First coin macro shots. Advice from the experts???

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 9:25AM

Ok, I’m a complete novice at macro photography of coins, so please be kind (well, you don’t have to – I’m a big boy – I can handle it!)! Up to now, my only coin pics have been either from my cell phone (hand-held) or my point-and-shoot (w/ tripod). Not conducive for really good pics, for sure!

I don’t need to be a professional, but I want to learn to take pretty good pics of my collection. My camera is not the best (Pentax K100D), but it’ll have to do for now. I just bought a new macro lens (Phoenix 100mm F3.5 – didn’t want to spend a ton, since I may end up getting a new camera at some point in the next year or so), as my zoom lenses were not doing the trick at all. I have a copy stand and 2 goose neck lamps, which I set at about 10:00 and 2:00 to the coin. Put the camera on macro mode, with manual focus, and a 2-second delay, auto white balance (could probably do custom w
hite balancing). No other settings, yet. Not sure if I can hook the Pentax K100D up to my laptop with LiveView, so I focused through the little viewfinder.

Attaching a few of my first pics (took about 100 shots tonight just to test), completely unedited, so you can see the pic as it came out of the camera. To be honest, these are tons better than anything I’ve done with the cell phone or point-and-shoot! So, already I’m happy and can see good things in the future with lots of practice and experimenting! But, I know my pics can get better with time.

Any advice from the coin photographers out there would be appreciated. A few questions:
1. Does anyone know if you can do LiveView and remote control on a laptop with a Pentax K100D? If so, how?
2. I see that I’m getting some clear sections and some blurry sections of the coin (esp noticeable on the Cent reverse). Do I play with Aperture to get more crispness across the entire coin? Do I have to have my camera on Macro Mode, or can I set to Aperture priority, instead?
3. Looks like blast white dimes are going to be a particular challenge – I should be able to get better than this. Do I need to change lighting?
4. Colors actually look pretty close to actual coins in hand, just coming out of the camera. What’s the preference for lighting? I’m using LED bulbs, 10W (60W equiv), 5000K. Or, doesn’t it matter with white balancing?
Ok, that’s enough for now – probably more questions to come, pending responses. Thanks in advance for any advice!

ctf_error_coins · August 10, 2019 9:28AM

The cent is blurry because the coin is not square with the lens.

That is ok to do, but you must have a smaller aperture for more depth of field.

Your photos are very good for a first try.

You must crop you photos much tighter.

TommyType · August 10, 2019 9:46AM

Far from an expert...But agree that someone ELSES eyes are very useful in assessing photos.

I think you may have the same issue I always do: Lighting. There are significant shadows and "dead spots" on most of your pics. It probably means you need more lights, or better positioning(?)

I haven't figured it out myself....so that's the best I can do for you.

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 10:24AM

@ErrorsOnCoins said:
The cent is blurry because the coin is not square with the lens.

That ok to do, but you must have a smaller aperture for more depth of field.

Your photos are very good for a first try.

You must crop you photos much tighter.

Thanks for the advice! I'll have to re-shoot the cent.

BTW - I didn't do anything to the pics. These are exactly how they came out of the camera. I guess I should have at least cropped them - you're right.

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 10:28AM

@TommyType said:
Far from an expert...But agree that someone ELSES eyes are very useful in assessing photos.

I think you may have the same issue I always do: Lighting. There are significant shadows and "dead spots" on most of your pics. It probably means you need more lights, or better positioning(?)

I haven't figured it out myself....so that's the best I can do for you.

Thanks for the lighting tip - maybe I'll try adding another lamp or two, to make up for the dead spots. Gotta keep playing with various positions (but, I thought 10:00 and 2:00 were the norm).

Like I said, I have lots and lots of practicing to do! Appreciate the advice!

ctf_error_coins · August 10, 2019 10:29AM

You can do quite a bit in post-production to make the photos look better without altering what the coins look like.

Davideo · August 10, 2019 10:35AM

There is an Adobe plugin for tethering Pentax, but I think that is images only and not live view. PK Tether is/was a free application for use with Pentax, that I may do live view. However, a quick search shows it may be defunct. You can probably find an old download somewhere, but I did not look.

lonn47 · August 10, 2019 10:36AM

okay..

RogerB · August 10, 2019 10:39AM

Get a small bubble level from the hardware store. Use that to make sure the camera back and the coin are parallel.

ctf_error_coins · August 10, 2019 10:42AM

@RogerB said:
Get a small bubble level from the hardware store. Use that to make sure the camera back and the coin are parallel.

Some coins need to be unparallel for the best results, thus the suggestion for a smaller aperture and the need to hyper-focus.

RogerB · August 10, 2019 10:44AM

If the coin has to be tilted for "best results" it means that lighting angles are incorrect. Tilting only adds multiple distortions than confuse the photo. Alter lighting, not the coin.

ctf_error_coins · August 10, 2019 10:51AM

Where is that darn disagree button ....

crazyhounddog · August 10, 2019 10:59AM

A lot of critics here on your first shoot with a macro. In my opinion you did excellent. Very well done my friend. Practice makes perfect. It’s a hell of a lot of fun but you must stay with it. I believe more light would be too much. There is a threshold you must not pass with too many lumens as it will wash out the color unless you make adjustment to your shutter speed or your aperture or both. Shoot manually as you’ll have much more control over your work. Stay with it bud cause like I said practice makes perfect. It truly is a hobby within a hobby that really can become addictive in a very good way.
Happy hunting, Joe

MilkmanDan · August 10, 2019 11:02AM

Good start. More light. Don’t get too frustrated, some coins are easy and others are really difficult to capture.

crazyhounddog · August 10, 2019 11:13AM

PM sent

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 11:18AM

@crazyhounddog said:
A lot of critics here on your first shoot with a macro. In my opinion you did excellent. Very well done my friend. Practice makes perfect. It’s a hell of a lot of fun but you must stay with it. I believe more light would be too much. There is a threshold you must not pass with too many lumens as it will wash out the color unless you make adjustment to your shutter speed or your aperture or both. Shoot manually as you’ll have much more control over your work. Stay with it bud cause like I said practice makes perfect. It truly is a hobby within a hobby that really can become addictive in a very good way.
Happy hunting, Joe

Thanks, Joe! Critics, or critique, is exactly what I need! I'm ok with the good and the negative comments, as long as they're constructive - it will help me learn! Not gonna get frustrated, at least not yet. This was just my first attempt with a macro lens, so I know I have TONS to learn. It's not easy to get great pics, or everyone could do it! I can see this getting addictive, tho, and might force me to spend more $$ on a better camera at some point! That's not neccesarily a bad thing!

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 11:19AM

@Davideo said:
There is an Adobe plugin for tethering Pentax, but I think that is images only and not live view. PK Tether is/was a free application for use with Pentax, that I may do live view. However, a quick search shows it may be defunct. You can probably find an old download somewhere, but I did not look.

Thanks, I'll look around. Thought I might also check out the Pentax/Ricoh forums.

crazyhounddog · August 10, 2019 11:26AM

@Eric_Babula said:

@crazyhounddog said:
A lot of critics here on your first shoot with a macro. In my opinion you did excellent. Very well done my friend. Practice makes perfect. It’s a hell of a lot of fun but you must stay with it. I believe more light would be too much. There is a threshold you must not pass with too many lumens as it will wash out the color unless you make adjustment to your shutter speed or your aperture or both. Shoot manually as you’ll have much more control over your work. Stay with it bud cause like I said practice makes perfect. It truly is a hobby within a hobby that really can become addictive in a very good way.
Happy hunting, Joe

Thanks, Joe! Critics, or critique, is exactly what I need! I'm ok with the good and the negative comments, as long as they're constructive - it will help me learn! Not gonna get frustrated, at least not yet. This was just my first attempt with a macro lens, so I know I have TONS to learn. It's not easy to get great pics, or everyone could do it! I can see this getting addictive, tho, and might force me to spend more $$ on a better camera at some point! That's not neccesarily a bad thing!

Apparently I overstepped.
My apologies.

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 11:42AM

@crazyhounddog said:

@Eric_Babula said:

@crazyhounddog said:
A lot of critics here on your first shoot with a macro. In my opinion you did excellent. Very well done my friend. Practice makes perfect. It’s a hell of a lot of fun but you must stay with it. I believe more light would be too much. There is a threshold you must not pass with too many lumens as it will wash out the color unless you make adjustment to your shutter speed or your aperture or both. Shoot manually as you’ll have much more control over your work. Stay with it bud cause like I said practice makes perfect. It truly is a hobby within a hobby that really can become addictive in a very good way.
Happy hunting, Joe

Thanks, Joe! Critics, or critique, is exactly what I need! I'm ok with the good and the negative comments, as long as they're constructive - it will help me learn! Not gonna get frustrated, at least not yet. This was just my first attempt with a macro lens, so I know I have TONS to learn. It's not easy to get great pics, or everyone could do it! I can see this getting addictive, tho, and might force me to spend more $$ on a better camera at some point! That's not neccesarily a bad thing!

Apparently I overstepped.
My apologies.

I don't think you overstepped at all! I'm all for learning whatever I can.

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 12:06PM

@lonn47 said:
okay..

I'm perplexed. Were you going to type more, but accidentally hit "Post Comment" early?

golden · August 10, 2019 12:11PM

Not bad at all. I wish that I could do half as good.

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 2:23PM

Back in the day, when I was a member of rec.collecting.coins newsgroup, there was a guy named Eric Tillery (k6az was his handle) who was a very good photographer. Not sure if he's still around the coin forums anymore or not. He and I (and others) had a discussion about photographing with a point-and-shoot vs a DSLR. He challenged the group to use a point-and-shoot to take a pic of a blast white Mercury Dime that would equal the quality of one that he posted. Being one who's up for challenges, my response was "challenge accepted" (assuming that I wasn't going to succeed, but wanting to get there anyway!). I think I was the only one who took up the challenge.

Long story short, I failed......miserably! After hours of shooting my Merc (possibly the same Merc as shown in my pics above, I can't recall anymore - that was like in 2004, maybe), I came to the conclusion, and admitted to the newsgroup, that I could not equal the DSLR, or even come close.

Now, shooting with my relatively cheap DSLR that I bought in like 2005 or 2006, and with my super expensive ($60) new macro lens I fully realize the futility in the efforts I made back then! Even with my cheap equipment, the pics I'm getting (see above), are far better than anything I ever did with my point-and-shoot. YMMV.

Again, I know I have LOTS to learn, but, with guidance from you guys/gals (maybe some more of the experts, like @messydesk and others) and much more practice, I'll be able to be happy with my results in the end. This may end up being a secondary "coin" obsession for me!

Thanks again in advance for any additional advice!! This is fun!

RogerB · August 10, 2019 2:53PM

The OP's photos are a very good start.

The primary change needs to be in lighting - not more light, just better controlled light. Also, remember that a portrait coin is a small bas relief and should be lit much as one would a human portrait.

Suggest you find a copy of Mark Goodman's book, Numismatic Photography (2008) on coin photography or see his web site coinimaging.com

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 3:07PM

@RogerB said:
The OP's photos are a very good start.

The primary change needs to be in lighting - not more light, just better controlled light. Also, remember that a portrait coin is a small bas relief and should be lit much as one would a human portrait.

Suggest you find a copy of Mark Goodman's book, Numismatic Photography (2008) on coin photography or see his web site coinimaging.com

Thanks, @RogerB . I have already been reading Mark's website - particularly like this page: http://coinimaging.com/photography.html. And, I have his book on my list to purchase soon.

I gotta play more with Aperture and lighting. His lighting section on the website may be a bit dated (he discusses GE Reveal vs fluorescent vs halogen, but not LED). I think I'm going to lean toward LED for now. Maybe that's a mistake. Or, maybe the camera's White Balancing can compensate for whatever lighting is used.

jerseycat101 · August 10, 2019 3:51PM

I think the OP did a great job on his first try. Some nice coins too! Refreshing to see things other than obscure dime varieties.

RogerB · August 10, 2019 4:03PM

Eric_Babula -
Your camera's white balance will compensate, but it will work best if balanced manually - automatic will give incorrect color for toned coins, copper, etc. As for lights, eliminate fluorescent - they are worthless. Any other light source that is roughly circular and can be moved around will do fine. LEDs will be OK and often require minimal color balancing.

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 4:11PM

@jerseycat101 said:
I think the OP did a great job on his first try. Some nice coins too! Refreshing to see things other than obscure dime varieties.

Thanks @jerseycat101 ! I thought I'd take a shot at some of my favorites, and some variety. Some with color. Some white. An off-center cent. First one with a planchet flaw on obv. Gotta get some others in there, too - nickels, 2-cent, 3-cent, halves, commems, proofs.....

Lots and LOTS of practice needed!

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 4:16PM

@RogerB said:
Eric_Babula -
Your camera's white balance will compensate, but it will work best if balanced manually - automatic will give incorrect color for toned coins, copper, etc. As for lights, eliminate fluorescent - they are worthless. Any other light source that is roughly circular and can be moved around will do fine. LEDs will be OK and often require minimal color balancing.

Thanks - I'll play with manual white balancing, too.

RogerB · August 10, 2019 4:35PM

Manual white balancing ensures that the color of your coins is close to neutral and objective. However, use only one type of light even if you use multiple lamps, as Mr. Goodman suggests. Also, be sure the ambient light is low and the room has subdued or neutral colors - otherwise you can get off-color reflections from the coins. You want your controlled lights to be the only illumination captured by the camera.

Eric_Babula · August 10, 2019 8:34PM

@RogerB said:
Manual white balancing ensures that the color of your coins is close to neutral and objective. However, use only one type of light even if you use multiple lamps, as Mr. Goodman suggests. Also, be sure the ambient light is low and the room has subdued or neutral colors - otherwise you can get off-color reflections from the coins. You want your controlled lights to be the only illumination captured by the camera.

That's kinda what I did. I turned off the ceiling can lights and only had the controlled lights on. Only using (2) LED 10W 5000K lights.

lkeigwin · August 10, 2019 9:29PM

You're doing just fine.

Be critical of your work. Experiment a lot. And don't shy from making adjustments to images that make them more like the coins. The camera applies its programmed adjustments which aren't always right. Fix them with your editor.
Lance.

drwstr123 · August 11, 2019 9:07AM

I like the Pentax. Here's an old Pentax ist with Pentax 100mm Macro lens..

Eric_Babula · August 11, 2019 11:35AM

@drwstr123 said:
I like the Pentax. Here's an old Pentax ist with Pentax 100mm Macro lens..

Per other comments, I need to work on getting more even lighting across the entire surface of the coin, with less dead zones. I like yours better than my cent pic. Can you show a pic of your setup for that shot? Here's my setup. I know, I have to get rid of all the other clutter around the copy stand. That's goal #1, to make this a macro photo area only.

For these pics, I originally just wanted to test out my new macro lens (just got from Ebay) just to see if it worked. But, then I decided to post some of the pics and see what advice I could get from the forum.

If anyone has advice about how to improve my setup, please let me know.

Swampboy · August 11, 2019 12:02PM

Nice work
Keep at it
You've inspired me to try the same shot with LEDs vs the incandescents I've been using

Eric_Babula · August 11, 2019 12:04PM

@Swampboy said:
Nice work
Keep at it
You've inspired me to try the same shot with LEDs vs the incandescents I've been using

I thought it was all you guys who were inspiring me to take better pics!!!

topstuf · August 11, 2019 1:47PM

You might try asking lordmacrovan.
Or ignoring this awful pun.

Swampboy · August 11, 2019 2:07PM

@topstuf said:
You might try asking lordmacrovan.
Or ignoring this awful pun.

Ah
lordminivan 😂😂😂😂

drwstr123 · August 11, 2019 2:23PM

"Can you show a pic of your setup for that shot?"

First coin macro shots. Advice from the experts???

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