shipwreck effect halves all over ebay

roadrunner · May 31, 2004 11:58AM

Wow, there were bidders galore for half a dozen to a dozen shipwreck halves from 1854 to 1861 priced from $500-900. The number of bidders was very surprising. Looks like they can't get enough of these treasured heirlooms. Fighting tooth and nail for the honor of being the first on their blocks to own one. And these are "certified" shipwreck effect, not the usual baking sodaed halves worth about 5-10% as much. This is the REAL deal.

roadrunner

BigMoose · May 31, 2004 12:11PM

It really bothers me to see how aggressively these damaged halves were/are being marketed. The only thing I see coming of this besides profits to the marketers are a lot of novice collectors who are getting burned on their first coin purchases and who will likely never come back into the hobby when they find out they were taken.

pontiacinf · May 31, 2004 12:21PM

later down the road when they are stuck with their overpriced junk, ill be

Fragmentum · May 31, 2004 12:28PM

Yea, and so far they all say 'Reserve not met' on every one of them, even with all the bids....

roadrunner · May 31, 2004 12:33PM

But it is quite interesting to note that all those bids still amount to many hundreds of dollars each for cleaned coins, whether they reach reserve or not. Eventually they will all sell.

roadrunner

BurritoGrande · May 31, 2004 12:35PM

The term "shipwreck effect" confuses me. What do they mean? Are they using "effect" in this sense:

pl. Goods; movables; personal estate; -- sometimes used to embrace real as well as personal property; as, the people escaped from the town with their effects.

Or is it something else?

airplanenut · May 31, 2004 1:27PM

It's got the effect of a cleaned piece of garbage... as you'd expect from being at the bottom of the sea for a hundred years...

JrGMan2004 · May 31, 2004 1:27PM

No, sand and minerals in salt-water will damage a coin when it sits under water for a long time, i.e. in a shipwreck, thus it's called "Shipwreck Effect."

I'm not sure exactly in what way it damages it, but it does...

I think it's the gradual friction of sand moving accross the coins surface...

BurritoGrande · May 31, 2004 1:30PM

<< <i>It's got the effect of a cleaned piece of garbage... as you'd expect from being at the bottom of the sea for a hundred years... >>

How true

BigE · May 31, 2004 1:30PM

"not the usual baking sodaed halves worth about 5-10% as much"----------

--------------------BigE

Placid · May 31, 2004 1:41PM

As far as I know the only places to get these coins was charging $1,000 for the lowest priced one.
So unless somehow they were sold at a discount the reserves are not going to be less.

BigE · May 31, 2004 2:15PM

I wonder what Max Mehl would think of this

-------------BigE

chiefbob · May 31, 2004 9:26PM

I don't own one, but will offer some comments regarding the undersea halves:

1) Too many collectors on this board have approached the HSN sale as hobby purists. By that, I mean that the overwhelming majority of those on this board are what could be considered advanced collectors, and many are numismatic experts. You are viewing these coins through those rose-colored glasses, rather than for what the halves represent. They are true collectibles, indeed, with a numismatic bent. They represent a piece of our history that you can hold in your hands, with the origin certified. Sure, any old coins have historical value if you place them by their dates against historical events. But the provenance of these coins is known and happens to have fascinating details behind them. You are horrified that they have been cleaned (conserved) and compare their condition to the same dates of coins that never saw the bottom of the sea. I've seen enough threads on this board regarding dipping/cleaning/acetone, etc. What's the difference when NGC cleaned them for marketing on a national venue? A lot of the comments smack of hobby elitism, rather than accepting these historical treasures for what they are and not for their slabbing relevancy. My only gripe with NGC is that the slab didn't have the NCS conservatiion label with a net details grade. But would the general public understand that? Does it matter? They are buying history first, the coin is secondary and is the vehicle that provides the link to the shipwreck.

2) The price was disappointing when watching the HSN marathon. But then, after thinking about it, the Oddysey had to recover the costs of their research and recovery operations. Is the coin worth $900 or more in that condition and date? No, but millions of dollars were spent in bringing these coins to the surface and paying NGC to clean and slab them. Then you have the cost of the presentation boxes, etc.

Historical treasures and antiquities are almost always conserved to restore them to what they originally looked like. The one exception I can think of is furniture, and I haven't seen any slabbing of that yet.

Just a contrary viewpoint of mine. Let the flaming begin.....

Bob

coinchallenged · May 31, 2004 10:27PM

What Bob said.

Bochiman · June 1, 2004 3:16AM

<< <i> A lot of the comments smack of hobby elitism, rather than accepting these historical treasures for what they are and not for their slabbing relevancy.

Bob >>

Bob,

Too many people think there is only 1 way to look at things...there is something for everyone and everyone for something. I would love to own one of these, but I wouldn't compare it with a MS example that didn't spend time at the bottom of the sea.....I would enjoy it for what it went through and still survived.

XpipedreamR · June 1, 2004 3:27AM

Hmmm...what Bob said.

Veep · June 1, 2004 3:29AM

I consider myself a numismatist and somewhat knowledgeable. After reading "Ship of Gold in the Deep Blue Sea" I became captivated by the story of the SS Central America. I own a gram or two of gold from that ship. Gold was and is worth about $13 per gram. I can tell you that I paid somewhat more than that and am still happy to have my personal "link" to the loss and recovery of that treasure.

Russ · June 1, 2004 4:18AM

Well, there's one good thing about these coins appearing on eBay.

The story replaced that stupid image in Bluemoon Coin's auctions.

Russ, NCNE

XpipedreamR · June 1, 2004 4:20AM

Oh man, that sucks...I loved that picture

They should put a picture of him looking at a model ship in a bottle or something

Russ · June 1, 2004 4:25AM

Ah crap, the image is back. I guess it just wasn't loading.

Russ, NCNE

ohbaby · June 1, 2004 4:41AM

Shipwreck effect coins do NOT belong in NGC or PCGS slabs. If a coin has been conserved then it should be clearly stated and explained how these coins with no grade are valued less by collectors. Being in a NGC implies a variety of things, cleaned, impaired, damaged is not one of them.

"Shipwreck Effect" is a marketing moniker to glamorize a cleaned coin. It's misleading and confusing.

I know casual collectors are already fooled by SEGS, ACG, NTC, etc. slabs when compared to NGC and PCGS. With a little coaching they will know the differences but with NGC going the SE slab route this only serves to further confuse.

This has nothing to do with the cost of recovery, history, +/- of conserving coins, etc. it has to do with MARKETING to an unsuspecting public and that is bad. NGC has dropped a few notches in my eyes.

RYK · June 1, 2004 4:47AM

Direct quote from the ebay listing:

We are very excited about this opportunity, and with our combined experience of 50+ years we can say that this is the biggest pile of coins, the most valuable pile of coins, and certainly the most exciting pile of coins we have ever had the privilege of helping bring to market.

Now, substitute the word "crap" for "coins" and you get my sentiments:

We are very excited about this opportunity, and with our combined experience of 50+ years we can say that this is the biggest pile of crap, the most valuable pile of crap, and certainly the most exciting pile of crap we have ever had the privilege of helping bring to market.

LAWMAN · June 1, 2004 4:48AM

I don't get this "shipwreck effect" bit. The coins supposedly sat at the bottom of the ocean for 150+ years after, you guessed it, a shipwreck. So, what in hell is the "effect?" Did they need to Disneyize the coins by adding some "effect?" A bunch of barnacles and crud weren't enough? They keep creating new standards for DOCTORED coins. First it was "conserved" by NCS, now it's "shipwreck effect."

Ol P.T. Barnum is laughing his butt off somewhere in heaven -- remember, he said that 'nobody ever went broke underestimating the taste and good sense of the average person.'

JadeRareCoin · June 1, 2004 5:52AM

In the spirit of the "ship wreck effect" coins and their eBay sellers................

IrishMike · June 1, 2004 6:06AM

If there wasn't a market for these they wouldn't sell. While we can argue about how they are being marketed and the prices that are being asked, if I were the one that stuck my neck out to reclaim these I might just do it the same way, who knows, would you? What about all the damaged coins that because there were few minted, early dates are slabbed with obvious environmental damage, nick, scratches etc. are given a pass?

ClausUrch · June 1, 2004 7:17AM

History....Schmistory! They are overprised JUNK!

LAWMAN · June 1, 2004 9:22AM

That's it. I'm creating a new Registry category. Coins fished out of wishing wells and reflecting pools. With Koi poo on them. And pond slime. Talk about COLOR!

Baley · June 1, 2004 2:15PM

I think they're neat coins, but not at current prices.

I'll be shopping for a decent example if/when they come down some.

Conder101 · June 1, 2004 10:11PM

eight coins is "all over ebay"?

shipwreck effect halves all over ebay

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