morgan xperts: crack out or maxed out????

grover1 · October 24, 2003 3:17PM

Hi,

click the pics and see if you think this one stands a chance at a 65 holder. I think it does...the cloudy spots on the fields comes from what I believe to be bad storage in pvc containing holder prior to being graded and the previous owner should've paid to have it cleaned by a grading service or somebody that knows what they are doing. Other than that I don't see what could keep it out of a 65 holder. Its a beauty in my book and so far my best find. I won't disclose the purchase price other than to say it was like buying microsoft stock before anybody knew who they were.

obverse
reverse

thanks for any help

Matt

razorface1027 · October 24, 2003 9:11PM

Tough to tell by the pics. There's a change in the obv. field surfaces from perhiphery area inward. The "U" in unum appears to have a rub under it. Otherwise, tough to tell by the pics.JMO...

fivecents · October 24, 2003 9:28PM

It looks like a MS65 all day long to me.

That is just my oppinion and I could be wrong, because it is hard to see every imperfection looking at that image. It makes wonder why SEGS graded it a MS64, they must have seen something the picture doesn't show.

grover1 · October 25, 2003 12:55AM

my thoughts were outside of the cloudy fields.....the pics pretty much show the coin how it is...that is why I thought it would go in a 65 slab to, but my thoughts were maybe they were being ultra conservative to protect their reputation, I mean 65 slabbed 81-O's are not that common and maybe they didn't want to make that leap but to me it smells like a 65...soooo...instead of doing the crackout first, I sent it in to see if it would crossover to a 65 holder . keeping fingers crossed.

Thanks

Matt

dragon · October 25, 2003 1:06AM

<<< but my thoughts were maybe they were being ultra conservative to protect their reputation>>>

SEGS has no reputation other than being a 2nd tier service that no one takes seriously.

dragon

grover1 · October 25, 2003 1:18AM

heh,

exactly my point...if your trying to make a reputation would you risk it by overgrading a coin or would you be conservative and put it one holder lower than what it probably is so nobody questions the grade?

Matt

foodude · October 25, 2003 1:21AM

Seems one would have a better reputation from the stand point of both buyers and sellers if they could grade accurately ...

grover1 · October 25, 2003 1:27AM

that would be great. I would love it if it were right on the money but if you had the coin sitting in front of you as I have all week....you sit and wonder if it would make a 65 holder and I'll send a link as my example of why I sit and wonder......this link is a pcgs holdered 64 and I think mine surely has this CC beat.

1878-CC In PCGS 64 Slab

look at that one and you can see why I think it would go in a 65 slab

Matt

foodude · October 25, 2003 1:31AM

Grover1,

I'll be at the MOON show next Sat.; and at the Barberlover's breakfast thing Link before the show. It is much easier to examine a coin in person ...

Greg

grover1 · October 25, 2003 1:34AM

that is cool. I was planning on making that show since I haven't been to it before. How do I get to you :-)) and you can have a gander at it.

Thanks

Matt

foodude · October 25, 2003 1:43AM

The show is in Brooklyn Center at the Earle Brown Heritage Heritage Center, 6155 Earle Brown Dr. It is just South of 694, of Shingle Creek Parkway (or something close that name). If you go to the Perkins before the show, call them for directions as the Perkins is very close to the Earle Brown Center.

grover1 · October 25, 2003 1:50AM

I'll find you there. I have another dealer/friend from Fairmont that has a spot at the show as well so it should make for a good Saturday venture.

Matt

Gilbert · October 25, 2003 1:56AM

Are you asking if it will upgrade in a SEGS holder?

If you believe it has PVC damage (and the mirrors do look cloudy) then it is probably in the only slab it will go in.

If you are asking if it would cross and upgrade, based on the image and your PVC comment, I would say, not hardly - I don't think it will cross.

It is not a good idea to compare a '81-O to a '78-CC. Each mint had different issues and are evaluated with consideration of the issues to peculiar to the mint(s). DMPL, or those coins that started that way, also have issues unique to them (primarily chatter) that isn't as penalized as a non-DMPL with chatter.

BTW, that '78CC is nice and appears to be correctly graded nor does it look to have any surface damage.

edited to add: I meant to preface my response with "I'm not Morgan expert, but I'm not completely uninformed either."

CHESSNUTDOG · October 25, 2003 1:58AM

Grover,
Im kinda of newbie, but will PCGS or any NGC really holder a coin with haze like that. The other question is does it really have 12 in mirrors? Isnt that the criteria for dmpl. Not dumping on your coin, in fact i really like it, and have posted I have a monster PCGS toned 1880 that has hazed over since holdering and i was wondering the best thing to do about it. Im probably going to send it to ncs and see if they can fix it. Someone said something about an acetone dip. Anyway, good luck and I really like the coin.

DennisH · October 25, 2003 2:14AM

Matt:

In my opinion, the reason it's in a $700 holder instead of a $12,000 holder is, it's been tried before and it didn't work. I believe all valuable coins are in the holders they are in for a a reason. This value of this coin in a PCGS-65 holder is far too great for someone not to have tried -- and tried and tried again -- already.

If you bought it cheap, maybe the thrill of spinning the wheel would be worth the grading fee. But if it was me, I'd send the coin in for crossover first... just to make sure they would put it in a holder, instead of seeing something you don't that would result in a body bag.

Personally, I think SEGS is awful at catching doctored Morgans. And as a born pessimist, if I sent this coin in it would probably come back an MS63.

-- Dennis

mintluster · October 25, 2003 2:44AM

<< <i>Matt:

In my opinion, the reason it's in a $700 holder instead of a $12,000 holder is, it's been tried before and it didn't work. I believe all valuable coins are in the holders they are in for a a reason. This value of this coin in a PCGS-65 holder is far too great for someone not to have tried -- and tried and tried again -- already.

If you bought it cheap, maybe the thrill of spinning the wheel would be worth the grading fee. But if it was me, I'd send the coin in for crossover first... just to make sure they would put it in a holder, instead of seeing something you don't that would result in a body bag.

Personally, I think SEGS is awful at catching doctored Morgans. And as a born pessimist, if I sent this coin in it would probably come back an MS63.

-- Dennis >>

I agree with Dennis. The cheek does look nice and clean though!

Dog97 · October 25, 2003 9:24AM

If you think it has pvc and it does then it won't get into a PCGS holder. It could just be from where heavy tone was dipped off. It only looks 64 to me.

MrEureka · October 25, 2003 9:28AM

I won't disclose the purchase price other than to say it was like buying microsoft stock before anybody knew who they were.

Good. Consider the coin a cheap education.

grover1 · October 25, 2003 3:32PM

cool,

sorry I didn't get back sooner....I have been busy checking hunters on my land up North today. Thanks for the info. That is what I wanted to know is it was maxed out on its grade...especially with the cloudy fields.

Thanks for the info, it was absorbed and stored properly

Matt

morgan xperts: crack out or maxed out????

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