@PhilLynott said:
I think $250 is a little excessive but it's accomplishing what they're setting out to accomplish - stopping the thousands of people trying to shop their 4 ASE's around and wasting their time. I think they could have had the same success with a $20 fee though. I bet they spend 95% of their time dealing with 5% of their potential business and they got tired of it.
Again, it's excessive, but I don't blame them at all.
I agree I now do something like that only my fee is $30.00
I'm tired of tire kickers with a handful of wheat cents and ten Jefferson nickels from tha 50's
Thinking they are worth over $100.00
Pat Vetter,Mercury Dime registry set,1938 Proof set registry,Pat & BJ Coins:724-325-7211
@Kudbegud said:
jclovescoins you probably weren't around in this forum back when the 5 oz ATB's first came out. The shenanigans that APMEX pulled soured me in doing business with them. I have not bought another coin from them since. Every time I see APMEX mentioned in a post I flash back to this bad memory for a couple seconds. The impression in my head of questionable ethics on their part lingers still.
The Mint were morons for having such a low mintage and expecting resellers to keep the price down.
Can you name one of the reselling companies that didn't try to rip collectors off for the pucks? AFAIK, they all did, and most were only offered to their elite customers.
The good thing that came out of that mess were the 5oz collector pucks. We probably never would have gotten those if the initial fiasco didn't take place.
I think the ATB debacle being referred to is not the pricing, but that APMEX was alleged to have cherrypicked the best ones out of the sets for grading, and the seconds were placed in the original packaging for reselling to those buying the raw sets.
I had thought that put to rest until a few months ago when I purchased a Britannia 2 coin set, one of which was a reverse proof APMEX and British Mint special. The coin was an obvious second or third quality (visible marring without using a glass) and both coins were in a plastic bag, shipped with/but not inside, the mint packaging.
It was not the first set I've seen and that plastic bag was clearly NOT the original packaging. Certainly brought to mind the ATB cherry picking tales from before. Quite a concern that the after market baggie held second rate coins. Again, maybe a simple luck of the draw (though why it was in that extra bag...) but that's when I stopped being a buyer there. Now I'm not a seller either.
@Kudbegud said:
jclovescoins you probably weren't around in this forum back when the 5 oz ATB's first came out. The shenanigans that APMEX pulled soured me in doing business with them. I have not bought another coin from them since. Every time I see APMEX mentioned in a post I flash back to this bad memory for a couple seconds. The impression in my head of questionable ethics on their part lingers still.
The Mint were morons for having such a low mintage and expecting resellers to keep the price down.
Can you name one of the reselling companies that didn't try to rip collectors off for the pucks? AFAIK, they all did, and most were only offered to their elite customers.
The good thing that came out of that mess were the 5oz collector pucks. We probably never would have gotten those if the initial fiasco didn't take place.
I'm stretching my memory a bit, but my recollection is that mint set the max retail price for the 5 or so official resellers. I recall some (like maybe MTB?) were pretty straight forward and sold pretty quickly after receiving them and handled the very high demand about as well as could be expected. And you did not need to be an elite collector or whatever, just one set per household. APMEX was dragging their feet and all indications are that were trying to figure out how to charge more for higher graded coins. After sitting on their inventory much longer than any other reseller, each of the boxes from APMEX had a letter written on it that correlated to how high the grades were. I certainly could have a few minor details wrong, but APMEX was definitely the worst reseller in my opinion.
Any number of big sellers do the same thing on eBay that APMEX does. I guess the small time dealers are free to stock up with the specials too. With these specials going on, I would never buy an ounce of gold from them at their regular price of $70 or more over spot.
Exactly, right now the have raw AU double eagles for $24.99 over spot. With the current ebay bucks offer of 8% bonus bucks you earn $100. So who doesn't like double eagles for $75 under melt? It's a no brainer.
First you have to catch them being sold in a category that pays the bucks. 8% bonus bucks are worthless if you never get them [which I and some others here] never seem to do. Of course the free shipping and credit card reward points are nice. Of course when you go to resell your gold they are your competition because why would I buy from you even at $30 over and fret shipping when I can buy from them at $10 over and get reward points and better shipping. I sold an AGE last week for $15 over, walked out mit cash and didn't have to sweat risky shipping.
@Kudbegud said:
jclovescoins you probably weren't around in this forum back when the 5 oz ATB's first came out. The shenanigans that APMEX pulled soured me in doing business with them. I have not bought another coin from them since. Every time I see APMEX mentioned in a post I flash back to this bad memory for a couple seconds. The impression in my head of questionable ethics on their part lingers still.
The Mint were morons for having such a low mintage and expecting resellers to keep the price down.
Can you name one of the reselling companies that didn't try to rip collectors off for the pucks? AFAIK, they all did, and most were only offered to their elite customers.
The good thing that came out of that mess were the 5oz collector pucks. We probably never would have gotten those if the initial fiasco didn't take place.
The 5 oz pucks are the dumbest looking thing the mint ever made . If that was the only good thing that came out of its right up there with the black plague
@Stork said:
I had thought that put to rest until a few months ago when I purchased a Britannia 2 coin set, one of which was a reverse proof APMEX and British Mint special. The coin was an obvious second or third quality (visible marring without using a glass) and both coins were in a plastic bag, shipped with/but not inside, the mint packaging.
That is VERY disturbing. Maybe they shipped all sets to a TPG and these were subpar coins that got cracked out and thrown into baggies for sale to people who wanted OGP. If that is the case it is very unethical. To me, ungraded means ungraded, not rejected.
> First you have to catch them being sold in a category that pays the bucks. 8% bonus bucks are worthless if you never get them [which I and some others here] never seem to do. Of course the free shipping and credit card reward points are nice. Of course when you go to resell your gold they are your competition because why would I buy from you even at $30 over and fret shipping when I can buy from them at $10 over and get reward points and better shipping. I sold an AGE last week for $15 over, walked out mit cash and didn't have to sweat risky shipping.
I agree. For what its worth, I stopped getting the bucks bonus 2 years ago. Last month started new account in wife's name (both accounts still share same paypal but changed the primary email) and those 8-10% bonus bucks are flowing again.
They almost always list non bullion coins outside the bullion category. They have random $10 full eagle PCGS/ NGC MS62 listed at $45 over. Not near as good a deal as the double eagle but if you have the bonus bucks you end up with a slabbed MS coin for $10 under melt.
Didn't want to hijack the ops thread but point is don't sell to apmex but certainly use them to your advantage on buys. I'm much more of a bullion stacker than a rare coin collector although I appreciate both. I think as a bullion stacker APMEX is a good place to buy. As a numismatists not so much.
And I certainly wouldn't attempt to sell an AGE on Ebay. You certainly went the right route.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
> First you have to catch them being sold in a category that pays the bucks. 8% bonus bucks are worthless if you never get them [which I and some others here] never seem to do. Of course the free shipping and credit card reward points are nice. Of course when you go to resell your gold they are your competition because why would I buy from you even at $30 over and fret shipping when I can buy from them at $10 over and get reward points and better shipping. I sold an AGE last week for $15 over, walked out mit cash and didn't have to sweat risky shipping.
I agree. For what its worth, I stopped getting the bucks bonus 2 years ago. Last month started new account in wife's name (both accounts still share same paypal but changed the primary email) and those 8-10% bonus bucks are flowing again.
They almost always list non bullion coins outside the bullion category. They have random $10 full eagle PCGS/ NGC MS62 listed at $45 over. Not near as good a deal as the double eagle but if you have the bonus bucks you end up with a slabbed MS coin for $10 under melt.
Didn't want to hijack the ops thread but point is don't sell to apmex but certainly use them to your advantage on buys. I'm much more of a bullion stacker than a rare coin collector although I appreciate both. I think as a bullion stacker APMEX is a good place to buy. As a numismatists not so much.
And I certainly wouldn't attempt to sell an AGE on Ebay. You certainly went the right route.
Every dealer is either a source to buy from , or a place to sell to.
Even with a small town dealer , about the dumbest thing you can do if you like buying from him is try to sell some of it back. Mark my words if you find out what his spread is you might never go back there again
Or, to put it a different way my pet cat prefers that I don't put his food dish in the litterbox.
Even with a small town dealer , about the dumbest thing you can do if you like buying from him is try to sell some of it back. Mark my words if you find out what his spread is you might never go back there again
Or, to put it a different way my pet cat prefers that I don't put his food dish in the litterbox.
Funny, every local dealer I ever dealt with I always tried to sell to before buy from. You certainly learn what you are dealing with that way.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
If folks are thinking your company is a benchmark for pricing information, that can't be all bad. Contact with a customer is a great start to a deal. Why all the hand wringing if you don't get every deal or crying over lost time, this is basic 101 business. Seems like servicing the new policy would take more effort than quoting prices.
On another note, how hard is bullion to trade locally? You know the big companies are gonna wail on you.
Same here, always gave free appraisals, because if I can at least get to see it, I have a shot, because so many others are low ballers, but at times, this free appraisal service is abused by folks just wanting to get a value or no intention on seeing to us and just keeping it in family or selling to a family member.
@Kudbegud said:
jclovescoins you probably weren't around in this forum back when the 5 oz ATB's first came out. The shenanigans that APMEX pulled soured me in doing business with them. I have not bought another coin from them since. Every time I see APMEX mentioned in a post I flash back to this bad memory for a couple seconds. The impression in my head of questionable ethics on their part lingers still.
The Mint were morons for having such a low mintage and expecting resellers to keep the price down.
Can you name one of the reselling companies that didn't try to rip collectors off for the pucks? AFAIK, they all did, and most were only offered to their elite customers.
The good thing that came out of that mess were the 5oz collector pucks. We probably never would have gotten those if the initial fiasco didn't take place.
I think the ATB debacle being referred to is not the pricing, but that APMEX was alleged to have cherrypicked the best ones out of the sets for grading, and the seconds were placed in the original packaging for reselling to those buying the raw sets.
I had thought that put to rest until a few months ago when I purchased a Britannia 2 coin set, one of which was a reverse proof APMEX and British Mint special. The coin was an obvious second or third quality (visible marring without using a glass) and both coins were in a plastic bag, shipped with/but not inside, the mint packaging.
It was not the first set I've seen and that plastic bag was clearly NOT the original packaging. Certainly brought to mind the ATB cherry picking tales from before. Quite a concern that the after market baggie held second rate coins. Again, maybe a simple luck of the draw (though why it was in that extra bag...) but that's when I stopped being a buyer there. Now I'm not a seller either.
I have never purchased Mint products from a big dealer without assuming they had been cherry picked. Don't they all do it...maybe I'm cynical?
@Kudbegud said:
jclovescoins you probably weren't around in this forum back when the 5 oz ATB's first came out. The shenanigans that APMEX pulled soured me in doing business with them. I have not bought another coin from them since. Every time I see APMEX mentioned in a post I flash back to this bad memory for a couple seconds. The impression in my head of questionable ethics on their part lingers still.
The Mint were morons for having such a low mintage and expecting resellers to keep the price down.
Can you name one of the reselling companies that didn't try to rip collectors off for the pucks? AFAIK, they all did, and most were only offered to their elite customers.
The good thing that came out of that mess were the 5oz collector pucks. We probably never would have gotten those if the initial fiasco didn't take place.
I think the ATB debacle being referred to is not the pricing, but that APMEX was alleged to have cherrypicked the best ones out of the sets for grading, and the seconds were placed in the original packaging for reselling to those buying the raw sets.
I had thought that put to rest until a few months ago when I purchased a Britannia 2 coin set, one of which was a reverse proof APMEX and British Mint special. The coin was an obvious second or third quality (visible marring without using a glass) and both coins were in a plastic bag, shipped with/but not inside, the mint packaging.
It was not the first set I've seen and that plastic bag was clearly NOT the original packaging. Certainly brought to mind the ATB cherry picking tales from before. Quite a concern that the after market baggie held second rate coins. Again, maybe a simple luck of the draw (though why it was in that extra bag...) but that's when I stopped being a buyer there. Now I'm not a seller either.
I have never purchased Mint products from a big dealer without assuming they had been cherry picked. Don't they all do it...maybe I'm cynical?
When people who think they are the smart money find out they aren't it hurts their self image.
If you are going to be a flipper of modern mint dreck you have to get in at the issue price. knowing the pucks were going to be issued through the AP and you would have to buy through that middleman the smart play was to sit it out. The puck drama was pure FOMO
The difference with the proof Britannia set was that they were numbered sets. xxx/500. In this case I would expect that the coins that came in the box remained the same, without getting swapped out. Not like some random bullion or unnumbered set. Need a shrug emoji here. Like I said , not buying more and the appeal of ‘collectible bullion’ has lost its shine anyway. Some of the Britannia’s are pretty gorgeous for modern stuff, but not if the British Royal Mint is going to offer something solely through one vendor.
It reminded me to a local beauty shop who charge $5 EACH time a customer tried on their selection of wigs or an eBay seller with 20% restocking return fee. I can see the point from both side.
@Stork said: It was not the first set I've seen and that plastic bag was clearly NOT the original packaging. Certainly brought to mind the ATB cherry picking tales from before. Quite a concern that the after market baggie held second rate coins. Again, maybe a simple luck of the draw (though why it was in that extra bag...) but that's when I stopped being a buyer there. Now I'm not a seller either.
There is no simple luck of the draw when you grooming your business.....
@1TwoBits said:
I've never done any business with APMEX, but I saw they put an 1806 PCGS AU50 old holdered bust quarter on eBay today. I was looking to attribute the variety, but they only put up a picture of the obverse slab, really great.
1TwoBits
It's because they don't own the coin. The majority of their better inventory is consigned to them by others now, so they don't have access to the coin or the image unless they sell it...
Are the big bullion dealers doing the volume they did a few years ago?
I would guess that this policy is just a way for them to control costs on lower volumes. They may have decided they want lower costs and fewer but higher quality sellers.
Could make sense for them, the downside is they will get fewer deals offered to them, but it seems like maybe they are positioning themselves as more of a retailer than a market maker. It will be interesting to see how this new policy works out over time.
@tyler267 said:
Are the big bullion dealers doing the volume they did a few years ago?
I would guess that this policy is just a way for them to control costs on lower volumes. They may have decided they want lower costs and fewer but higher quality sellers.
Could make sense for them, the downside is they will get fewer deals offered to them, but it seems like maybe they are positioning themselves as more of a retailer than a market maker. It will be interesting to see how this new policy works out over time.
What some of the people at Apmex have been saying is that they simply realize that they can't make enough money doing bullion...so, they think that they struck gold in offering everyone else's coins on their website that doesn't cost them anything...it's a great idea, except that they lack in numismatists and can't really serve true collectors in this manner.
my Boss typically charges a refundable $50 appraisal fee whenever someone comes in with a large "collection" they want to sell, borne from experience. the OP's story is probably an excessive example/amount, but it's probably because of what has happened with customers coming to APMEX. time is money.
I have had several instances where people straight out lie when asked "Are you intending to sell or did you just want an appraisal?" and say they want to sell. then after up to an hour of going through everything with two of us they will say "OK, I'll get back to you." it's called shopping around and if/when they come back our offer is always lower, we call it a-hole tax.
one time after doing that and having a 3-4 page priced inventory list I had a customer ask me if he could have the list.
In the past. I’ve sold approximately 15K worth of moderns to them. 2014 was my last. I sold a small amount of coins to them (2K) and accidently put a roll of 2002 silver eagles in the box with the rest of the coins. When I noticed the error from for pictures I took and notified them ASAP. Manager he would keep a lookout for the package. A week went by and heard nothing. I called back told him of the error (again) and said he would get back to me. A couple of days passed and nothing. When I refreshed his memory (again), he said look! We have cameras and I didn’t the additional roll in the box, I’m very sorry. That was the last time I used them. I have the picture with the roll in the box so how could it be in the box and missing the same day. Did I mention silver was at 28.xx something an ounce. ive and learn I guess.
@Kudbegud said:
jclovescoins you probably weren't around in this forum back when the 5 oz ATB's first came out. The shenanigans that APMEX pulled soured me in doing business with them. I have not bought another coin from them since. Every time I see APMEX mentioned in a post I flash back to this bad memory for a couple seconds. The impression in my head of questionable ethics on their part lingers still.
Ah yes, that would be the infamous "APMEX A-Bombs" issue. APMEX coded their boxes of ATB's, the "A" boxes were all the culls. There were some here with the opinion that certain customers - perhaps infrequent or new - got the "APMEX A-Bombs" while more frequent customers got the 70's. No matter, clearly they marked boxes based on the grade of coins in them and well if you got one of the boxes with culls weren't too happy and had to wonder why. I can't recall if APMEX ever addressed the issue and the thread is a bit long.
Good will goes far in the business world. The law firm I worked for would offer free consultations and there would always be a couple of people that would abuse it. They always called to seemingly waste our time with trivial matters until one day, a local mailman became grossly intoxicated and hit one of them. Despite potential governmental immunities, the case was a slam dunk and it more paid for those short phone calls over the years. I learned a lot from the so called Drunk Mailman Rule: Don’t tinkle where you eat.
This principle seemingly applies here... Those people with junk 90% percent silver and common wheat cents could surprise you one day and may not know what they have. Many would feel foolish if snobbery kept them from acquiring truly rare coins. I would love to find a rare die marriage from early federal coinage that might otherwise be very “common” in lower grades. Also remember the circulated 1894-S branch mint proof Barber dime or recovered lost 1913 proof Liberty Head Nickel? I have had low quality material offered to me from others too; however, I am always polite and willing to give a few minutes of my time.
I get it why AMPEX must do that. In the bullion world they do have people shopping widgets to them to get free info. Even better after people get the info for free they go elsewhere to sell. Bravo AMPEX!
perfect line from Moloian:
Too many people use APMEX as a starting point and they (and a lot of dealers) wind up spinning a lot of cycles for people that have no intention (regardless how good or bad the offer is) of selling to them. "They just want to know what its worth" that's called an appraisal, and you should pay for that.
@Kudbegud said:
jclovescoins you probably weren't around in this forum back when the 5 oz ATB's first came out. The shenanigans that APMEX pulled soured me in doing business with them. I have not bought another coin from them since. Every time I see APMEX mentioned in a post I flash back to this bad memory for a couple seconds. The impression in my head of questionable ethics on their part lingers still.
Ah yes, that would be the infamous "APMEX A-Bombs" issue. APMEX coded their boxes of ATB's, the "A" boxes were all the culls. There were some here with the opinion that certain customers - perhaps infrequent or new - got the "APMEX A-Bombs" while more frequent customers got the 70's. No matter, clearly they marked boxes based on the grade of coins in them and well if you got one of the boxes with culls weren't too happy and had to wonder why. I can't recall if APMEX ever addressed the issue and the thread is a bit long.
They addressed it kinda sorta in a way. When interviewed by Coin World they denied marking boxes with righteous indignation. The interviewer followed up with more softball questions ignoring the evidence provided to them by members of this forum proving the accusations were true. I guess advertisers get treated with kid gloves and no hard questions. Thanks Coin World.
Seems they are using a shotgun (everyone penalized) instead of a rifle, just tell the users to go away. I have never done business with them, and probably never would. They don’t seem genuinely Interested in the numismatic community. I would rather give my money to a business that is immersed in the hobby and appreciates my patronage
@specialist said:
I get it why AMPEX must do that. In the bullion world they do have people shopping widgets to them to get free info. Even better after people get the info for free they go elsewhere to sell. Bravo AMPEX!
perfect line from Moloian:
Too many people use APMEX as a starting point and they (and a lot of dealers) wind up spinning a lot of cycles for people that have no intention (regardless how good or bad the offer is) of selling to them. "They just want to know what its worth" that's called an appraisal, and you should pay for that.
Would you consider looking up a price on grey sheet to be an appraisal? It wouldn't be in my book.
@BAJJERFAN said:
Would you consider looking up a price on grey sheet to be an appraisal? It would'nt be in my book.
I suppose one could pay the $8 for a greysheet and bypass the Apmex $250 appraisal fee. It seems however that some are always expecting something for nothing.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
@BAJJERFAN said:
Would you consider looking up a price on grey sheet to be an appraisal? It would'nt be in my book.
I suppose one could pay the $8 for a greysheet and bypass the Apmex $250 appraisal fee. It seems however that some are always expecting something for nothing.
IMO an appraisal suggests a measure of effort beyond looking up something in a price sheet/guide. Also an appraisal should be at market value/retail and not a sheet/price guide that a dealer would pay.
@BAJJERFAN said:
Would you consider looking up a price on grey sheet to be an appraisal? It would'nt be in my book.
I suppose one could pay the $8 for a greysheet and bypass the Apmex $250 appraisal fee. It seems however that some are always expecting something for nothing.
Does the greysheet give spreads on bullion/slabbed bullion items?
Plus, it's not like I'm asking the dealer to tell me how much it's worth (that I know). I want to know what the dealer/company will offer to pay me.
Appraisals and offers are two very different things.
I would expect to pay for professional expertise rendered in giving an appraisal. I do NOT expect to pay for the privilege of offering to sell my bullion related items to a bullion dealer at some percentage of spot (even if it's a tad higher if it's MS-70 graded bullion).
IMO an appraisal suggests a measure of effort beyond looking up something in a price sheet/guide. Also an appraisal should be at market value/retail and not a sheet/price guide that a dealer would pay.
this is similar to the argument with PCGS when a coin is sent in for "grading" and returned ungraded, with the sentiment being that there should be no charge. the point being that you don't get something for nothing.
I guess I must be missing the point of this whole thread. Why would one need to get an appraisal for bullion, slabbed ms69, ms70 or whatever? Bullion is just that, bullion and it should be rather simple to know it's value.
Now if your talking some rare high grade pre 33 gold pieces I could see where an appraisal may be in order but I would think Apmex would be the last place one would go to sell these types of coins.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
@keets said: IMO an appraisal suggests a measure of effort beyond looking up something in a price sheet/guide. Also an appraisal should be at market value/retail and not a sheet/price guide that a dealer would pay.
this is similar to the argument with PCGS when a coin is sent in for "grading" and returned ungraded, with the sentiment being that there should be no charge. the point being that you don't get something for nothing.
But you do get something - a note of doubtful authenticity or damage that prevents slabbing or it comes back by default in a genuine holder with codes for various problems. This requires expertise. Any one can buy a sheet, look at it, and offer you 40% back of bid or whatever they call it now.
@jclovescoins said:
Note: If it was a $25 fee, I would do it as it sends a signal of being a serious seller. $250 - no way. That is excessive and it is an insult to a repeat customer (whether the policy was recently changed or not). I sold them $30,000 worth of coins in the last 3 months.
Dang.... I bought that much stuff in the past month. I bet the dealers around town buy that much from people daily. A lot of "stuff" is getting dumped in the market, lately. Must be a sign.
@TwoSides2aCoin said:
Dang.... I bought that much stuff in the past month. I bet the dealers around town buy that much from people daily. A lot of "stuff" is getting dumped in the market, lately. Must be a sign.
A sign to be buying not selling.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
@keets said: IMO an appraisal suggests a measure of effort beyond looking up something in a price sheet/guide. Also an appraisal should be at market value/retail and not a sheet/price guide that a dealer would pay.
this is similar to the argument with PCGS when a coin is sent in for "grading" and returned ungraded, with the sentiment being that there should be no charge. the point being that you don't get something for nothing.
I expect that they are using the term appraisal as a matter of convenience.
Here is one definition.
"an assessment or estimation of the worth, value, or quality of a person or thing"
So if I call your shop and ask what an ounce of gold is worth and you say $1320, would you consider that to be an appraisal?
Comments
Never seen an 8% bonus bucks, all I get is 1%.
I agree I now do something like that only my fee is $30.00
I'm tired of tire kickers with a handful of wheat cents and ten Jefferson nickels from tha 50's
Thinking they are worth over $100.00
I think the ATB debacle being referred to is not the pricing, but that APMEX was alleged to have cherrypicked the best ones out of the sets for grading, and the seconds were placed in the original packaging for reselling to those buying the raw sets.
I had thought that put to rest until a few months ago when I purchased a Britannia 2 coin set, one of which was a reverse proof APMEX and British Mint special. The coin was an obvious second or third quality (visible marring without using a glass) and both coins were in a plastic bag, shipped with/but not inside, the mint packaging.
It was not the first set I've seen and that plastic bag was clearly NOT the original packaging. Certainly brought to mind the ATB cherry picking tales from before. Quite a concern that the after market baggie held second rate coins. Again, maybe a simple luck of the draw (though why it was in that extra bag...) but that's when I stopped being a buyer there. Now I'm not a seller either.
I'm stretching my memory a bit, but my recollection is that mint set the max retail price for the 5 or so official resellers. I recall some (like maybe MTB?) were pretty straight forward and sold pretty quickly after receiving them and handled the very high demand about as well as could be expected. And you did not need to be an elite collector or whatever, just one set per household. APMEX was dragging their feet and all indications are that were trying to figure out how to charge more for higher graded coins. After sitting on their inventory much longer than any other reseller, each of the boxes from APMEX had a letter written on it that correlated to how high the grades were. I certainly could have a few minor details wrong, but APMEX was definitely the worst reseller in my opinion.
First you have to catch them being sold in a category that pays the bucks. 8% bonus bucks are worthless if you never get them [which I and some others here] never seem to do. Of course the free shipping and credit card reward points are nice. Of course when you go to resell your gold they are your competition because why would I buy from you even at $30 over and fret shipping when I can buy from them at $10 over and get reward points and better shipping. I sold an AGE last week for $15 over, walked out mit cash and didn't have to sweat risky shipping.
I could use an appraisal on a memorial cent.
The 5 oz pucks are the dumbest looking thing the mint ever made . If that was the only good thing that came out of its right up there with the black plague
The appraisal is free but engraving it onto the cent will cost you $250
That is VERY disturbing. Maybe they shipped all sets to a TPG and these were subpar coins that got cracked out and thrown into baggies for sale to people who wanted OGP. If that is the case it is very unethical. To me, ungraded means ungraded, not rejected.
> First you have to catch them being sold in a category that pays the bucks. 8% bonus bucks are worthless if you never get them [which I and some others here] never seem to do. Of course the free shipping and credit card reward points are nice. Of course when you go to resell your gold they are your competition because why would I buy from you even at $30 over and fret shipping when I can buy from them at $10 over and get reward points and better shipping. I sold an AGE last week for $15 over, walked out mit cash and didn't have to sweat risky shipping.
I agree. For what its worth, I stopped getting the bucks bonus 2 years ago. Last month started new account in wife's name (both accounts still share same paypal but changed the primary email) and those 8-10% bonus bucks are flowing again.
They almost always list non bullion coins outside the bullion category. They have random $10 full eagle PCGS/ NGC MS62 listed at $45 over. Not near as good a deal as the double eagle but if you have the bonus bucks you end up with a slabbed MS coin for $10 under melt.
Didn't want to hijack the ops thread but point is don't sell to apmex but certainly use them to your advantage on buys. I'm much more of a bullion stacker than a rare coin collector although I appreciate both. I think as a bullion stacker APMEX is a good place to buy. As a numismatists not so much.
And I certainly wouldn't attempt to sell an AGE on Ebay. You certainly went the right route.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
Every dealer is either a source to buy from , or a place to sell to.
Even with a small town dealer , about the dumbest thing you can do if you like buying from him is try to sell some of it back. Mark my words if you find out what his spread is you might never go back there again
Funny, every local dealer I ever dealt with I always tried to sell to before buy from. You certainly learn what you are dealing with that way.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
If folks are thinking your company is a benchmark for pricing information, that can't be all bad. Contact with a customer is a great start to a deal. Why all the hand wringing if you don't get every deal or crying over lost time, this is basic 101 business. Seems like servicing the new policy would take more effort than quoting prices.
On another note, how hard is bullion to trade locally? You know the big companies are gonna wail on you.
Same here, always gave free appraisals, because if I can at least get to see it, I have a shot, because so many others are low ballers, but at times, this free appraisal service is abused by folks just wanting to get a value or no intention on seeing to us and just keeping it in family or selling to a family member.
I have never purchased Mint products from a big dealer without assuming they had been cherry picked. Don't they all do it...maybe I'm cynical?
When people who think they are the smart money find out they aren't it hurts their self image.
If you are going to be a flipper of modern mint dreck you have to get in at the issue price. knowing the pucks were going to be issued through the AP and you would have to buy through that middleman the smart play was to sit it out. The puck drama was pure FOMO
Seems like @APMEX_Official should chime in and do some damage control here, or at least see that you are angering customers with your new policy.
Or maybe @APMEX ,or @APMEXOfficial, or @APMEXPreciousMetals
I'm assuming these are all legitimate Apmex accounts.
Collector, occasional seller
The difference with the proof Britannia set was that they were numbered sets. xxx/500. In this case I would expect that the coins that came in the box remained the same, without getting swapped out. Not like some random bullion or unnumbered set. Need a shrug emoji here. Like I said , not buying more and the appeal of ‘collectible bullion’ has lost its shine anyway. Some of the Britannia’s are pretty gorgeous for modern stuff, but not if the British Royal Mint is going to offer something solely through one vendor.
It reminded me to a local beauty shop who charge $5 EACH time a customer tried on their selection of wigs or an eBay seller with 20% restocking return fee. I can see the point from both side.
There is no simple luck of the draw when you grooming your business.....
It's because they don't own the coin. The majority of their better inventory is consigned to them by others now, so they don't have access to the coin or the image unless they sell it...
Are the big bullion dealers doing the volume they did a few years ago?
I would guess that this policy is just a way for them to control costs on lower volumes. They may have decided they want lower costs and fewer but higher quality sellers.
Could make sense for them, the downside is they will get fewer deals offered to them, but it seems like maybe they are positioning themselves as more of a retailer than a market maker. It will be interesting to see how this new policy works out over time.
What some of the people at Apmex have been saying is that they simply realize that they can't make enough money doing bullion...so, they think that they struck gold in offering everyone else's coins on their website that doesn't cost them anything...it's a great idea, except that they lack in numismatists and can't really serve true collectors in this manner.
69-S double die?
my Boss typically charges a refundable $50 appraisal fee whenever someone comes in with a large "collection" they want to sell, borne from experience. the OP's story is probably an excessive example/amount, but it's probably because of what has happened with customers coming to APMEX. time is money.
I have had several instances where people straight out lie when asked "Are you intending to sell or did you just want an appraisal?" and say they want to sell. then after up to an hour of going through everything with two of us they will say "OK, I'll get back to you." it's called shopping around and if/when they come back our offer is always lower, we call it a-hole tax.
one time after doing that and having a 3-4 page priced inventory list I had a customer ask me if he could have the list.
APMEX? I think they will be, but like any big business their profit will ebb and flow...sometimes due to poor business decisions.
Same fee for one coin or a thousand coins?
In the past. I’ve sold approximately 15K worth of moderns to them. 2014 was my last. I sold a small amount of coins to them (2K) and accidently put a roll of 2002 silver eagles in the box with the rest of the coins. When I noticed the error from for pictures I took and notified them ASAP. Manager he would keep a lookout for the package. A week went by and heard nothing. I called back told him of the error (again) and said he would get back to me. A couple of days passed and nothing. When I refreshed his memory (again), he said look! We have cameras and I didn’t the additional roll in the box, I’m very sorry. That was the last time I used them. I have the picture with the roll in the box so how could it be in the box and missing the same day. Did I mention silver was at 28.xx something an ounce. ive and learn I guess.
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from their website today
DO YOU CHARGE A RECEIVING FEE?
No, when you sell your items to us there are no hidden charges. The prices quoted are the prices we will pay.
ARE THERE ANY OTHER HIDDEN FEES FOR SELLING TO APMEX?
No, there are no hidden fees for selling your items to us. It's just that simple.
That's actually true. There is no fee for selling to them. There is a fee for asking for an appraisal and NOT selling to them.
Ah yes, that would be the infamous "APMEX A-Bombs" issue. APMEX coded their boxes of ATB's, the "A" boxes were all the culls. There were some here with the opinion that certain customers - perhaps infrequent or new - got the "APMEX A-Bombs" while more frequent customers got the 70's. No matter, clearly they marked boxes based on the grade of coins in them and well if you got one of the boxes with culls weren't too happy and had to wonder why. I can't recall if APMEX ever addressed the issue and the thread is a bit long.
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/797035/apmex-is-selling-the-5oz-atb-coins-right-now-1-395-per-5-coin-set-sold-out-mtb-selling-on-eba/p1
Good will goes far in the business world. The law firm I worked for would offer free consultations and there would always be a couple of people that would abuse it. They always called to seemingly waste our time with trivial matters until one day, a local mailman became grossly intoxicated and hit one of them. Despite potential governmental immunities, the case was a slam dunk and it more paid for those short phone calls over the years. I learned a lot from the so called Drunk Mailman Rule: Don’t tinkle where you eat.
This principle seemingly applies here... Those people with junk 90% percent silver and common wheat cents could surprise you one day and may not know what they have. Many would feel foolish if snobbery kept them from acquiring truly rare coins. I would love to find a rare die marriage from early federal coinage that might otherwise be very “common” in lower grades. Also remember the circulated 1894-S branch mint proof Barber dime or recovered lost 1913 proof Liberty Head Nickel? I have had low quality material offered to me from others too; however, I am always polite and willing to give a few minutes of my time.
I get it why AMPEX must do that. In the bullion world they do have people shopping widgets to them to get free info. Even better after people get the info for free they go elsewhere to sell. Bravo AMPEX!
perfect line from Moloian:
Too many people use APMEX as a starting point and they (and a lot of dealers) wind up spinning a lot of cycles for people that have no intention (regardless how good or bad the offer is) of selling to them. "They just want to know what its worth" that's called an appraisal, and you should pay for that.
They addressed it kinda sorta in a way. When interviewed by Coin World they denied marking boxes with righteous indignation. The interviewer followed up with more softball questions ignoring the evidence provided to them by members of this forum proving the accusations were true. I guess advertisers get treated with kid gloves and no hard questions. Thanks Coin World.
Seems they are using a shotgun (everyone penalized) instead of a rifle, just tell the users to go away. I have never done business with them, and probably never would. They don’t seem genuinely Interested in the numismatic community. I would rather give my money to a business that is immersed in the hobby and appreciates my patronage
Would you consider looking up a price on grey sheet to be an appraisal? It wouldn't be in my book.
I suppose one could pay the $8 for a greysheet and bypass the Apmex $250 appraisal fee. It seems however that some are always expecting something for nothing.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
An appraisal I will paying for. Asking a dealer what he will pay for my coins not a chance.
Martin
IMO an appraisal suggests a measure of effort beyond looking up something in a price sheet/guide. Also an appraisal should be at market value/retail and not a sheet/price guide that a dealer would pay.
Does the greysheet give spreads on bullion/slabbed bullion items?
Plus, it's not like I'm asking the dealer to tell me how much it's worth (that I know). I want to know what the dealer/company will offer to pay me.
Appraisals and offers are two very different things.
I would expect to pay for professional expertise rendered in giving an appraisal. I do NOT expect to pay for the privilege of offering to sell my bullion related items to a bullion dealer at some percentage of spot (even if it's a tad higher if it's MS-70 graded bullion).
To play devil’s advocate, do you submit to CAC? Isn’t this sort of what CAC does at $14.50 or $29 per coin but for PQ coins?
IMO an appraisal suggests a measure of effort beyond looking up something in a price sheet/guide. Also an appraisal should be at market value/retail and not a sheet/price guide that a dealer would pay.
this is similar to the argument with PCGS when a coin is sent in for "grading" and returned ungraded, with the sentiment being that there should be no charge. the point being that you don't get something for nothing.
I guess I must be missing the point of this whole thread. Why would one need to get an appraisal for bullion, slabbed ms69, ms70 or whatever? Bullion is just that, bullion and it should be rather simple to know it's value.
Now if your talking some rare high grade pre 33 gold pieces I could see where an appraisal may be in order but I would think Apmex would be the last place one would go to sell these types of coins.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
But you do get something - a note of doubtful authenticity or damage that prevents slabbing or it comes back by default in a genuine holder with codes for various problems. This requires expertise. Any one can buy a sheet, look at it, and offer you 40% back of bid or whatever they call it now.
Walmart needs a coin department.
Dang.... I bought that much stuff in the past month. I bet the dealers around town buy that much from people daily. A lot of "stuff" is getting dumped in the market, lately. Must be a sign.
A sign to be buying not selling.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
I expect that they are using the term appraisal as a matter of convenience.
Here is one definition.
"an assessment or estimation of the worth, value, or quality of a person or thing"
So if I call your shop and ask what an ounce of gold is worth and you say $1320, would you consider that to be an appraisal?