One parting thought. I don't ever recall the folks who frequently post their cherrypicks complaining on the boards that they got ripped by a dealer. Just a thought. >>
Never even insinuated that they did. I think it would be tough for a dealer to rip these guys if he really tried. Interesting difference in terminology though - "cherrypick" vs "rip"
It's okay for dealers to "rip," "cherrypick," "score," on each other. It's not okay for a dealer to do these things to collectors, innocent little old ladies or ignorant old men, etc. There's a big difference in my opinion.
Oh, and when Russ and others make a "score," "rip" or "cherrypick" on a dealer/seller?
That's okay. It says so in my book of ethics.
Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
Seems to me that if you made a coin worth several hundren dollars from a Proof set that a dealer was happy to let go for $11, then you worked hard and made a big score, no problems there. If you use your advanced knowledge to "steal" from somone who doesnt know better, you're a scumbag.....pretty simple.
<< <i>Why is it OK for one of to make a "score," but not OK for a dealer to do the same? >>
I don't feel that way myself, but when it comes to newbies, there are plenty of dealers and collectors that are guilty of "ripping". I suppose some find it more forgiveable when both parties deal under the auspices of experience and expertise. Lying is lying. When that factor enters the negotiation, we have a crook.
Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
I know I didn't feel compelled to inform the dealer at the show that the 1905 micro 'O' dime in extra fine that he had in his junk box was worth multiples of what he was asking for it.
Yes, one would see potential "rips" like this in the '80's. I miss those days.
Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
<< <i>also there is a huge problem with the premise on some coins it is the plastic that makes the coin not the coin itself >>
Elitist crap, and that attitude is the single biggest reason some dealers are easy to rip.
I know of a dealer who essentially told a collector he was stupid for offering the kind of money he did for moderns as said collector bought a group of coins from this dealer for ONE THIRD their market value. And, we aren't talking cheap coins - these were multi $thousands.
It's humorous that some dealers will go over most raw coins with a magnifying glass and even check wheat cents but will sell thousand dollar moderns for nickels on the dol- lar.
By the same token though I've had dealers turn down extremely strong offers like $25 for a slider '83-P quarter because they figured if I wanted it, it must be worth more. It was just a type "d" reverse which is hardly scarce for this date. There must be hundreds of them this nice.
Laws are rules adopted by society (through the legislative, judicial and sometimes the executive branchs of government). Theoretically if you break the law, you should suffer adverse consequences. More important than laws however are morals and ethics. Morals and ethics, if instilled in a person, are a good defense against destructive human interaction. Morals and ethics come into play in every transaction, including coin transactions. Can you look at yourself in the mirror the next day and see an honorable person or something else?
However, the presence of the law, morals and ethics, is not an excuse for stupidity and ignorance.
No one should expect that others can and should take care of and look out for him/her. If you do not know about the subject matter of a transaction (i.e. the value of coins that come into your possession), you should devote some time and effort to educate yourself. If you do not do so, then the chances of you being "ripped" increases. If you are "ripped" due to your own ignorance/stupidity/laziness, any after the fact whining that you are a "Victim" rings hollow.
Self reliance (including education) instead of expecting others to look out for you and dealing with persons possessed of good morals and ethics will prevent you from being ripped.
As far as a dealer "ripping" a non dealer, I have more trouble with that than I have with a dealer being "cherrypicked", primarily based upon the fact that persons in business are supposed to have more knowledge than the unwashed masses and if they do not take the time to learn about their product line, then they risk having reduced success. Further, dealers may know that to some people certain coins (i.e. cameos) have more value but they choose to treat cameo and non cameo coins the same. Besides it is great fun to cherrypick.
Comments
<< <i>PutTogether,
One parting thought. I don't ever recall the folks who frequently post their cherrypicks complaining on the boards that they got ripped by a dealer. Just a thought. >>
Never even insinuated that they did. I think it would be tough for a dealer to rip these guys if he really tried. Interesting difference in terminology though - "cherrypick" vs "rip"
Oh, and when Russ and others make a "score," "rip" or "cherrypick" on a dealer/seller?
That's okay. It says so in my book of ethics.
Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
Fair exchange is no robbery
<< <i>Why is it OK for one of to make a "score," but not OK for a dealer to do the same? >>
I don't feel that way myself, but when it comes to newbies, there are plenty of dealers and collectors that are guilty of "ripping". I suppose some find it more forgiveable when both parties deal under the auspices of experience and expertise. Lying is lying. When that factor enters the negotiation, we have a crook.
Yes, one would see potential "rips" like this in the '80's. I miss those days.
Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
<< <i>also there is a huge problem with the premise on some coins it is the plastic that makes the coin not the coin itself >>
Elitist crap, and that attitude is the single biggest reason some dealers are easy to rip.
I know of a dealer who essentially told a collector he was stupid for offering the kind of money he did for moderns as said collector bought a group of coins from this dealer for ONE THIRD their market value. And, we aren't talking cheap coins - these were multi $thousands.
Russ, NCNE
and even check wheat cents but will sell thousand dollar moderns for nickels on the dol-
lar.
By the same token though I've had dealers turn down extremely strong offers like $25
for a slider '83-P quarter because they figured if I wanted it, it must be worth more. It
was just a type "d" reverse which is hardly scarce for this date. There must be hundreds
of them this nice.
However, the presence of the law, morals and ethics, is not an excuse for stupidity and ignorance.
No one should expect that others can and should take care of and look out for him/her. If you do not know about the subject matter of a transaction (i.e. the value of coins that come into your possession), you should devote some time and effort to educate yourself. If you do not do so, then the chances of you being "ripped" increases. If you are "ripped" due to your own ignorance/stupidity/laziness, any after the fact whining that you are a "Victim" rings hollow.
Self reliance (including education) instead of expecting others to look out for you and dealing with persons possessed of good morals and ethics will prevent you from being ripped.
As far as a dealer "ripping" a non dealer, I have more trouble with that than I have with a dealer being "cherrypicked", primarily based upon the fact that persons in business are supposed to have more knowledge than the unwashed masses and if they do not take the time to learn about their product line, then they risk having reduced success. Further, dealers may know that to some people certain coins (i.e. cameos) have more value but they choose to treat cameo and non cameo coins the same. Besides it is great fun to cherrypick.