Barber Half Pop analysis F,VF,XF,AU
amwldcoin
Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭
Thought it would be interesting to do this since I'm a Barbernut! Should be some eye openers for some!
Trying to make the report just show. I don't understand why the forum has to scrunch everything up. Sure is pretty when I view it in edit mode! 
If you can open an excel or word file I have them attached below.
F12-15 VF20-35 XF40-45 AU50-58
1903 18 1892-O 41 1905-O 19 1897-O 15
1892 20 1892 43 1897-O 21 1901-O 19
1894 22 1893 48 1905 22 1896-O 29
1895-S 22 1905 50 1910 22 1904-O 31
1898 22 1893-O 51 1909-O 24 1913-S 31
1900 24 1894 55 1893-S 25 1898-O 33
1900-S 24 1905-O 55 1895-S 25 1897-S 35
1895 25 1892-S 56 1906-S 27 1903-S 36
1902 25 1906-S 56 1911-D 27 1896-S 37
1908 25 1896 58 1894 29 1911-S 37
1893 26 1902-S 58 1895-O 29 1901-S 38
1902-S 27 1897 59 1911-S 29 1902-S 38
1911 27 1893-S 60 1913-S 29 1905-O 38
1897 28 1895 60 1896-S 30 1907-S 38
1899-S 29 1913-D 60 1909-S 30 1908-S 40
1896 30 1895-S 61 1899-O 32 1904-S 45
1913-D 30 1903 61 1901-O 32 1896 47
1894-O 31 1898-O 62 1914 32 1909-O 47
1907 31 1901-O 63 1904-O 33 1913 47
1904 32 1901-S 63 1893 34 1915 47
1893-O 33 1908 65 1902-S 34 1895-S 48
1893-S 33 1900-S 66 1915 34 1909-S 48
1903-S 33 1907-S 66 1896 35 1899-O 51
1892-O 34 1897-O 67 1897-S 35 1906-O 52
1892-S 35 1899-O 68 1898-O 35 1898-S 53
1901 35 1904-O 69 1910-S 35 1900-O 53
1903-O 35 1899-S 70 1913 35 1902-O 53
1907-D 37 1911-D 70 1904-S 36 1914 57
1902-O 38 1903-O 72 1907 37 1895-O 59
1905 39 1910 72 1908 37 1906-S 59
1911-D 39 1903-S 74 1908-S 37 1910 61
1894-S 40 1894-O 81 1892-O 38 1914-S 61
1908-D 40 1898 82 1896-O 39 1905-S 62
1896-S 41 1902-O 84 1893-O 40 1903-O 64
1906-D 41 1906-O 84 1895 40 1899-S 65
1907-O 41 1904-S 85 1906-O 40 1903 67
1906 42 1908-S 87 1907-S 40 1905 67
1906-S 43 1897-S 88 1913-D 41 1894-O 69
1904-O 46 1904 89 1892-S 44 1912-S 71
1906-O 46 1895-O 91 1894-O 45 1911-D 72
1895-O 47 1898-S 91 1903-S 45 1894 73
1899-O 47 1900 91 1906 45 1893-S 75
1898-S 49 1907 91 1900-O 46 1910-S 75
1912 51 1913 91 1905-S 46 1892-S 84
1900-O 52 1896-O 93 1903-O 47 1908 86
1905-S 53 1909-O 94 1912 47 1894-S 92
1913-S 53 1900-O 96 1902-O 48 1893-O 93
1899 54 1914 98 1912-S 49 1908-O 95
1898-O 58 1894-S 99 1897 51 1898 110
1914-S 58 1896-S 100 1898-S 51 1897 111
1896-O 59 1911 100 1901-S 51 1900-S 113
1901-S 59 1915 100 1894-S 53 1904 117
1908-S 61 1906 101 1903 54 1913-D 117
1910 61 1907-D 104 1911 54 1895 120
1901-O 64 1901 110 1907-O 55 1907-O 125
1907-S 64 1906-D 110 1898 59 1911 127
1911-S 64 1913-S 111 1899-S 59 1912 132
1905-O 65 1905-S 112 1914-S 61 1906 135
1912-D 68 1914-S 112 1909 64 1907 138
1897-O 70 1909-S 114 1906-D 70 1909 141
1908-O 72 1899 117 1892 71 1915-S 146
1910-S 75 1910-S 120 1902 75 1902 151
1912-S 76 1908-D 127 1904 75 1892-O 152
1915-D 81 1915-D 127 1907-D 75 1907-D 158
1897-S 86 1907-O 128 1901 82 1908-D 158
1909-S 88 1912 130 1908-D 82 1900 160
1904-S 90 1909 143 1900 83 1893 170
1913 92 1911-S 145 1908-O 85 1906-D 174
1909 94 1902 154 1915-D 88 1899 179
1915-S 105 1912-S 161 1900-S 91 1901 185
1909-O 106 1908-O 173 1912-D 94 1912-D 219
1914 112 1912-D 184 1899 100 1915-D 262
1915 170 1915-S 218 1915-S 102 1892 442
Comments
Certainly for me. I am surprised by the grade distributions, particularly by the fact that coins in VF grades are much more common than ones in XF grades (but then the numbers for AU coins go up).
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
Are you a member of Barber Coin Collectors' Society (BCCS) (Barbercoins.org)? Here is an older census (2007) of what collectors have reported;
http://www.barbercoins.org/Barber-Halves-Census.shtml
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
I am a member of the BCCS and am aware of the census. There are some patterns that can be followed. In lower grades the pops are higher for the keys as they have been submitted much longer than other dates.
The interesting anomaly for me is the high Pops in F for the 1909 dates. The easy explanation is many send in expecting VF's because the Liberty is so strong but don't realize you have to grade 09's by the reverse.
Great job, very interesting. What I find surprising in the AU column is the rarity of the '04 O compard to the '04 S. The '04 S sells for 4X the money!
Another oddity is that the '93 S (key date) in AU is much more common than the '14 S (fairly common).
I'm fairly confident the pops are low on the Fine grades because the value of the coin for most dates doesn't make them worthwhile getting them graded.
Yeah,the 04-S is the biggest overated date. It's 16th in the AU column and worse in the others!
I think the numbers start to settle down as far as an accurate account in the VF and up grades. Then you run into the problem of crackouts in the AU grades. I'm sure there are many common date F's out in the wild raw.
Good work Darrell. Very interesting. Confirms the 04-S is the most overrated and overpriced coin in the series. I believe the 97-O in XF-AU is the most difficult coin to locate. It is available in MS, I believe a roll or so was saved.
But in high grade circ. you better have some patience. And forget the price guides. Really enjoyed looking it over. I still am looking for a nice original AU 15-S. From the survey I should have found it by now. Funny that it is one of the three coins I'm still needing. Well the hunt is half the fun. Thank you Darrell.
Jim
Exactly what I'm finding in finishing my set in Fine with the 92P, 94P and 95S being among the last I need, even raw.
Nice to see the old 05O is still the king in XF.
One should be careful as to how these raw data points are interpreted.
Some dates were always valuable and so will have been sent in at a far greater frequency than dates that aren't valuable; additionally, some dates see a large bump in value or price between grading points and such coins are more likely to be sent in multiple times (crack-outs) in order to receive the bump in grade and value; lastly, the wholesale certification of circulated Barber half dollars is a more recent phenomena in numismatics so these numbers have not fully shaken out yet.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Is that a paraphrase for what I said above in a few posts?
I agree to a certain extent Tom. Certainly resubmission's affect pop reports.But I don't think there are many raw high grade cerc. 97-O out there. Auction records also back up the my point on the availability of the 04-S compared to the 97-O. I haven't been swayed yet from my opinion on the 97-O being the most difficult XF-AU coin to acquire. Of course everyone's own personal experience also affects their opinion on what is a tough coin to find.An interesting discussion. I appreciate your obvious expertise.
Jim
I don't believe the crackouts are too big a concern until you hit the AU grades. I believe there are certainly some higher pops for some of the better dates than there actually are. Probably true for XF45's also as there is a good jump from XF-AU moneywise also.
Below XF45 there are some....as I have a number of tags,some I cracked myself and others from collectors who cracked and gave me the tag when I purchased the coin. There is only 1 biggie that I have. It would move the date up several notches into 1st place!
There is no doubt that the 97-O is king in grades XF and AU!
I did a similar study a little over 4 years ago. I didn't give out pop numbers, but did list the top 15 for VF, XF, AU and MS. In that short period, the pops have grown about 33% roughly. When I did this study there was about 29k graded total. Today there are 39k graded total.
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/869171/having-fun-with-pcgs-population-reports-barber-halves#latest
Going back about 20 years - when I started working on ( God only knows which set of Halves )
my all time finest set, there was only ONE 1904-S in AU. ONE !!!! It was a PCGS AU 55.
I bought it from Peter Shireman who had just purchased his MS 63.
When word got out that I had paid $3000 for the coin, the flood gates opened. Within a
short period of time the POP's jumped by at least 5 or 6 in AU 55. In less than a year, an
AU 58 was certified - and I bought that one as well, still keeping the 55. If memory serves
me correctly, the 58 cost me $3750 from HLRC. I eventually sold him my 55 for what I paid
Peter.
When my Barber collections sold in 8/2011, Barry Sunshine bought my 04-S in 58 for a
Hammer Price of $15,000. Barry's son, David has been looking to sell it for approx. $9500,
and found no takers, so it was consigned to Legend XX sale.... Not sure what it ended
selling for ( their estimate was $9000 ).
Regardless of what you think of the 04-S, it's always been a key date, especially in MS;
followed closely with the 96-O. Check the pop reports for more info.
For what it's worth, I fully agree, the 97-O in 40-58 is hands down the # 1 toughest
to locate. Over the last 6 years, the nicest I could find was my 30 - which recently sold
at FUN Heritage auction. I got so frustrated trying to find an AU 50-53, I threw up my
hands and said "Enough " !!! It was the deciding factor in selling off 90% of my halves.
( PLUG: Heritage auctions end this weekend - 1/29 & 1/31 - for the majority of my Halves ).
Bid early and often.
The Everyman set has manipulated the AU 58 ( 58+) prices. Being top dog in the small
pond is still being the top dog, in a manner of speaking. I was very pleased to hear from
Brad the other day, he had sent me a list of over a dozen AU 58+'s that he picked up from
my old AU 58's ( ex: 8/2011). I have the list in my den, and I and the iPad are having coffee
watching my friends trying to hit a little white ball into a cup.
I'm still plugging away on my three sets of V Nickels - try finding an 1889 in AU 58 !!
I have an 1889 grading set of MS "60-66" .... And Proofs "63-66".... ( FYI: My grandfather's
Birth year )
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
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Darrell...many thanks for your efforts in getting the chart assembled.
I found it very informative - not so much in the 30+ categories, but in the
lower grades.
I agree completely about the 1909 - you do need to grade it by the Reverse.
Excellent point and reminder.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
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Which is why I held back selling my PCGS XF 45 w/ CAC.
It has been called the epitome of 45's my different Barber
collectors.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
Mike! You need to check the pop reports. The 96-O is undeniably much more difficult than the 04-S.
96-O 29 AU's and 24 MS's
04-S 45 AU's and 36 MS's
Even allowing for a generous amount of crackouts I can't see how the 04-S is tougher. Both of these dates have probably seen the majority graded as well in my opinion!
Darrell... My bad - I knew the 96-O in MS is the tougher one....
BTW - have you checked out my old 04-S at Legend ?
At $5750 - its the steal of the decade ! If I didn't have
my Real Estate Taxes and Home Owners Insurance due
next month - I might have considered getting it back.
Yet, it did not CAC when I auctioned it off in 2011....
Guess, I'm getting picky in my dotage
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
Somebody bid on it!
It's worth much more than $5750!
Sunshine Rare Coins
sunshinecoins.com/store/c1/Featured_Products.html
You would think consignor's would learn where to sell nice Barber 1/2's! The 97-S in 58+ flew under the radar for sure. I didn't find out about it until the day before the auction. I am not registered with Legend. I didn't feel like jumping through hoops for the coin when I feel mine is nicer. I'll have to look at the 04-S.
David,wasn't that your father's 04-S that just sold at heritage? It also went cheap.
That was the NFC coin. Mine sells tonight at Legend.
Sunshine Rare Coins
sunshinecoins.com/store/c1/Featured_Products.html
Good Luck David! Be interesting to see how it does. NFC's sold for 1/2 what they were asking for it! I know their pictures made it look horrible...not quite as bad looking in the heritage pictures(that's why I didn't recoknize it!). While my 04-S has some tiny spots in the devices, It is PL and doesn't have as many marks as yours. Not a player here.
Very interesting, thanks for sharing. Always looking for nice Barbers.
David, as I mentioned, I'd love to buy it back -however I stretched too far at FUN
and my other major expenses are always due in late January / February.
My best to your Dad, Barry. Keeping my fingers crossed for both of you on the
Legend Sale tonight.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases