1957 FB Vending box find
craig44
Posts: 11,804 ✭✭✭✭✭
I just saw this and thought I would pass it along. 3 boxes found in an old vending company's leftovers.
Boxes look pretty rough to me, but would this be the first find ever for 1957 football?
I know mile high is reputable, but they are not wrapped by steve (though, i seem to remember he will not authenticate vending that is not from a sealed case?)
while i think it is cool, i would have a hard time paying big for unsealed vending, especially where the find also included multiple loose cards including 7 unitas.
perhaps the boards experienced unopened collectors have more valuable input than mine
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
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I am always leery of this type of thing.
I have read that experienced collectors will not purchase Fritsch vending because apparently some/much of it was searched.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
One of the three vending boxes was sold at the national for $400k
my goodness is that a lot of $$
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
As an unopened collector who occasionally purchases vending boxes, I would stick strictly to BBCE FASC unless I was familiar with the source and opened a box beforehand to verify the contents and confirm the box(es) were unsearched. The Fritsch sticker with vending carries no special premium for me.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
In fact it may be a deterrent
On the flip side "so called experienced" collectors have in fact opened Fritsch Vending and the cards were there. Nothing is a guarantee not even FASC as in reality a factory employee could have tampered with contents during manufacturing/packaging especially back when vintage was produced and quality was all over the place. I know what its like to own a factory because I owned one that cranked out millions of units per year of product to some of the largest chain stores in America. Could there be Fritsch boxes that have been searched - ABSOLUTELY YES I would think. Are there Fritsch boxes that are fine - ABSOLUTELY YES it has been demonstrated. When the dust settles, the boxes that are wrapped and labeled Fritsch are done so by Steve Hart and those boxes either came from an unopened case that Steve would label FASC or the boxes were sent directly from Fritsch to Steve.
Are you breaking this now or is this an old box?
is it correct that Steve will no longer wrap a vending box if he did not open the factory sealed case himself?
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
There is a whole thread on Chris' ripping escapades. See the first two pages of his thread for this particular vending break.
Its my favorite thread on this forum
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
That is a stupid and unfounded comment.
I have purchased around 30 vending boxes from Fritch over the years and ALL have been just fine. Vending has been my best source to find high quality cards for my sets and roll the dice/gamble to get a PSA 10 of a star. Granted, I have graded 3000 cards this year and PSA has yet to give me a PSA 10. None the less, it is a blast. All vending from Fritch is more than good. Just make sure you check the condition of the boxes before buying one.
Mine too!
The box would have to come from a sealed case Steve opens himself or the direct pipeline of Fritsch to Steve. In other words say I bought a straight up box of 1978 Vending from Fritsch and then I went to Steve to ask him to wrap it as Fritsch or otherwise - Steve would say NO. It has to move directly from Fritsch to Steve for provenance. That is what Steve explained to me in the past.
no, not stupid or unfounded. in fact, many others over the years have questioned Fritsch vending.
I am sure you have seen the old black and white image of Larry standing in front of a giant row of shelving holding 100's (or 1,000's) of vending boxes? What is Larry doing in that photo? he is rummaging through a vending box.
If you do a quick search through this forum you will come across a bad 71 baseball vending box from fritsch. you will also see a poster who bought a late 60's hockey vending box where all the cards seemed to be in very good condition. except for the 3 Orr cards he pulled that all happened to have corner wear/creases.
now, do I think Larry was unethical? no, i have no reason to think that. I think what may/probably happened was that years ago, a big part of the business was building complete sets from vending. Over the decades, it would be awfully easy for an employee or Larry himself to have taken some cards from a box for a set and replaced it on the giant shelving units to be forgotten about. then, 40 years later that same box gets pulled and sold as fresh.
Do I think every vending box from Fritsch is searched? No I do not. But I also do not believe every single one is case fresh either. If it truly is Steve's policy to wrap/authenticate every individual vending box he receives from Fritsch cards without opening the factory case himself, color me surprised. That is a lot of trust to put behind the good reputation of BBCE.
this is not just my theory, many in the hobby feel the same/similar.
so, no, not stupid or unfounded.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Does the Fritsch business/company still sell vintage vending boxes from the 70's?
https://fritschcards.com
It doesn't seem like they are currently selling much. I searched their site for 'vending' and saw a bunch of junk era stuff (plus a 1981 baseball vending box - just on the cusp of junk era). A search under 'wax pack' did show some vintage ('67 baseball and some early '70's packs) but mostly newer stuff.
I had heard awhile back that they still have lots of old unopened but don't want to flood the market. No idea if that is true now.
Thank you. I checked out the website before I made my post and could not find anything from the 70's or 60's.
Thanks. Great info I appreciate it. When I searched the site I got the same result as you did.
It used to be that when you ordered say a 1972 Topps FB Rack Pack from Fritsch that they just grabbed the next random one from a box. On occasion, I would get a great pack with a star or two showing. It made it worth the premium Fritsch charged for their raw packs. Since the Larry's grand-kids have taken over, it appears that they now search through boxes, pull the star packs and sell them separately. It reduces the excitement involved and makes most of what they sell overpriced. I'm only talking about the stuff they sell on their website, I have no idea what they have worked out with Steve and Collect Auctions.
So….you answered your own question by viewing the website. Marvelous. What you see being commonly discussed about Fritsch boxes will likely be merchandise acquired from them long ago and sold by a third party.
Not really. Does the company sell any in the auction houses or on EBAY? Or anywhere else. This is what I'm asking as I have very limited knowledge on Fritsch. I did some research - found nothing which is why I asked the guys on the board who are up to date on this topic.
https://www.ebay.com/str/larryfritschcards
I can only speak to my personal experience with any amount of authority. We've all heard what we've heard about them and those. I've gotten good and bad from just about everywhere... including Fritsch and BBCE. My only problem is the perception that if something is wrapped by Steve, or it comes from Fritsch that it's ordained... good... or whatever. I generally only say negative things on here regarding BBCE and Steve, but simply from that perspective... He's an expert, but it's not clear what that means as far as certainty and Steve does nothing to help clear that up. But I buy from BBCE every month because it's the best bet out there, and BBCE wrapped Fritsch boxes are my favorites. So, from a BBCE complainer, in the here and now, I think that Fristch + BBCE wrap is best you're gonna get as far as blessings unless you're willing to pay for FASC. Good luck out there and may your corners be sharp.
Okay, now this is very true. On the vending boxes, they opened up hundreds of vending to make high grade sets which they sold in their catalog going back to the early 80s. I have never seen any fowl play with any of the vending and I was a pretty big buyer of these. The cello boxes that were purchased always had really good stars showing and I never had an issue there. I did notice Fritch had a ton of rack and cello packs for sale that had stars on the front/back right after the transfer of ownership.
Thank you - great information and advice.
Vending Box Fever. A disease with no vaccines readily available to the Average Joe. All kidding aside, I have known both the thrill and disappointment of busting boxes and thank goodness I no longer care. 😊
Fritsch searching vending all stems from one very old photo. But it's nice having context that Fritsch, as a huge seller of vintage singles, cataloged and stored said vintage singles in vending boxes at his warehouse (often the same boxes they were sourced from). The majority of their unopened vending remained stored in sealed cases. I would have no problem buying vending boxes from Fritsch, but I also wouldn't buy vending in a quest for high grade cards.
I'll also add that most "searched" Fritsch vending box experiences I've seen, come across more as rants because the ripper didn't get the cards they expected. Vending collation can be all over the place, especially in end-of-season inventory dumps like Fritsch always got.
Collect Auctions
If you want old stuff you have to call and discuss. I think they still have a lot of stuff from 1975 and up and a little from 1969 - 1974. Older I am not sure.