Any Word if CAC Will Automatically Reapply Stickers on Coins That Get the New PCGS PL Designation?

winesteven · July 4, 2019 6:31PM

If no one knows, I’ll email CAC in the morning. To be clear, if a coin has a CAC, and is sent in now for “Reconsideration” to try to get the new PL designation, and if they succeed, the Cert Number stays the same in the new holder. When sent back to CAC, will they treat it like a coin that got a “+”, and automatically reapply the sticker, or will CAC evaluate the coin to determine if in their opinion it merits the new PL designation?

U1chicago · July 4, 2019 6:41PM

Considering this is brand new, I would think most would only be able to speculate.
Your best bet would be to email CAC and then let us know the answer.

If I had to guess, I'd say CAC would not automatically resticker the coin. The coin could have been solid (A or 'B) for the grade, but maybe it wasn't solid (A or 'B) for the designation. In that case wouldn't they want to not resticker?

CuKevin · July 4, 2019 6:53PM

At this point, this will be pure speculation.

My best guess is that the sticker will not be automatically reapplied since CAC does ‘care about’ the PL designation, but disregards pluses.

ilikemonsters · July 4, 2019 7:48PM

Will CAC sticker a MS65 DMPL Morgan Dollar if they agree with the 65 grade, but not the DMPL designation? No!

I find it best to apply the above example to PL coins.

robec · July 4, 2019 7:59PM

CAC may ignore the designation the same way the "+" designation is ignored.

You'll probably be charged the $3 sticker replacement fee.

Kove · July 4, 2019 8:15PM

CAC does evaluate the PL designation, they have for years on NGC PL coins. I've discussed it with JA.

PCGS PL treatment should be no different.

winesteven · July 4, 2019 8:28PM

@Kove said:
CAC does evaluate the PL designation, they have for years on NGC PL coins. I've discussed it with JA. PCGS PL treatment should be no different.

Thanks. That’s the answer, as you’ve discussed this with JA.

cameonut2011 · July 4, 2019 8:30PM

@winesteven said:
If no one knows, I’ll email CAC in the morning. To be clear, if a coin has a CAC, and is sent in now for “Reconsideration” to try to get the new PL designation, and if they succeed, the Cert Number stays the same in the new holder. When sent back to CAC, will they treat it like a coin that got a “+”, and automatically reapply the sticker, or will CAC evaluate the coin to determine if in their opinion it merits the new PL designation?

CAC considers the PL/DMPL designation to be part of the grade so MS65 and MS65 PL, for instance, are two different grades. In short, no the coins will be re-evaluated to see whether CAC agrees with the PL designation.

cameonut2011 · July 4, 2019 8:31PM

@robec said:
CAC may ignore the designation the same way the "+" designation is ignored.

You'll probably be charged the $3 sticker replacement fee.

It's not. I have seen John reject PL coins as "not PL enough for CAC" so the designation is definitely part of the consideration.

robec · July 4, 2019 11:09PM

@cameonut2011 said:

@robec said:
CAC may ignore the designation the same way the "+" designation is ignored.

You'll probably be charged the $3 sticker replacement fee.

It's not. I have seen John reject PL coins as "not PL enough for CAC" so the designation is definitely part of the consideration.

Did the coin previously have a CAC sticker?

Timbuk3 · July 5, 2019 12:18AM

Interesting question !!!

Soldi · July 5, 2019 5:29AM

At some point we're all going to have to agree, on our own, what we like, what WE see, and what we'll pay for it.

Gazes · July 5, 2019 5:50AM

@Soldi said:
At some point we're all going to have to agree, on our own, what we like, what WE see, and what we'll pay for it.

I'm pretty sure we all do this right now. Although we may buy coins raw, in a PCGS holder, NGC holder, CAC or NON CAC sticker, Eagle Eye sticker, etc----at the end of the day everyone makes their own decision what they like, whether they want to buy it and how much they will pay for it.

nencoin · July 5, 2019 8:00AM

@winesteven said:
If no one knows, I’ll email CAC in the morning. To be clear, if a coin has a CAC, and is sent in now for “Reconsideration” to try to get the new PL designation, and if they succeed, the Cert Number stays the same in the new holder. When sent back to CAC, will they treat it like a coin that got a “+”, and automatically reapply the sticker, or will CAC evaluate the coin to determine if in their opinion it merits the new PL designation?

I can't imagine that the cert number will stay the same since it's not a reholder. It's essentially a brand new coin (different PCGS coin number too), so they will assign it a brand new cert number. I assume PCGS will pull the old non-PL coin off the pop report and add the new PL coin.

winesteven · July 5, 2019 8:11AM

@nencoin - My understanding is that with Reconsideration, if any suffix is added, or if the grade is upgraded, as per PCGS, the cert number remains unchanged. I agree they adjust their pops.

Coinstartled · July 5, 2019 9:15AM

And so it goes...

nencoin · July 5, 2019 9:50AM

@winesteven said:
@nencoin - My understanding is that with Reconsideration, if any suffix is added, or if the grade is upgraded, as per PCGS, the cert number remains unchanged. I agree they adjust their pops.

Huh. Well, that kind of surprises but perhaps that is indeed how they do it. My apologies for the misinformation!

coinkat · July 5, 2019 10:01AM

Call them and hear what the deal is directly from the horse

winesteven · July 5, 2019 10:09AM

@winesteven said - My understanding is that with Reconsideration, if any suffix is added, or if the grade is upgraded, as per PCGS, the cert number remains unchanged. I agree they adjust their pops.

The Reconsideration area of the submission form shows several types of “upgrades” - a plus, a whole grade, a suffix (like PL), etc. The following is pasted from the PCGS website:

Will anything change on my label if I receive an upgrade?
Other than the grade itself, anything on the original label will stay the same, including pedigree, descriptions and certification numbers. Note that if your coin qualifies for the selection you chose, you will lose your third party sticker service, such as Wings, Eagle Eye and CAC.

winesteven · July 5, 2019 10:13AM

@coinkat said:
Call them and hear what the deal is directly from the horse.

I sent an email to them this morning. They might be out until Monday (or just tied up evaluating coins).
A nice weekend to all.

coinkat · July 5, 2019 10:19AM

I suspect they are out until Monday

cameonut2011 · July 5, 2019 10:26AM

@robec said:

@cameonut2011 said:

@robec said:
CAC may ignore the designation the same way the "+" designation is ignored.

You'll probably be charged the $3 sticker replacement fee.

It's not. I have seen John reject PL coins as "not PL enough for CAC" so the designation is definitely part of the consideration.

Did the coin previously have a CAC sticker?

No. CAC was asked for feedback/notes, and it sent back a note identifying the weakly PL qualities as the reason for the rejection. John is usually very good about giving you all of his reasons for a rejection if you ask.

RogerB · July 5, 2019 11:39AM

Sure -- Just put your newly re-slabbed jewel in the cup holder on a computer and press the "CAC Sticker" button. CAC will automatically read the slab barcode and email a new sticker and put it right on your new slab. Don't know about cost ---

winesteven · July 5, 2019 12:53PM

@RogerB said:
Sure -- Just put your newly re-slabbed jewel in the cup holder on a computer and press the "CAC Sticker" button. CAC will automatically read the slab barcode and email a new sticker and put it right on your new slab. Don't know about cost ---

Actually, when a coin gets a “+” upon Reconsideration, since the Cert Number stays the same, yes, it’s almost exactly as you state, since CAC “does not recognize” plus grades, so they will automatically reapply their coveted sticker. And the cost is only $3 (plus round trip shipping, since the cup holder system you’ve described is not quite yet online) LOL.
Have a nice weekend.
Steve

RogerB · July 5, 2019 2:19PM

$3. OK. What if I only want one way shipping -- say, back to me? Really thought everybody had the direct-to-cup-holder system.... Got to check my PC's manual again.....

winesteven · July 9, 2019 11:32AM

@winesteven said:
I sent an email to them this morning. They might be out until Monday (or just tied up evaluating coins).
A nice weekend to all.

I received an email reply this morning, and JA indicated just what we all figured - the coin with a prior CAC that is now receiving the new "PL" designation by PCGS is treated by CAC as a new submission, and when CAC examines the coin, in their opinion it must merit that new PL designation to get the CAC sticker.

lkeigwin · July 9, 2019 11:59AM

The PL designation involves new PCGS coin numbers. E.g., in Brett's announcement he showed us an 1899-S PL half eagle. Its PCGS coin# is 88399. The non-PL is coin# 8399.

This means at a minimum the cert will have a new barcode and cite the new coin#. I'd bet the cert# changes too when a coin earns the PL designation. (A plus-designation is a grade enhancement, not a new coin#, so there is no need to change the cert#.)
Lance.

BAJJERFAN · July 9, 2019 12:02PM

So who was the lucky one to get the first new PL designation?

winesteven · July 9, 2019 12:30PM

@lkeigwin said:
The PL designation involves new PCGS coin numbers. E.g., in Brett's announcement he showed us an 1899-S PL half eagle. Its PCGS coin# is 88399. The non-PL is coin# 8399.

This means at a minimum the cert will have a new barcode and cite the new coin#. I'd bet the cert# changes too when a coin earns the PL designation. (A plus-designation is a grade enhancement, not a new coin#, so there is no need to change the cert#.)

Lance.

I agree with all you said, but my guess is if you request it of PCGS, the actual cert # can remain the same. Regardless, the point is it will NOT automatically get a CAC reapplied if success with "PL", even if the cert # is the same.

Any Word if CAC Will Automatically Reapply Stickers on Coins That Get the New PCGS PL Designation?

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