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Who can grade Indian head buffalo nickels? Here are five to grade. (Grades Revealed)
DMWJR
Posts: 5,993 ✭✭✭✭✭
I bought these five nickels raw years ago, and had them graded by PCGS three years ago at the FUN show. I realized at that time that there was a lot more to grading Buffalo nickels than meets the eye. See how your grading skills stack up to PCGS standards.
Good luck, and I will reveal the grades at a later time.
1920-D
1920-S
1923-S
1924-D
1925-D
Good luck, and I will reveal the grades at a later time.
1920-D
1920-S
1923-S
1924-D
1925-D
Doug
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Edit: By my extremely untrained eye with these, all but the first is AU/MS, and the first may still be AU or just a weak strike, no idea...
Self Indulgence | Holey Coins | Flickr Photostream
Thigs, just from my limited experience, Buffs have the most "art" to grading than any other series, and in particular, the 1920 decade!
62
62
64
63
64
LSCC#1864
Ebay Stuff
<< <i>Thigs, just from my limited experience, Buffs have the most "art" to grading than any other series, and in particular, the 1920 decade!
I agree completely, I don't even pretend to know how to grade Indian Head Nickels. There are so many variables to consider with them, along with their reliefs and the inconsistancy in strikes which makes it a crap shoot unless you're an expert in the series.
Self Indulgence | Holey Coins | Flickr Photostream
Oh, and if you can give any reasons for the grades, I would love to hear them, and learn a little bit about grading Buffs.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
20-D VF-30
20-S EF-45
23-S AU-55 (looks like a 'passing a kidney stone' variety)
24-D AU-58/MS-60
25-D " "
63
62
64
64
63
1920-D VG 8 can't really see the coin...
1920-S VF 35 (although most would probably say at least EF)
1923-S AU 55 again the pic...
1924-D EF 40
1925-D AU 50 kind of a soft stike or lighting again?
Just my best guesses from what I can see here. I haven't looked at anyone elses opinions yet.
-Kurt-
Edited to add:
OK, now I've looked at what others have said... I'm not an expert in Buffs but if I'm not mistaken all of these are coins with historically soft strikes. So, I was probably rediculously harsh here. On the 20-D from the Pic I can't see the horn at all and the date looks like it's worn. The 23-S is a specatcular looking coin but without being abale to have the lighting to look for lustre breaks on the Buffalos thigh and parts of the Indian's face all I could bring myself to say was AU 55. Oh well, these things are always a crap shoot. I look forward to you posting the grades.
NoEbayAuctionsForNow
Here's my guesses
1920-D AU50
1920-S MS61
1923-S MS63
1924-D MS63
1925-D MS63
MS61. These images are VERY hard to grade from, so I may be off and it well may be AU. Very weak strike along the edge on this one, check out the head on the bison, and on the obverse check out the date, and the feathers on the Indian. Interestingly, these features are at the same location on the coin, but on opposite sides. Now look at the other side of the coin, the tail of the bison is nearly fully seperated from the rim, well struck over there.
1920-S
MS61. Again, the pictures aren't the greatest but I do think the luster is too subdued on this one to be fully mint state though it may have slid in. Poor detail on the bison's shoulder area, as well as the braids on the Indian. Again, the same location on the coin but on opposite sides. I think I see some die breaks; one extending from the P in Pluribus to the F in of. Another die break on the rear, close leg of the bison. The woodgrain streakiness of the toning comes from the impurities in the alloys. I'm torn between calling this one an AU55 and an MS61 but I'll assume the luster is better than the pictures show.
1923-S
MS64. A nicely struck specimen, about 5 percent off center on the reverse. Some small hits, a lack of detail in the Indian's hair, and a whitish spot on the reverse keep it out of a gem holder, IMHO. Also note the tail merges with the rim. I believe this was a generally well struck date.
1924-D
MS63. Average strike, note the lack of detail on the bison's shoulder and in the Indian's hair (compare to the previous coin). There are some scattered marks which would be more evident if the image were larger.
1925-D
MS65. Well stuck with a pleasing look to it. Note however the tail does once again merge with the rim. Small carbon spot noted to the right of the date.
20D....AU58
23S....MS63...Nice looking coin and best of the lot IMO.
24D....AU55
25D....MS63
I put these in photo shop and lightened them up and enlarged them. I really could not tell if the flat spots were from strike or wear. The Bisons head on the 20D sure looks like a strike problem and the coin is probably Mint State but AU58 was given because of the way coins are market graded.
Nice Coins. I wish I knew more about the striking of certain dates within this series.
Ken
Robert --->
Thanks for the excellent comments!!! I'll PM you the actuals. I'm waiting on Shamika before I post them publicly.
MS-63 Struck thru ,I think the head and horn are the result of being struck thru grease
XF-45 Noticeable wear on the face and feathers obverse, legs and head and horn Reverse.
MS-63 Nice coin, but a little dark and a little lightly struck
AU-55 same as # 2 only not quite the wear visable on the coin
MS-64 Very pleasing coin Nicely struck just lacks a little luster to be a 65
Rick
Always Looking for Raw Proof Lincoln Cents !!
1920-D MS62 - The obverse is a solid 63 (date is weak), but the lack of a horn due to the weak strike keeps it from going above 62. None the less, I really love the look of this coin.
1920-S MS61 - The chip on the Buffalo's shoulder as well as the scratch also keeps this from going 63. Luster appears to be muted. I like the die crack on the Buffalo's back leg.
1923-S MS63 - Very nice strike. I can't tell if I see rub on the Buffalo's hip. If so, AU-58. If not, should be a rock solid MS64.
1924-D MS63 - Again, I can't make out the hip. Rub = AU-55. Otherwise, MS63. The reverse strike is weak, but otherwise it's a clean coin.
1925-D MS64 - Hip rub? If not, MS64. This is a date that is often poorly struck, unlike yours.
Overall, this is a great bunch of Buffalos.
DOES THIS LOOK FAMILIAR?
Chris, I can't believe you remembered that 20-d and could pull it up! It just goes to show you that one man's AU53 is another's MS61! I was going to point out that the 20-d had a chip on the cheek which (if viewed in hand) is obviously from before it left the mint. The other comment I was going to add was that the 25-s has a black streak on the lower reverse through the "C" in Cent that was made into the coin. There is luster on top of it, but the mark probably knocks the grade a point.
The PCGS grades from the FUN 2002 show were 53, 58, 63, 62, 63. The 23s is the nicest of the batch, although the personality of the 20s really floats my boat. It's like war paint on that Indian!
Fairlaineman, you are the man when it comes to grading them from pics! You were just a hair from being 5/5 on them, which puts you in the grading room at PCGS (although the coins were low balled!!!)
Thanks again, I really learned something from this post, and it is always nice to learn more about coins you own. In my humble opinion, all four of these coins should go MS all day long.
It's funny that ANACS and PCGS would differ by so much on the 20-D. Without question, you should resubmit it. There are no indications of wear from what I see in the image. Only a very poor strike.
Great thread!
I'm too late to guess the grades, but I'll offer a few comments (of course, it's always easier to comment after the fact than before). Based in part on a few AU58's I've received in the recent past, IMHO the high points on the obverse are the Indian's check and eye brow. On the reverse, both the upper leg/shoulder and the hip up to the boney area near the bison's back are high points. The split tail on many issues is more an indicator of strike than probable wear (if it shows wear, so will other areas). Unfortunately, your lighting highlights the boney area making it appear to be worn slightly in most cases. Note that these area are not quite the same as Halperin indicates in his book, "How to Grade U.S. Coins". Your experience may vary... Nonethess,
1920-d: The boney area and possibly the hip appear to show wear. The mark on the cheek happens to be at a wear high point, making it suspicious (and likely to show even the tiniest wear). The mark and the weak strike apparently yield the 53.
1920-s: The color on the obverse is suspicious, at least in the image. On the reverse, the boney area appears flat. It could be from strike, but it is worth a closer look. The mark heading north from the P n Pluribus likely is from a clashed die.
1923-s: Very nice. Liberty appears a little weak, but overall well-struck. Not enough "pizzaz" (in the image) to be a 64.
1924-d: Not a great strike but I would say above average for the date. The boney area again looks a bit worn. I would have guessed 58 or 55. In hand, it should be easier to see. The marks under the belly and elsewhere on the reverse likely dropped it to 62.
1925-d: Again I would say well-struck for the date. The eye brow appears to have a few marks and the boney area is questionable. I would have guessed either 58 or 63. It has fewer reverse marks than the 1924-d.
Overall some well-struck coins for some very difficult dates. Thanks for the opportunity. Enjoy (I did)!
CoolKarma
MS Buffalo
MS 1951
In your opinion is the 20D Mint State and was it Market Graded ? When I looked at it I really saw no wear.
Thanks Again.
Cheers.
Ken
<< <i>After further review, I want to change the grade for the 20-D to MS61.
DOES THIS LOOK FAMILIAR?
Ken, I think it is MS and so did ANACS. Click the link in Shamika's post to see the coin in an ANACS 61 holder.