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PCGS – Do they know, what they are doing?
Udo
Posts: 984 ✭✭
Yesterday my two purchases from HWCA arrived here in Germany. I`d like to show you one of the coins.
2 Mark Württemberg 1892 – King Willhelm II. – hard to find in this condition.
It was graded and encapsuled by PCGS and it is also hard to get a good photo of the coin in that plastic tomb. But see yourself:
What do you think, what grade did the give the coin?
2 Mark Württemberg 1892 – King Willhelm II. – hard to find in this condition.
It was graded and encapsuled by PCGS and it is also hard to get a good photo of the coin in that plastic tomb. But see yourself:
What do you think, what grade did the give the coin?
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If hairlines, then no more than an MS62, maybe MS63. No hairlines; then MS64.
It looks to have nice lustre......very nice images, BTW.
DPOTD-1
<< <i>The fields look clean, I see no rim nicks. There may be a scratch along the eagle's right talon. To be conservative I'd might wager MS64. >>
<< <i>MS63. Is that a scratch below the letters (DEUTS) "CHES"? >>
In fact this is a little die scratch.
After I changed the lightning a bit, I took the next photo of the obverse and some bad "details" appeared then!
I'll say MS-63.
DPOTD-3
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Nice coin nonetheless.
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Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Most coins I bought from ebay were trash, more or less. But I made good experiences with that plastic holders, the coins graded by a third party were quality coins.
But this one is confusing me! Today I examined it several times during the day, we had cloudy weather, the obverse fields looked OK to the naked eye. But under sunlight or using a good light bulb, these hairlines on the obverse are visible to the naked eye.
Well, as wybrit said, nonetheless a nice coin with good cartwheel-luster.
IMHO this coin was cleaned. Sombody cleaned the obverse and left that hairlines on it, he worked carfully and the hairlines are only visible to the naked with good light or using a magnifying glass.
I am not that familar with US-Grading, but my understanding is that Grading Services are able to determine if a coin was cleaned and will not slab it if so.
PCGS must have seen and determined the hairlines, but it is not a bodybag.
Really. Like Aethelred, I leaned a little toward MS61 for a moment, and wondered if they had bodybagged it, but I eventually decided to go with my first impression, which was MS62.
They graded it exactly as I would have.
Nice lookin' coin!
<< <i>I am not that familar with US-Grading, but my understanding is that Grading Services are able to determine if a coin was cleaned and will not slab it if so. >>
PCGS will grade cleaned coins, as will most of the other services. They are candid about this in their Grading and Counterfeit detection guide. It is a matter of degrees. A coin that has been carefully "conserved" is a different matter than a coin that has been harshly cleaned. However, a cleaning must be very subtle and carefully done for them to grade the coin.
PCGS also seems to include the fact that if a particular type of coin is cleaned more often than not then they will slab it as long as the cleaning is not too harsh.
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The coloration in the lettering and in the hard-to-get-at places on the portrait is usually a sign that the toning on the coin was gently etched off.
All said and done, it is a very nice coin - and a wonderfully taken set of pictures as well!
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After all, I am very happy with my purchase, I never saw a better 1892 of this type before, it is a really nice coin.
I am also very glad about you like my photos.
Now how about a little "reverse education" -- how would Germans grade it?
Come on over ... to The Dark Side!
<< <i>I is indeed a very nice example, Udo
Now how about a little "reverse education" -- how would Germans grade it? >>
Thanks Askari, I would grade it "vorzüglich/stempelglanz" and with cautious optimism maybe "fast stempelglanz." In both cases with the addition "minimal berieben."
Due to the fact, that grading is always an opinion, me and some collecting friends have had several discussions on this theme. Finally we arranged an expert to give us a few lessons in grading. About 30 collectors from Germany and Switzerland will meet in two weeks and we hope to learn and learn and again to learn about grading.
Maybe I will change my opinion on this coin after that lessons, maybe not. But for sure, I am going to show this coin to the expert and ask him, how he will grade it.
Come on over ... to The Dark Side!
So, the old adage of buy the coin is quite true with these Germanic coinages, at least those from the 1850 - 1940s period. I don't buy to many Kanton issues, so that's a bit harder to gauge.
Making cash, cash, and more CASH is what counts for some dealers. So why not sell a vz-st coin as a f.st, or even stgl. in the hope that the customer is not familar with Grading.
You would not believe, what some dealers tried to sell to me as Stgl. on coinshows.
Selbstverständlich I will share my knowledge after that lessons.
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DPOTD 3
Really. Like Aethelred, I leaned a little toward MS61 for a moment, and wondered if they had bodybagged it, but I eventually decided to go with my first impression, which was MS62.
They graded it exactly as I would have."
I always wait for LM's "after-the-fact" grading opinions....heh
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09/07/2006
Opps, didn't notice it was a 2 marks & not a 5 marks. I'd be a bit tougher on the smaller denom & say a 64 without too much likelyhood of a 65 grade. Still a very nice coin though. Also I don't collect/ know about German