Possible review of dealers who advertise in coin magazines.

thadd · July 9, 2003 5:24PM

Please take a quick minute to read this and respond if possible. Your input is appreciated.

I was tossing around the idea of having a section on my website for giving feedback on coin dealers, specifically the big companies who advertise in the coin publications.

Can you compile information about a companies business practices from people who have dealt with them directly and post these results without having to worry about repercussions? It seems like it could be a useful tool in educating newer collectors about what to look out for when dealing with these companies and help protect them from getting taken advantage of.

For instance, I was to have a page on Company X. My page makes comments regarding many customers who have complained of receiving cleaned coins or over graded coins from this company. These comments were based on feedback gathered by asking for input regarding Company X here on this forum.

Am I asking for trouble here or does our right to free speech allow me to express the opinions of others? I’m very interested in your input regarding this.

Thanks for your time,

Thadd

RKKay · July 9, 2003 6:13PM

Thadd, it is a very fine line to walk. If you just post direct quotes, you could be safe from a claim of libel. However, if any of the individuals you quote denies having said that, you are in for a battle. As well, in our litigious society, it is quite possible a big company (with big resources) could think up all kinds of claims to intimidate/punish you. I wouldn't do it, myself.

cherrypickincoin · July 9, 2003 6:49PM

thadd,

In reality what we have in this country is really limited free speech. Meaning, you can say anything you want so long as you don't cross the lines of political correctness. We live in a sue happy country that will come up with any reason to bring an attorney into something that is frivolous. If the PNG is allowed to rate grading services with their bias, then I really believe you have every right to rate coin dealers so long as the information provided is factual and not based on rumor. I doubt any coin dealer is going to be too upset with a small website that supplies such information. I think they would be more worried if it ended up in the Los Angeles Times or something like that. If it's what you want to do, go for it. Any legitimate coin dealer wouldn't be afraid of such a website as customer feedback would more than speak for itself.

Remember, it is always people who question their own integrity who constantly question the integrity of others. If a dealer doesn't like the idea of you setting up a website, then they just MAY be selling those cleaned coins.

RKKay · July 9, 2003 6:53PM

I agree that any honest, self-respecting coin dealer would not react negatively. However, if the ratings are of dealers with a lot of negative feedback, that feedback alone tells us what kind of person we are dealing with and their likely response. It's unfortunate, but the dishonest ones are the ones who are more likely to sue or threaten to do so.

Sumo · July 9, 2003 7:15PM

I think you should write about it. If people can criticize restaurants and be brutally honest, Why not coin dealers??

Why are people so so scared of dealers and what they think? It's like they're all mobsters and everyones hiding for their lives.

Thadd, I would like to help with your review page. If you need help? I have been wanting to buy from some of the big name dealers and I think I would feel more comfortable buying with this kind of venue in mind.

All in all good idea and a needed one.
Sumo

darktone · July 9, 2003 9:33PM

Rumor has it that the coinworld grading test was done with coins from their advertisers. Not sure if it's true but it makes sense. mike

Barry · July 9, 2003 11:25PM

While an admirable idea, you could be opening yourself up for a lot of grief. Ask K6AZ about that, as it relates to his ACG website.

Zerbe · July 9, 2003 11:55PM

I would love the chance to rate dealers, but RRKAY is right as far as the dishonest, unethical, dealers suing in a heartbeat.

Maybe just a rating system could be used. Such as dealer X receiving a high score of 5 stars, and a dishonest dealer Z receiving the lowest rating of zero stars. I don't know if this is could sustain a lawsuit or not. Lawyers ???????????

What could we use as a Benchmark for a BAD Dealer ???

thadd · July 10, 2003 12:53AM

Thanks for all the great input so far. Keep it coming.

I think I have a way to do this and make it work. Look for the occasional post from me looking for feedback on your purchases.

paigowjohnny · July 10, 2003 1:08AM

A fellow did something like this a while back...I think it was across the street....

Rather than solicit possibly slanderous comments, I think he asked for PMs or e-mails that said, to the effect, list good dealers and bad dealers. For each good comment, a dealer got a +1, and for every neg comment a -1...he then posted cumulative scores

Some of the "usual suspects" had pretty high neg scores like worse than -10

You could maybe do something like that and skirt around any slander/libel issues.

thadd · July 10, 2003 1:15AM

Yes, my approach is going to be more in the line of bringing out the good dealers rather than bashing the bad dealers. Sort of an “if you can’t say something good” approach. I need to mull this over and figure out the best way to gather info and how to present it.

If I hit the lotto I would just make purchases directly from each dealer and report the facts, but I’m on a very tight budget.

LAWMAN · July 10, 2003 1:45AM

This is an interesting legal question. Opinion should not be defamation, but, ascribing dishonesty to a dealer is defamation per se. The reviews would have to be conducted very carefully and whoever publishes the reviews would have to work closely with their lawyer. If a restaurant review says that eating the food there will kill you, that may be beyond opinion. Coin World could probably do it if they were as careful as they were in rating the grading services, but, anybody who depends on advertising revenue would not jeopardize their income. How about Consumer Reports for Numismatists?

ohbaby · July 10, 2003 1:57AM

Why are you guys so scared of dealers? Anyone hear of ebay and their feedback system? The mechanism is already in place.

thadd, the key is to allow unedited comments to be posted. If you simply hosted the site you will be OK, still could get sued but on what basis?

Most of this could be unnecessary if people only bought from dealers they knew or were referred to or bought slabs from the big 2. Trouble lies with people who buy what looks too good to be true and those who buy from known rip off artists in hopes of not getting ripped.

Zerbe, What could we use as a Benchmark for a BAD Dealer ???, remarks like that will get you Benched and Marked for life. You could even end up in the slammer looking like a toothpick for lack of food and then have to wear glasses!

Zerbe · July 10, 2003 2:10AM

Ohbaby, you have a very good memory. " Looking like a toothpick with glasses "

numonebuyer · July 10, 2003 2:19AM

You could quote good comments about dealers and thereby direct those who read your quotes to the dealers who receive such good comments.

If you don't post any comments at all that are negative, you don't give any endorsement at all for those who receive negative comments.

By doing this you will help the "good dealers" which indirectly hurts the "bad dealers" without ever mentioning them by name (directly or indirectly).

Numonebuyer

coinguy1 · July 10, 2003 2:21AM

One should be fine posting negative reviews/experiences, etc., as long as the reporting is FACTUAL.

In other words, if you order a coin, send a check to a dealer and he deposits it , keeps the funds for 30 days and then informs you that the coin had alredy been sold........you shouldn't have any legal problems if you report precisely what happened/the facts. You might get into trouble, however, if you call the guy a thief, crook, etc.

Stick with objective facts (much easier said than done), rather than name calling, etc. and you leave the other party nothing to attack/dispute.

Sumo · July 10, 2003 6:11AM

Right on coinguy, that was the premise I was on line with.
If they are selling a BU coin, and you received whizzed coin, write about. State the facts and not an opinion.
Received BU coin that was whizzed from dealer A. Called dealer A and received a refund.

Not:
I received a whizzed coin from that friggin crook dealer A, He is the worst SOB I have ever dealt with. But he gave a refund.
DO It Man, I really think this would be cool.

Possible review of dealers who advertise in coin magazines.

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