1912 S 10C FS-101 - An even more obscure Double Die Dime.

Options
Maxvan1
Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum

I don't even know what to think about this one... The PCGS population is only 1 and there are no pictures on VV or DD websites. I'm just looking at the coin and comparing it to the one on PCGS (linked here). Fields are proof like.

Also - What is this type of doubling called? Pivot? Rotation? Something else? Don't say machine (unless it is...).

Obverse

1912 S 10C FS 801

Reverse

20230605000907 001500

Annotations

1912 S 10C FS 801 Bow and Wreath

1912 S 10C FS 801 MERI

1912 S 10C FS 801 Date

1912 S 10C FS 801 MER

Gallery

20230605001714-001513 20230605001617-001512 20230605001604-001511 20230605001506-001510 20230605001427-001509 20230605001407-001508 20230605001316-001507 20230605001242-001506 20230605001137-001505 20230605001037-001504 20230605001016-001503 20230605000929-001502 20230605000907-001500 20230605000905-001499 20230605000927-001501 1912-S-10-C-FS-801 1912-S-10-C-FS-801-Bow-and-Wreath 1912-S-10-C-FS-801-MERI 1912-S-10-C-FS-801-Date 1912-S-10-C-FS-801-MER

Comments

  • IkesT
    IkesT Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options

    Doubling on the FS-101 is most apparent on "UNITED STA" and the ribbon ends. Your coin is not a match for the variety.

  • lermish
    lermish Posts: 4,999 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options

    @Maxvan1 said:
    Fields are proof like.

    Fields are proof like cleaned and not proof-like at all.

    chopmarkedtradedollars.com

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    Options

    Damn. Mechanical doubling. It's not so far off though.

    20230605022117 001537

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    edited July 2, 2026 11:34PM
    Options

    @lermish said:

    @Maxvan1 said:
    Fields are proof like.

    Fields are proof like cleaned and not proof-like at all.

    Both.

    Nevertheless, this still looks pretty close to the DDO it to me (albeit cleaned and in a different die state). UNITED looks right to me. Same with the S.

    20230605001016-001503

  • IkesT
    IkesT Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options

    @Maxvan1 said:
    Nevertheless, this still looks pretty close to the DDO it to me (albeit cleaned and in a different die state). UNITED looks right to me. Same with the S.

    No, not at all. There's something fundamentally wrong with your understanding of doubled dies and/or the way you're looking at the coins.

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    Options

    @IkesT said:

    @Maxvan1 said:
    Nevertheless, this still looks pretty close to the DDO it to me (albeit cleaned and in a different die state). UNITED looks right to me. Same with the S.

    No, not at all. There's something fundamentally wrong with your understanding of doubled dies and/or the way you're looking at the coins.

    Alright, if you say so...

    What about the 1950 proof I posted a couple days ago on a separate thread? That one I'm not conceding.

  • IkesT
    IkesT Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options

    @Maxvan1 said:
    What about the 1950 proof I posted a couple days ago on a separate thread?

    Also not a doubled die. I wouldn't try looking for any more until you sort out what is going wrong.

    It may be a matter of going back to the drawing board and learning the basics. On the other hand, if your eye is the problem, there's not much you can do.

  • jmlanzaf
    jmlanzaf Posts: 43,046 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options

    @Maxvan1 said:

    @lermish said:

    @Maxvan1 said:
    Fields are proof like.

    Fields are proof like cleaned and not proof-like at all.

    Both.

    Nevertheless, this still looks pretty close to the DDO it to me (albeit cleaned and in a different die state). UNITED looks right to me. Same with the S.

    20230605001016-001503

    There's no such thing as close. It is exact or it isn't.

    All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.

  • jonathanb
    jonathanb Posts: 4,154 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2026 6:42AM
    Options

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Maxvan1 said:

    @lermish said:

    @Maxvan1 said:
    Fields are proof like.

    Fields are proof like cleaned and not proof-like at all.

    Both.

    Nevertheless, this still looks pretty close to the DDO it to me (albeit cleaned and in a different die state). UNITED looks right to me. Same with the S.

    20230605001016-001503

    There's no such thing as close. It is exact or it isn't.

    This is an important comment. @Maxvan1 do you understand what why close isn't relevant here?

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2026 9:23AM
    Options

    @jonathanb said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Maxvan1 said:

    @lermish said:

    @Maxvan1 said:
    Fields are proof like.

    Fields are proof like cleaned and not proof-like at all.

    Both.

    Nevertheless, this still looks pretty close to the DDO it to me (albeit cleaned and in a different die state). UNITED looks right to me. Same with the S.

    20230605001016-001503

    There's no such thing as close. It is exact or it isn't.

    This is an important comment. @Maxvan1 do you understand what why close isn't relevant here?

    I do. And I've conceded on the 1912. We're talking about a coin for which there is no guide and a single picture to compare. Gimme a break.

    The 1950 is exact. I'll send it express and report back.

  • Alpha2814
    Alpha2814 Posts: 384 ✭✭✭✭
    Options

    I see what looks like notching in the "E" in America (last image above the Gallery). That doesn't look like machine doubling to me, but almost all the other arrows are pointing to something too subtle.

  • jmlanzaf
    jmlanzaf Posts: 43,046 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2026 10:16AM
    Options

    @Alpha2814 said:
    I see what looks like notching in the "E" in America (last image above the Gallery). That doesn't look like machine doubling to me, but almost all the other arrows are pointing to something too subtle.

    You can't have one PUP and not all of them.

    All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.

  • Alpha2814
    Alpha2814 Posts: 384 ✭✭✭✭
    Options

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @Alpha2814 said:
    I see what looks like notching in the "E" in America (last image above the Gallery). That doesn't look like machine doubling to me, but almost all the other arrows are pointing to something too subtle.

    You can't have one PUP and not all of them.

    Then it's not FS-101, but it could be something else.

  • IkesT
    IkesT Posts: 4,600 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options

    The notch on the "E" is on the master die.

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    Options

    Lets look at TED on this 1912...

    Here's a NORMAL 1912-S.

    bb2130965361

    Here's the DDO 1912-S

    bbbrzv01716fnnm

    Here's the one originally posted above

    bb20230605022117 001537

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    Options

    But yes, I concede this does not look like it. The area inside the D is too wide and the tail of the S isn't it.

    But my point is that it's kind of close. Granted, close isn't it. But that's those are the types of things I was seeing here.

    Agree the notch on the E is on the master hub.

  • TPring
    TPring Posts: 388 ✭✭✭
    Options

    @Maxvan1 said:Capital idea

    The 1950 is exact. I'll send it express and report back.

    Capital idea -- I don't think you will be disappointed.

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    Options

    @TPring said:

    @Maxvan1 said:Capital idea

    The 1950 is exact. I'll send it express and report back.

    Capital idea -- I don't think you will be disappointed.

    I like your signature line.

  • mr1931S
    mr1931S Posts: 7,309 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 3, 2026 6:53PM
    Options

    Just remember...the advice you receive on a site is worth every bit of what you paid for it.

    So true. And funny too. There needs to be a badge awarded to the biggest semiquincentennial hot dog.

    "Two things are infinite: human stupidity and the universe; and I'm not sure about the universe."
    -Albert Einstein-

    Mistakes are natural. But repeated mistakes without reflection are something else. That may be the “stupidity” he was referring to. In research, he admitted uncertainty openly. “If we knew what it was we were doing, it would not be called research, would it?” This shows humility. Even a Nobel laureate accepted doubt. That humility makes the quote less cynical and more observational.

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    edited July 5, 2026 1:56PM
    Options

    For my own education, what am I seeing here in the leaves?

    It looks to me like the second and third circled leaves (middle ones) are slightly thicker and the tips a bit different, more pointed toward center rather than vertical...

    *Edit: The photos are not perfectly aligned, but nevertheless I would swear the leaves look like something...
    .
    .
    1912 S What is this DDO Compared 2 lays only
    .
    .
    1912 S What is this Normal Compared 2 lays only
    .
    .
    1912 S What is this DDO and Normal Compared 2 lays only
    .
    .
    Thanks All.

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    Options

    Also, high resolution GIF comparing normal and DDO. Maybe someone else will find it useful.

    1912-S-DDO-10-C-Loop-FS-101-full

  • Maxvan1
    Maxvan1 Posts: 189 ✭✭✭
    Options

    Sorry last post on this thread for now... The "doubling" around the ribbon here is from die lapping? Like from grinding the die down past the design elements?

    Again, just trying to educate myself here. Thanks again all.

    20230605001016-001503

    >

  • jonathanb
    jonathanb Posts: 4,154 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options

    I don't see anything noteworthy in the leaves beyond different coins with different amounts of wear.

    The doubling is clear on the DDO on the serifs of ST in STATES

  • MsMorrisine
    MsMorrisine Posts: 40,041 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options

    die polish won't cause doubling

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions

Leave a Comment

BoldItalicStrikethroughOrdered listUnordered list
Format
SpoilerCodeQuote
Heading 2Heading 1
Emoji
:):D:(;):/:o:s:p:'(:|B):#:*<3o:)>:)
Url
Image
Align leftAlign centerAlign rightToggle HTML viewToggle full pageToggle lights
Drop image/file
Comment As ...

Categories