GSA's - Your thoughts on possible grades?
Coinscratch
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And what would be your strategy. PCGS and then CAC if warranted or send in as is hoping for a higher grade??
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Or something else altogether?
First one: 64+ or 64 PL, maybe a DMPL, not quite sure
The second one: I would say a solid 64, maybe 65
My two cents
Very nice coins. I'd leave as-is, enjoy them and save the money for another coin. I don't understand collectors paying the cost of grading the common CC GSA's unless they're at least MS65. If the hard case is not tampered with, we all know they're UNC. Not much price difference, esp 63 and lower. 64 starts to pop in price but with shipping, insurance grading fees its all a wash. Now the 79, 90 & 91 CCs are a different story. Those I would grade after 62.
That's what I was expecting to here and trust me these shots are wearing their Sunday best. As at angle with bright light they look pretty beat up.
I'm still kicking myself for not buying another one a year or so back. Don't remember the year but it looked really good (66/67) as compared to what I've been seeing and hearing.
My guesses are approximately 64PL and 65.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I like that 2nd one, the 85CC, I can see that in a 65 holder too.
I like and agree with these statements but I imagine the reason for collectors paying up for the fees is to ensure they recoup their investment along with the possibility of increasing the same.
I'm into these just under MS64 money and I'm more concerned with recouping more than I am profiting at this point.
Without certification I cannot ensure my return and quite honestly I'm ready for some return.
I would say that the 83-CC is MS64 PL and the 85-CC could get a 65 but I have found PCGS to be fairly conservative with GSAs. So they could be knocked down to a 63 PL and 64.
I hear far more comments that PCGS and NGC tend to be liberal in their GSA dollar grading than I do that they’re conservative. And that’s my view, as well.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Very recently in fact.
Looks 64PL and 65 to me as well. If you grade them I would do NGC. The PCGS "coffin" stinks IMO, and then it won't fit in the box.
What box? Besides NGC might be too loose and never get a sticker.
It's a short term goal...
And if (which I wouldn’t assume) PCGS grades them lower and they sticker, they wouldn’t be worth more than a higher NGC grade without a sticker. You’re over- thinking it.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
The PCGS coffin won't fit in the original black GSA box because PCGS puts the GSA slab in a larger slab, result in a "double slab" that looks silly to me.
I think the lighting/angling may hide a few hits on the 1st one that may put it at 63PL. I wouldn't be surprised if it got 64PL however.
2nd (1885), I would put at 65
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
The GSA are probably the most liquid Morgans around. Wouldn't worry too much that a sticker is a necessity for future sale and obtaining current market value..
There's about a $400-$500 spread for CAC approval if the coin goes 65, so I think that one is a worthwhile ROI.
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A couple months ago, I bought a couple GSA Morgans from a local dealer at the Palm Beach show. He's always at full retail on everything, but I wanted to make a courtesy purchase because he does find something decent every now and then. IIRC one was an 81-cc and the other 83-cc but Im not sure. They were both graded by NGC, one at 64+ and the other was a 65, neither had been sent to CAC but I couldn't deny they looked solid.
Instead of sending them for stickering, I peeled off the NGC bands and cleaned up the slabs, and threw them in a CACG submission. At the time, there were strong wholesale bids for CACG banded GSA's, and since I already had a CACG submission anyway it was easier to include them vs do a separate sticker sub. They both upgraded, the 64+ went 65 and the 65 went 65+. I flipped them wholesale at the next show for $1000 profit, despite paying full retail for them in the beginning.
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I’ll post some more pics later that’ll show more of what the graders will see. Maybe then you guys will change your answers.
I’m still green on anything other than moderns where one small hit nullifies any reason for grading.
Do you have photos of the CACG banded GSAs? I have about a dozen I was going to send to NGC, but If CACG is (somewhat) consistent with NGC, I may just submit them to CACG instead. FWIW based on my experience I always thought NGC was not as “loose” on GSAs than with other Morgans, but that was about 10 or so years ago.
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I’m impressed that you appear to be holding up and balancing the coins with some of the toes on your right foot.
😉
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
With the new photos appear to be 63's, and no PL or +.
I don’t know which set of images, if either, is close to what the coins actually look like. But considering how different they are, if one of them’s close, the other isn’t. And it shouldn’t have been included, if looking for helpful grade assessments.
I’m not picking just on the OP here. As it’s not infrequent that someone starting a Guess The Grade thread posts pictures, multiple members reply and later, additional images are posted that look markedly different from the first ones.
In summary, poor images are the enemy of meaningful or helpful grade assessments.
Gripe over. 😬
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I can assure you that images aren't doctored in anyway however the type of lighting and particular angle makes all the difference. If you go back to the original pics you will find all of the same marks, glamour shots if you will.
No assurance necessary - I wasn’t thinking or talking about doctored images. But it sounds as if the initial images were glamor shots, which minimized the flaws and therefore led to inflated grade assessments.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Plus, as I mentioned earlier (what the graders will see) in the second set I held the slabs at angle, close up, and with bright light. I can't tell you how many times I've fooled myself with my own images and then had a made up grade in mind that never happened.
I thought both had a shot at 65 when I first viewed this thread. The 1st one does appear PL as well but that's always a crap shoot from images. Congrats!
Any CAC photos without the sandals? 😆. Guess I could look then up but the cert numbers are so long! 🤨
Based on the second set of images, looks like 63PL and 64. On the cusp of
not worth certifying IMO.
Both of those look quite nice and well above average as far a the typical GSA dollars go. If they were mine I would certainly send them both to CACG.
Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.
First one 62 (might get PL) next one 64
I might as well send to CACG to learn something plus to solidly a good ask.
Thanks-
I’ll come back around with the results.
Cougar1978: Whoa, I'm curious what you see that would take coin #1 down to 62? There might be something I'm missing?
Shipped off my first order to CACG today including these.
And I’m gonna put my own guess in, 63PL and 64.