CU VALUES GROSSLY OVERSTATED / BEWARE COIN MARKET HYPE ?
deltadon
Posts: 83
Due to the widely hyped "white hot" market in the coin press, I recently consigned eight PCGS Certified 20th Century type coins to the Bowers & Merena Baltimore ANA Auction in July. This group of eight coins had a total current Collectors' Universe (CU) value of $14,165. Five of the coins graded PCGS MS-66 with the remainder PCGS MS-65. This lot of eight coins realized only $10,621 WITH Buyer's Premium or 25.0% below CU Value. Only one coin sold at a price which was less than 20% (18.1%) below the CU Value (1916 WL Half PCGS MS-66). The worst price vs. CU Value was for a 1917-Ty. 1 SLQ PCGS MS-65FH which realized a price of only $920 or 37% below CU Value of $1,450. I might understand a few coins coming in below "market" but not the entire group and at a significant discount to market! I even purchased one of the coins myself, a 1900 Barber Quarter in PCGS MS-65 (white) because the highest bid at the time was $575 or $875 below CU Value - this for a coin which has a population of 18 with only 7 higher! Absolutely none of these coins had any problems whatsoever and all silver coins were bright white or with very light toning.
My warning to everyone is to be careful of the hype and put reserves on your coins if you consign them to auction. Otherwise you could be very disappointed - like myself. I would be interested to learn if other collectors have similar experiences with auctioning their coins or where have you been successful in getting good value for your coins - EBay?
My warning to everyone is to be careful of the hype and put reserves on your coins if you consign them to auction. Otherwise you could be very disappointed - like myself. I would be interested to learn if other collectors have similar experiences with auctioning their coins or where have you been successful in getting good value for your coins - EBay?
Buyer and seller of registry and investment quality coins of the United States.
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Comments
While the question has been raised many times, the answer has never been forthcoming.
I have long maintained that this ultimately hurts the credibility of the entire guide.
In this day and age of technology - establishing a price guide based on actual numbers is not only
realistic, it's achievable. For whatever dark and unknown reason, HRH consistently has ignored the pleas
for accurate pricing.
Since it's his ballgame - He can call the shots... but I for one, ignore the results. They're unrealistic,
unreliable - and NOT updated at all - despite the claim to the contrary.
Sorry David... the enterprise as a whole is a class act - but the price guide is garbage.
For a small fee - I could make it all right for you. (all depends on how highly you value professional I.T. services.)
If it's anything like Heritage's - I won't hold my breath.
dragon
If you recognize it... and I recognize it - why doesn't anyone who runs the show recognize it?
or - more appropriately... why do they ignore it? It makes no sense to me whatsoever.
Wondercoin
Everybody loves a bargain.
CU intentionally inflates the price guide so that their dealer network can discount coins from list and let their customers think they are getting a deal.
The dealer network is still a brick and mortar set-up, with high overhead. If PCGS were to publish a price guide showing what the coins actually trade for, their dealer network couldn't match it and stay in business.
It's much easier to sell a $200 coin for $300 when the list price says it's $500
My posts viewed
since 8/1/6
The selling price of a coin often changes within minutes for the same exact coin. Many people flip coins at shows.
Now take into account that no two coins are exactly alike even though they are graded the same and you can see how hard it would be to try to tell someone what their coin is currently worth without even seeing it.
I like Heritage because they use their auction results and give links to the actual coins that sold as well as use a price range rather than a fixed number.
If you see a anacs xf40 coin sold for $300 you can look at the coin and see that the coin was net graded for a problem.
If you see a ms64 morgan sold for $600 you can look and see that the coin had wild toning.
K S
Of course the dealers want these prices to be high. Look how often they are quoted on Ebay in hopes that some unsophisticated bidder thinks he or she is getting a bargain. As others have mentioned past prices realized are a better barometer in general. Of course there are coins out there that will sell for way more than any published guide says they are worth. Exceptional coins if marketed correctly will always bring better prices.
I would like to see a list of the many coins, above exceptions noted, that WSM says are underpriced in the PCGS guide. Deltadon, first lesson you should learn is not to believe the marketing hype presented by slabbing companies.
9 K !!! First offer over 8 K takes it, anyone ?
Les
jim
Are we to assume from your post that when you purchased the coins you paid what the CU price guide lists as values? Without checking any real and reliable sources of pricing information?
Russ, NCNE
Yeah, yeah, I know the Red Book prices lag way behind, but I don't really care, and I do not need daily market updates anyway. I sell cheaper circulated material, for the most part. When I do get a slabbed piece with an unlisted grade like AU58, I use Numismedia. Over MS/PR60, I'm afraid the PCGS priceguide's the only reference I have (though Red Book often does give one or two MS grades, usually 63 and 65).
Of course, like it has been said many times before, choice coins will bring choice prices. CUs price guide has certain coins undervalued as well, but it is closer than some
of the others.
We'll use our hands and hearts and if we must we'll use our heads.
siliconvalleycoins.com
Personally, I'm happy paying for an occasional Graysheet and learning to grade the series I collect.