a royalty-free, perpetual, non-exclusive, unrestricted, worldwide license to use, adapt, transmit, publicly perform or display any such content on the site to which it was contributed (or successor site). In plain English, you allow us to continue to display your contributions to the site. We won't do anything else with them, however. >>

Like I said, it's standard boiler plate.

Russ, NCNE

tmot99 · August 4, 2005 11:10AM

The boiler plate allows PCGS to use posted photos. I can see that this will allow them to fill the vacancies on the CoinFacts.com website. There are many varieties that do not have photos posted.

I can see stev32k's point, especially being a professional. You don't get to make the royalties on the photo. I'm not concerned. I can't take a decent photo if my life depended on it!

Russ · August 4, 2005 11:14AM

<< I can see stev32k's point, especially being a professional. >>

He's blowing it all out of proportion, particularly in light of the fact that the overwhelming majority of forums have that language in their TOS's. It's nothing new.

Russ, NCNE

stev32k · August 4, 2005 11:16AM

I believe I've read several posts complaining about others using their photos (mostly on ebay) without permission - including one or more by Russ. Now if you post a photo here you are giving them permission to use your photo any way they see fit for any purpose what-so-ever.

So how would you feel if the ebay T&Cs said your photos could be used for any purpose what-so-ever. By posting an image on ebay you give them, or anyone they designate, the right to use your photo in any way they please - sell similar coins, an advertising campaign, as an example of bad photography, etc. I don't think so.

Russ · August 4, 2005 11:21AM

<< Now if you post a photo here you are giving them permission to use your photo any way they see fit for any purpose what-so-ever. >>

What do you mean "now"? The language didn't just get added today. You really should read the TOS's where you post if you're so worried about it.

Russ, NCNE

Russ · August 4, 2005 11:28AM

<< I believe I've read several posts complaining about others using their photos (mostly on ebay) without permission - including one or more by Russ. >>

That's a very lame comparison. When I signed up on eBay I didn't agree to a TOS allowing other eBay members to use my images.

Russ, NCNE

stev32k · August 4, 2005 11:34AM

<<What do you mean "now"? The language didn't just get added today. You really should read the TOS's where you post if you're so worried about it.>>

I did read the T&Cs and here is what it says about copyright:

<<COPYRIGHTS AND COPYRIGHT AGENTS

CU respects the intellectual property of others, and we ask our visitors to do the same.>>

That seems to be in conflict with the new T&Cs.

atarian · August 4, 2005 11:36AM

now thats just freakin great i just figured out this scanner then someone says i cant use it. oh yippe. im waiting for the petition to bring pics back

Russ · August 4, 2005 11:37AM

<< I did read the T&Cs and here is what it says about copyright:

<<COPYRIGHTS AND COPYRIGHT AGENTS

CU respects the intellectual property of others, and we ask our visitors to do the same.>>

That seems to be in conflict with the new T&Cs. >>

I guess you're hoping that nobody will notice there are two sets? One for CU as a whole and one for the forum. You quoted from the former.

Russ, NCNE

rip · August 4, 2005 11:44AM

<< now thats just freakin great i just figured out this scanner then someone says i cant use it. oh yippe. im waiting for the petition to bring pics back >>

A little more effort reading the whole post please.

pharmer · August 4, 2005 11:45AM

Aw gee whiz, that stinks, and I was really enjoying it. Can't EVEN have any fun anymore

Thanks for the heads up, Steve. Well, that's it, there's just no reason to go on. Goodbye, and thanks for all the fish

and

Russ · August 4, 2005 11:46AM

Russ, NCNE

stev32k · August 4, 2005 11:48AM

<<That's a very lame comparison. When I signed up on eBay I didn't agree to a TOS allowing other eBay members to use my images. >>

That is not a lame comparison. It is directly and exactly on point. Your images belong to you - period. Makes no difference if you post them on ebay or PCGS the rights to your photos belong to you and no one else. If you choose to give up those rights that is your decision, but it is not a wide spread practice on the web - in fact the opposite is true.

stman · August 4, 2005 11:49AM

Oh no, no way am I letting this board or any other board own MY "SCANS." They are too valuable and take me a lot of time to
do. If any body's gonna make a profit on them it will be me. Sorry folks.... No scans for you!!!!!

stev32k thanks for the heads up.

stman · August 4, 2005 11:52AM

What a soap opera this joint has become!!!!

RYK · August 4, 2005 11:54AM

Look at the bright side. You will no longer be subject to my crappy pictures of my crappy coins.

1907Quarter · August 4, 2005 11:57AM

Hey, I'm thrilled someone used one of my photos(my icon) for their icon!!

EVillageProwler · August 4, 2005 12:02PM

Is this thread actually serious? If so, hard to believe...

LucyBop · August 4, 2005 12:06PM

<< Oh no, no way am I letting this board or any other board own MY "SCANS." They are too valuable and take me a lot of time to
do. If any body's gonna make a profit on them it will be me. Sorry folks.... No scans for you!!!!!

stev32k thanks for the heads up. >>

You have nothing but a bunch of fingerprinted eyesores!

How do you like them apples?

magikbilly · August 4, 2005 12:06PM

I like to protect my images too (non-coin unique/rare stuff) but the reality is people are stealing images and text all the time. Stuff (images and text) from some of the other areas I post to has appeard on the other side of the world without credit - and for sale as well

but it is going to happen. People can always mark the images if they are worried. A lot of people still think you have to "copyright" something, or show the little (C) - not true. Technically, an image is protected and "copyrighted" as soon as you click the shutter. Long ago, before I knew about this stuff, I was posting some unique images online for free. Now I mark them - and they still get taken. I don't worry too much about it - and I keep the DPI low - just enough for PC display - no one is going to make saleable prints from that. It is BTW generally a standard practice from what I see - to have this in the Terms and Conditions.

Billy

stev32k · August 4, 2005 12:28PM

<< By posting messages, uploading files, inputting data, or engaging in any other form of communication through this service (collectively "the content"), you are granting Jupitermedia Corp., its successors and assignees, a royalty-free, perpetual, non-exclusive, unrestricted, worldwide license to use, adapt, transmit, publicly perform or display any such content on the site to which it was contributed (or successor site). In plain English, you allow us to continue to display your contributions to the site. We won't do anything else with them, however. >>

This is somewhat different than saying they have unlimited use of anything you post. Notice the last two sentences <<In plain English, you allow us to continue to display your contributions to the site. We won't do anything else with them, however. >> They have limited their use to display on the the site. That is not the same as giving them unlimited rights to do whatever they want with the post.

Any others?

Conder101 · August 4, 2005 12:36PM

So just post a link to your image. Since the image isn't posted on or hosted by CU/PCGS they don't have any rights to them. They can use the link all they want but not the image.

LucyBop · August 4, 2005 12:40PM

as far as I am concerned PCGs or any member of these fine forums is free to have, use, any image that I post....

Many of my images have made their way to being used as avaitars...

Crazy Man Crazy!

stev32k · August 4, 2005 12:51PM

<< So just post a link to your image. Since the image isn't posted on or hosted by CU/PCGS they don't have any rights to them. They can use the link all they want but not the image. >>

Bingo! I think that's the answer - posting a link is not the same as posting the image itself.

stman · August 4, 2005 12:58PM

A link? cool. OK, not to worry folks. Although I haven't been posting scans for a while I got a bunch.
Matter fact..... I'm gonna get that roll of JFK's from the safe box (yes the safe box) and "SCAN" every one of those white
"things" for ya'll. Stay tuned!!!!

atarian · August 4, 2005 1:01PM

well it seems like it really doesnt say anything about pics. just dont steal a pic or use a pic to falsify a coin you might be selling or saying you have. but this whole use standard english and capitals and stuff hmm that can be hard forme. but then again i think yall use to me not taking great time to make sure capital letters are where they should be.

mgoodm3 · August 4, 2005 1:11PM

I was thinking was conder said above. I just post links. i don't store things on their servers.

XpipedreamR · August 4, 2005 1:16PM

I'm sure glad we've got this all worked out. Now post some pretty links.

stman · August 4, 2005 1:19PM

<< as far as I am concerned PCGs or any member of these fine forums is free to have, use, any image that I post.... >>

Really?

ElmerFusterpuck · August 4, 2005 1:25PM

Jeez, some if this is sounding like the music industry. If you don't want people to to see or copy your images and jeopardize your precious 'intellectual prperty', then don't post them! Keep 'em all in a dark room with a computer in a lock box where only YOU can view them.

An economy built on 'intellectual property' seems to be one built on a house of cards, but that's another topic altogether...

atarian · August 4, 2005 1:25PM

so what happens if i post a pic now , im gonna get banned since i didnt see anything spelled out.

Dave99B · August 4, 2005 1:27PM

I've been stealing images for years....still waiting for the police to pull up out front...

Dave

Myqqy · August 4, 2005 1:37PM

I'm gonna get that roll of JFK's from the safe box (yes the safe box) and "SCAN" every one of those white
"things" for ya'll. Stay tuned!!!!

Echhhhhhh......... please don't!!!!!

dthigpen · August 4, 2005 1:38PM

In response to this, I've decided to sell the rights to images of various pocket change on ebay.

It's a shame we won't be able to post photos any longer

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