Possible 1964 SMS Lincoln Cent

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Ballmrb
Ballmrb Posts: 23 ✭
in U.S. Coin Forum

Got this from a collector for 70 plus years and it checks all the boxes of the SMS. The detail is phenomenal. The rim is squared off , sharp and thinner it has the matching die polish marks and is non reflective. Attached the bus




«13

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  • IkesT
    IkesT Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Nope.

    Looks like a nice coin for a Whitman folder.

  • johnny9434
    johnny9434 Posts: 34,051 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 20, 2026 1:58AM
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    A spender/album coin 🪙
    Welcome to the forum as well

  • WaterSport
    WaterSport Posts: 7,064 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Sorry - not even close. The first pic is yours - the second is a known graded and photographed PCGS example.

    Proud recipient of the coveted PCGS Forum "You Suck" Award Thursday July 19, 2007 11:33 PM and December 30th, 2011 at 8:50 PM.
  • Morgan13
    Morgan13 Posts: 2,691 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Im just curious.
    Is a 1964 SMS 1c rare or common?

    Student of numismatics and collector of Morgan dollars
    Successful BST transactions with: Namvet Justindan Mattniss RWW olah_in_MA
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  • MFeld
    MFeld Posts: 17,131 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Morgan13 said:
    Im just curious.
    Is a 1964 SMS 1c rare or common?

    Based on the posts to this thread, you should be able to guess correctly. 😉

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • Ballmrb
    Ballmrb Posts: 23 ✭
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    Here is just one comparison

  • Ballmrb
    Ballmrb Posts: 23 ✭
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    A business strike rim would not have the pressure characteristics of an SMS nor the low point details like the jacket . Also there are different variations of the die polish marks slightly. And. Since its is a guess how many were made and exist how does anyone know that there are not a few variations in the die polish marks slightly This matches every documented clues to how to identify one. The tone alone is not close to any business strike yet alone the quality of the strike

  • Ballmrb
    Ballmrb Posts: 23 ✭
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    Here ate 2 graded examples that have completely different die poloish marks

  • IkesT
    IkesT Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Ballmrb said:
    Is it. Look at the nose and the ear. Not the same coin

    When you are commenting, you are failing to fill a Whitman folder.

  • JBK
    JBK Posts: 17,860 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Ballmrb said:
    Is it. Look at the nose and the ear. Not the same coin

    Forget the nose and the ear. They are photos of the same coin using different lighting and different focus. Look instead at the spots and tarnish streaks.

    So the question is, who is responsible for the subterfuge? Did someone else provide those photos to you, or did they originate with you? 🤔

  • MasonG
    MasonG Posts: 7,569 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Ballmrb said:
    Is it. Look at the nose and the ear. Not the same coin

    Why do the toning spots match?

  • MasonG
    MasonG Posts: 7,569 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @MFeld said:

    @MasonG said:

    @Ballmrb said:
    Is it. Look at the nose and the ear. Not the same coin

    Why do the toning spots match?

    They probably match for the same reason that the streaks do.😉

    Yeah, I thought so but I didn't want it to look like "piling on" by pointing them out, too.

  • MFeld
    MFeld Posts: 17,131 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @MasonG said:

    @MFeld said:

    @MasonG said:

    @Ballmrb said:
    Is it. Look at the nose and the ear. Not the same coin

    Why do the toning spots match?

    They probably match for the same reason that the streaks do.😉

    Yeah, I thought so but I didn't want it to look like "piling on" by pointing them out, too.

    In that case, I was happy to have assisted.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • Morgan13
    Morgan13 Posts: 2,691 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Isn't a 1964 just kind of a widget or am I missing something?

    Student of numismatics and collector of Morgan dollars
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  • MasonG
    MasonG Posts: 7,569 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Morgan13 said:
    Isn't a 1964 just kind of a widget or am I missing something?

    SMS examples are rather valuable.

  • JBK
    JBK Posts: 17,860 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Morgan13 said:
    Isn't a 1964 just kind of a widget or am I missing something?

    You're missing something.

    This question is not about an uncirculated coin or a proof coin, but rather an SMS (Special Mint Set) coin. The controversy is that while SMS sets were not issued in 1964 (only 1965, 1966, and 1967), supposedly a very limited number of 1964 coins were minted to SMS standards.

    People are always popping up to insist they found one in the wild, which is not really possible.

  • cmerlo1
    cmerlo1 Posts: 8,075 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Sigh.

    You Suck! Awarded 6/2008- 1901-O Micro O Morgan, 8/2008- 1878 VAM-123 Morgan, 9/2022 1888-O VAM-1B3 H8 Morgan | Senior Regional Representative- ANACS Coin Grading. Posted opinions on coins are my own, and are not an official ANACS opinion.
  • MasonG
    MasonG Posts: 7,569 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @JBK said:
    People are always popping up to insist they found one in the wild, which is not really possible.

    Oddly enough, none of the "Do You Have A 1964 SMS Penny" websites (that I have seen, anyway) tell you that. Which is one reason why people are always popping up to insist they found one in the wild, I'm guessing.

  • MFeld
    MFeld Posts: 17,131 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 20, 2026 10:26AM
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    @JBK said:

    @Morgan13 said:
    Isn't a 1964 just kind of a widget or am I missing something?

    You're missing something.

    This question is not about an uncirculated coin or a proof coin, but rather an SMS (Special Mint Set) coin. The controversy is that while SMS sets were not issued in 1964 (only 1965, 1966, and 1967), supposedly a very limited number of 1964 coins were minted to SMS standards.

    People are always popping up to insist they found one in the wild, which is not really possible.

    Call me nit-picky if you wish. But those who believe in the 1964 SMS coins are generally of the opinion that they were experimental in nature. And regardless, they certainty weren’t minted to SMS standards as we know them.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • jmlanzaf
    jmlanzaf Posts: 43,046 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 20, 2026 10:49AM
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    @Morgan13 said:
    Isn't a 1964 just kind of a widget or am I missing something?

    1964 SMS coins (if they are real) were not struck for distribution. Google them and you'll get the story. There's also several threads on the forum. They are rare 5-figure coins, most of which have a similar provenance. They are not found in the wild.

    All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.

  • dunkleosteus430
    dunkleosteus430 Posts: 595 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    All known 1964 SMS coins came from former mint director Eva Adams' estate. Unless your collector friend knew her, or someone who had a very special role at the mint in 1964, the coin you have cannot be an SMS regardless of what it looks like.

    I collect world proof sets, coins featuring composers, mid-20th century U.S. proof coins, U.S. type coins, and whatever else I want.

  • ambro51
    ambro51 Posts: 14,471 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    As someone will again repeat twenty five pages on,,,…..,, ”Submit”

  • Old_Collector
    Old_Collector Posts: 1,210 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 20, 2026 9:33PM
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    @Morgan13 said:
    Isn't a 1964 just kind of a widget or am I missing something?

    They are expensive widgets since our host has only graded 24 reported, 20 in SPRD and 4 in SPRB (https://www.pcgs.com/pop/detail/lincoln-cent-modern-1959-date/47?ccid=0&t=3&p=SP), that compares to 2,794 in 1965 SPRD. Also none at all graded by NGC (no page to cite) or CAC (https://www.cacgrading.com/pop-price/graded/25) for 1964 SMS.

  • Steven59
    Steven59 Posts: 11,227 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @MasonG said:

    @Ballmrb said:
    Is it. Look at the nose and the ear. Not the same coin

    Why do the toning spots match?

    .
    It's just a massive "Coe-inky-dink" - (coincidence) :D

    "When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"

  • AdamL
    AdamL Posts: 227 ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 20, 2026 11:25PM
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    .

  • Steven59
    Steven59 Posts: 11,227 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    The odds of finding any 1964 SMS coin in circulation is..............let's just say........ZERO. B)

    "When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"

  • DesertCoin
    DesertCoin Posts: 479 ✭✭✭
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    The 1964 SMS coins were not true SMS, but a the first few 1964 coins off the dies. They were sent to the Smithsonian, after which some have ended up in private hands. None at any point have ever entered circulation.

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  • FlyingAl
    FlyingAl Posts: 4,469 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Steven59 said:
    The odds of finding any 1964 SMS coin in circulation is..............let's just say........ZERO. B)

    The odds are certainly not zero.

    Coin Photography

  • Ballmrb
    Ballmrb Posts: 23 ✭
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    Are these all the marks you were referring too in the side by side pics that was believed to be the same coin I posted

  • Ballmrb
    Ballmrb Posts: 23 ✭
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    Would you say these two coins are the sane

  • IkesT
    IkesT Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2026 2:40PM
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    @Ballmrb said:
    Are these all the marks you were referring too in the side by side pics that was believed to be the same coin I posted

    No, they are not. You may put that coin in your Whitman folder.

  • Ballmrb
    Ballmrb Posts: 23 ✭
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    Do the red arrows ink the one pic match any of the marks in the other pic

  • JBK
    JBK Posts: 17,860 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    The photo on the left is too close. It cuts off the key areas.

  • IkesT
    IkesT Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2026 2:54PM
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    @JBK said:
    The photo on the left is too close. It cuts off the key areas.

    It's just a cropped version of the business strike coin from his original post:

  • MasonG
    MasonG Posts: 7,569 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    The red arrows are based on the picture another member posted and said "same coin", to which you responded with "Not the same coin".

  • IkesT
    IkesT Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2026 2:53PM
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    @Ballmrb

    You have so far posted two of your 1964 business strike cents (see below). Both of them can go into a Whitman folder. The other photos are of 1964 SMS cents that you have copied from online sources.

    If you particularly like the 1964 cents, you can fill up all the holes in your Whitman folder with them. The next time you find a 1964 cent, you do not need to post it here; just put it directly into your Whitman folder.


  • Steven59
    Steven59 Posts: 11,227 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @FlyingAl said:

    @Steven59 said:
    The odds of finding any 1964 SMS coin in circulation is..............let's just say........ZERO. B)

    The odds are certainly not zero.

    ,
    Untill anybody finds one they are certainly zero.........

    "When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"

  • jonathanb
    jonathanb Posts: 4,154 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Steven59 said:

    @FlyingAl said:

    @Steven59 said:
    The odds of finding any 1964 SMS coin in circulation is..............let's just say........ZERO. B)

    The odds are certainly not zero.

    ,
    Untill anybody finds one they are certainly zero.........

    So my odds of dying are zero until I actually do? 😁

    That's not entirely a joke, because the previous comment is incomplete.

    The previous comment has an implied time frame: The odds of anyone finding one before they die is zero.

    Phrased that way, it's obvious that the odds of you dying before you die are also zero...

  • FlyingAl
    FlyingAl Posts: 4,469 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Steven59 said:

    @FlyingAl said:

    @Steven59 said:
    The odds of finding any 1964 SMS coin in circulation is..............let's just say........ZERO. B)

    The odds are certainly not zero.

    ,
    Untill anybody finds one they are certainly zero.........

    PM to be sent.

    If anyone else would like proof please feel free to PM me.

    Coin Photography

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