<< <i>I am not going to contact my local PD, I am going to contact his local sheriff's office and the postal inspector. >>
The problem here is you can't really prove where the crime occurred. I've been here, done that. The ONLY reason I got my $ back was i used regular paypal (paid a fee) and they realized the guy was lying. My police reports helped me, but both citys basically said there was absoultely nothing they could do and I had the USPS Post master witness me opening the return package (he sent back empty boxes)
<< <i>I am not going to contact my local PD, I am going to contact his local sheriff's office and the postal inspector. >>
The problem here is you can't really prove where the crime occurred. I've been here, done that. The ONLY reason I got my $ back was i used regular paypal (paid a fee) and they realized the guy was lying. My police reports helped me, but both citys basically said there was absoultely nothing they could do and I had the USPS Post master witness me opening the return package (he sent back empty boxes) >>
You don't think, in a situation like this, and with the chance that the offending person is reading all this, that your comments wouldn't have been better served being a PM rather than a public post? To me, it would have.
I have a lot of evidence of his lies from prior threads, things on other forums, my video, the package contents, his excuses to mail, etc. I trust that the justice system will be able to help.
I can't believe that after finally going away, the timbuk3 thread and story is now back. He was bumping that thing to the top for weeks or decades even!
<< <i>I have a lot of evidence of his lies from prior threads, things on other forums, my video, the package contents, his excuses to mail, etc. I trust that the justice system will be able to help. >>
WoW .. good that someone has confidence in any justice system , especially when it comes down to something like this. Id ask again , do you think the police will really have time for this , he said she said i videoed this and sent money blindly. . or do we expect the cops to be out there doing what they need to be doing. This was preventable , the minute you hit friends and family send , your goose was cooked.
What did his references say when you checked with them before making the purchase? I'm assuming he had good references since you decided you didn't need paypal protection. If you didn't get references and check them you are somewhat responsible for your predicament.
Postal inspectors are your best chance.
"A car is a tool that takes you from one place to another. Everything beyond that is a payment for other people's perception of you."
<< <i>What did his references say when you checked with them before making the purchase? I'm assuming he had good references since you decided you didn't need paypal protection. If you didn't get references and check them you are somewhat responsible for your predicament.
“A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly."
Postal inspectors got my money back a couple of years ago and put the guy in front of a federal judge. They were even kind enough to follow up and let me know he won a year free room and board.
"A car is a tool that takes you from one place to another. Everything beyond that is a payment for other people's perception of you."
I'm sorry to hear about this thievery, some people really do suck!! I hope ya get your money back and you share the name of the thief that ripped you off.
The bitterness of "Poor Quality" is remembered long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
<< <i>What did his references say when you checked with them before making the purchase? I'm assuming he had good references since you decided you didn't need paypal protection. If you didn't get references and check them you are somewhat responsible for your predicament.
Postal inspectors are your best chance. >>
The sellers "references" in his sig were along the lines of too many to mention , and a join date of 2014.
As soon as you became aware this seller had no problem ripping off Paypal (by using their services without paying them their rightful due/fees) it should have become also obvious he wouldn't have a problem taking advantage of you.
When he finds out your legal recourse is a waste of time and money, he prolly won't pay... It's always best to out here in public and you win or lose... Same for him ...
Lake Elmo, MN seems to be a very small town east of Minneapolis...The local police know this person as the town is small enough he/she knows everyone. I'll bet he has a history in that town. You just might get some help from the local police department. I know my Son and his family live in a small town in N. Dakota and the police there know everything about everybody. The met my son the day he moved to the town...introduced themselves. Just a good way of keeping the peace and be prepared for any "new" problems in town.
bob
Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
Makes me wonder if someone else is waiting to find out they got ripped off on the 1895-S in XF-40 that allegedly was sold by the same member three days before the sale of the two Carson City coins that never made it to the OP of this thread.
<< <i>Makes me wonder if someone else is waiting to find out they got ripped off on the 1895-S in XF-40 that allegedly was sold by the same member three days before the sale of the two Carson City coins that never made it to the OP of this thread. >>
Coming to a post near you soon .. no doubt , it's amazing how long the BST has been a free for all , two new members , both 2014 and headlines in the US coin forum " I paid by gift...now what?" ..
<< <i>Makes me wonder if someone else is waiting to find out they got ripped off on the 1895-S in XF-40 that allegedly was sold by the same member three days before the sale of the two Carson City coins that never made it to the OP of this thread. >>
I was hoping that was a "fake sale" on the part of the scam artist, to make it look like he'd done some transactions before going for the real score.
<< <i>Coming to a post near you soon .. no doubt , it's amazing how long the BST has been a free for all , two new members , both 2014 and headlines in the US coin forum " I paid by gift...now what?" .. >>
Stuff like this didn't happen when good ole SM1 was still the sheriff
To Err Is Human.... To Collect Err's Is Just Too Much Darn Tootin Fun!
We all know that PCGS officers don't have the time or inclination to babysit the BST. Best rule of participation there is "Caveat Emptor". Let's not let the benefit of gratis use of the BST go the same way that the Open Forum went. I'm not casting aspersions on those who participate elsewhere now in what once was the Open Forum, but it could conceivably become the same fate of the BST if members don't think before acting.
<< <i>I took a video showing the front and back of the package before it was opened. I cut it with a scissors and it was shown at all times. I showed there was nothing else inside the package. I opened up the cardboard the coins were inside and showed them on the camera. Everything was seen as I looked at it on the camera.[/]
The video is worthless. Anyone could carefully open the package before videoing, and retape the package, then video "the opening".
No they couldn't. Not the way he did it. And furthermore, the weight of the package didn't support there being 2oz. in it. His postal receipt would show that. I have everything I need to prove a case.
I DO NOT appreciate what you are insinuating. The manner in which you are handling this makes me feel like I am being harassed and basically publically humiliated. I received your THREATENING emails and I chose not to respond to those emails...because they are just that....threatening. I feel like I must respond here, even though I do not feel it should feel forced I feel that I must...key word MUST reply on this forum due to your allegations, your public posts here on the Collectors Universe Forum as well as other member's posts, who are totally not involved in this but being the kind of hobby this is feels as though they must *try to help. Your THREATENING emails are and the manner in which you have conducted yourself throughout this entire ordeal...which as of right now is short in time as it just started this afternoon is not typically the type of behavior I respond to for a number of reasons but again...I feel like I am being publicly harassed and these public posts by you are slanderous. I know what I shipped to you, I know what was in that package, I know how much you paid for them, I also am aware that you are asking for more in return, I know the package was in fact delivered, I know what condition the package was in when I sent it. I do not know what this video you speak of consists. I do not know you personally but I do know I did NOT...I REPEAT DID NOT send you anything else OTHER than what we agreed on. Now, I want you to be made aware that I have myself contacted MY local law enforcement...which is my local Sheriff's Office as your threatening emails naturally concerned me. I spoke with a Deputy and explained the details....details that we BOTH would agree is correct. Which basically is I say that you paid me X amount for two specific coins. I mailed those coins to you. You state that you did not receive those coins but did receive other misc. modern coins. You are now demanding a "refund". The amount you are demanding is more than you paid. So, sum it up...you claim that I did not ship you what you paid for and for what we agreed on. After I advised the Deputy of the these facts she then advised me that this "ordeal" is in fact not a law enforcement matter but in fact is a CIVIL MATTER. I also want to advise you that I am going to provide you with the name AND badge number of the Deputy I spoke with as well as a case number in a PRIVATE email as I do not believe that information needs to be posted all over this forum because as of right now...this is a unfortunate "He said", "He did". Or didn't for that matter. Even though I wish for others not to take sides and totally assume its naturally going to happen. I do wish to say that just because I was the seller does not and should not automatically make me the one who is in the wrong. Again...I shouldn't have felt obligated to respond to these public postings but I do. I do not take kindly to your demeanor. It seems to me, by your demeanor that we are beyond any kind of resolution between you and I alone. I can appreciate the fact that those who posted trying to provide their guidance even if it was not in my favor...I can understand why. I am asking that you STOP posting any details of this manner on this forum and refer to your attorney. I feel I have been slandered far too much as it is and feel as though I, and my name can not overcome the false assumptions and surely all adverse future implications that will occur as a direct and purposeful result of your actions on this forum. Simply put, I did not post slanderous...or rather anything whatsoever involving this event. I did not accuse you of anything as it could be just as easy for me to turn it totally around on you. I am extremely unhappy with everything regarding this event. I have nothing further to say on this forum regarding this manner and again ask you to stop posting anything negative about me on this forum. You can expect an email soon with the information I advised that I would provide you.
<< <i>No they couldn't. Not the way he did it. And furthermore, the weight of the package didn't support there being 2oz. in it. His postal receipt would show that. I have everything I need to prove a case. >>
And now all you need is someone/anyone who is interested enough to take your case seriously.
That, sadly, may prove to be more difficult than the evidence gathering was.
<< <i>I DO NOT appreciate what you are insinuating. The manner in which you are handling this makes me feel like I am being harassed and basically publically humiliated. I received your THREATENING emails and I chose not to respond to those emails...because they are just that....threatening. I feel like I must respond here, even though I do not feel it should feel forced I feel that I must...key word MUST reply on this forum due to your allegations, your public posts here on the Collectors Universe Forum as well as other member's posts, who are totally not involved in this but being the kind of hobby this is feels as though they must *try to help. Your THREATENING emails are and the manner in which you have conducted yourself throughout this entire ordeal.
Which as of right now is short in time as it just started this afternoon is not typically the type of behavior I respond to for a number of reasons but again...I feel like I am being publicly harassed and these public posts by you are slanderous. I know what I shipped to you, I know what was in that package, I know how much you paid for them, I also am aware that you are asking for more in return, I know the package was in fact delivered, I know what condition the package was in when I sent it.
I do not know what this video you speak of consists. I do not know you personally but I do know I did NOT...I REPEAT DID NOT send you anything else OTHER than what we agreed on. Now, I want you to be made aware that I have myself contacted MY local law enforcement...which is my local Sheriff's Office as your threatening emails naturally concerned me. I spoke with a Deputy and explained the details....details that we BOTH would agree is correct. Which basically is I say that you paid me X amount for two specific coins. I mailed those coins to you. You state that you did not receive those coins but did receive other misc. modern coins. You are now demanding a "refund". The amount you are demanding is more than you paid.
So, sum it up...you claim that I did not ship you what you paid for and for what we agreed on. After I advised the Deputy of the these facts she then advised me that this "ordeal" is in fact not a law enforcement matter but in fact is a CIVIL MATTER. I also want to advise you that I am going to provide you with the name AND badge number of the Deputy I spoke with as well as a case number in a PRIVATE email as I do not believe that information needs to be posted all over this forum because as of right now...this is a unfortunate "He said", "He did". Or didn't for that matter. Even though I wish for others not to take sides and totally assume its naturally going to happen. I do wish to say that just because I was the seller does not and should not automatically make me the one who is in the wrong.
Again...I shouldn't have felt obligated to respond to these public postings but I do. I do not take kindly to your demeanor. It seems to me, by your demeanor that we are beyond any kind of resolution between you and I alone. I can appreciate the fact that those who posted trying to provide their guidance even if it was not in my favor...I can understand why. I am asking that you STOP posting any details of this manner on this forum and refer to your attorney. I feel I have been slandered far too much as it is and feel as though I, and my name can not overcome the false assumptions and surely all adverse future implications that will occur as a direct and purposeful result of your actions on this forum. Simply put, I did not post slanderous...or rather anything whatsoever involving this event. I did not accuse you of anything as it could be just as easy for me to turn it totally around on you. I am extremely unhappy with everything regarding this event.
I have nothing further to say on this forum regarding this manner and again ask you to stop posting anything negative about me on this forum. You can expect an email soon with the information I advised that I would provide you. >>
I broke this down (without altering the content whatsoever) to make it easier to read. With that stated, it is still not easy to believe.
Here is our exchange once he failed to provide me tracking on the forum, I emailed his Paypal email:
John -
Can you please supply me with the tracking number for the two Morgans? Thank you
His response:
yeah I'm real sorry Joe I had my buddy do it today because I had to work and unfortunately he still hasn't paid his cell phone bill yet... which he should have because that's what I gave him money for to ship those out to you for me. Yea he kinda a d bag. I stopped by his place but he wasn't there apparently he was at his parents house. I'll get a hold of them one way or another and get it
I send him next:
Can you please get this out Monday because I was going to send them to NGC with another shipment? Thank you.
I'm starting to get a bit concerned. Who has the coins now? If he has them and you cant ship them Monday, then please just send me a refund.
He says:
Don't worry he has them because he was going to send them off for me because I start work before the P.O. opens and till after it closes. He shoulda sent it that next day but for whatever reason didn't so if im gonna just get the package and be late to work Monday to send em out. I apologize for the BS this isn't the way I EVER do business
I say:
No pr9blem. Please send me a tracking number today. Thanks!
He replies:
Ok he sent me the tracking # on my phone. 9114901230803073283196 Lemme know if it doesn't work in case he made an error in the # or in case I did. I apologize for the delay I wish I could have just taken care of it myself but I hit the gym at around 345-4a then I start work at 630a and am never off before 5…usually 6-7p Im the lead recovery guy and we are always so busy with State Patrol Airport PD and numerous other PD agencies not to mention all the other accts and for the public that I don't get a lunch…maybe a chuckwagon if I can get to a store while I use the head but I usually don't eat till I get home as it gets $$. This guy…he is a friend but he has some issues and im helping him as much as I can but he has been more and more unreliable but he was basically my only choice to get that sent out to ya. He wasn't always this way so im hoping I/we can get him back to his roots. Again thanks for your patience. Gotta go gotta get back to work...YAYYYYYYYYYYYY lucky me
I say:
Thank you! Looking forward to receiving these two Morgans! Looks like your 20 cent piece was delivered today! That's dedication hitting the gym at 4am.
He says:
I was hoping so but I didn't get anything in the mail besides bills. Im curious to why it states delivered. Damn..im having a bad day/week. Well heres to it being here tomorrow??
I say:
I strongly suggest you mail me the two Morgan dollars: 78-CC and 81-CC. The package that I just received was video taped while being opened and was not messed with in any way. It has two nickels, a quarter, another quarter in a holder and a presidential dollar in a holder. The police in Lake Elmo, MN will be contacted tomorrow morning if I am not refunded $750 USD to my Paypal account by 9am tomorrow morning.
*** The twenty cent piece I sent him clearly shows delivered and he claims he never received anything. Not only that but he claims his friend mailed my package back and forth in between saying he would mail it.
Yeah, that email log would induce dread into any normal person.
He trusts his friend who "has some issues ... more and more unreliable" to ship you the stuff, and has no time to do it himself? If this was for real, he should not be selling.... More likely, it's a false story, which constructs an excuse for him when the items do not show up or are incorrect....
In the old days when I bought gold on eBay, I always opened it in my office in front of Lonnie my mail carrier. Seems like a good time to start double checking references and use straight PP.
This seller had email exchanges with me. If he is a LEO, St Elmo is in deep kimshi.
If a seller won't accept straight PayPal, add it to the price.
Might be time to start digging a little dirt before you go to the Postmaster. Ask him to provide purchase receipts for the images he is offering. Credit checks are cheap. Police inquiries at his residence?
Nothing that I have said is threatening in any way. I told you very clearly that you had until 9am tomorrow morning (26th) to send me a refund for $750. This is the correct amount because it represents the $600 I sent you via Paypal and the $150 that we agreed the 20 cent piece that I sent you was worth. Since you sent me $1.60 in change, the amount can be reduced to $748.40.
Material facts are not slander. And yes, my tone changed entirely because I am an unassuming and trusting person that was taken advantage of. Now it is time to make sure no one else is victimized and to be made whole.
I'm glad you have already started this investigation, and I assume when I call tomorrow morning they will already have your information? That will be great and make this easier for me.
<< <i>Yeah, that email log would induce dread into any normal person.
He trusts his friend who "has some issues ... more and more unreliable" to ship you the stuff, and has no time to do it himself? If this was for real, he should not be selling.... More likely, it's a false story, which constructs an excuse for him when the items do not show up or are incorrect.... >>
Plenty of excuses in the seller's emails regarding why he couldn't mail the coins himself.
BIG red flag for me.
I haven't done business with Joe (jclovescoins) but I have corresponded with him back and forth and have found him courteous, professional and very knowledgeable.
I don't get the same 'feeling' for the seller by reading his emails.
Can't mail the coins because you're going to the gym and who gets a 'friend' to mail an important and valuable item?
Take responsibility and mail it yourself.
"Gold is money, and nothing else" (JP Morgan, 1912)
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
This is my last posting regarding this matter. I shouldn't feel like I do not have a choice but to respond on this forum. You have succeeded in slandering my name. Expect action. You continue to post on this forum doesn't make anything...any of this any easier for anybody more even so yourself. I do not know if you enjoy posting this matter EVERYWHERE before it is substantiated but it is ridiculous. STOP. Keep it between the people who are involved. I am a party that is involved in this. You are a party that is involved in this. Nobody else is but folks always like a good show. I do know that not everybody has passed unwarranted judgments and that is nice to hear as this is not something I am enjoying whatsoever. Joe, contact your attorney and proceed how you feel you must. I wish this to be resolved...somehow. The slander must stop. Maybe if I was to jump on the forum and post negative posts id have folks backing and seem like the victim but we will never actually positively know that because I do not operate that way and I refuse to. I can not help but to feel that this would be much easier if you hadn't jumped online and figuratively spit in my face.
By the way, the PO does weigh the packages exactly. I don't know how to get that info but if 2 silver dollars and the envelope weigh more than the package that was accepted by his PO, you got this guy, at least in small claims court.
This whole thing is very similar to a situation i had years ago--an agreement gone bad, where i shipped off a coin in a trade and the items were never shipped, even though the gentleman insisted he sent them, and that he never received my coin either--yet my coin was shown on several auction sites using different aliases. he was sent to a Florida State prison for 10 years for his part--the postal inspectors take this very seriously. But oddly enough, he also claimed he had cancer, was seeing doctors from the Mayo Clinic, was given a short time to live. All BS. He is out now, I wonder if he makes a home up north now? These guys think an explanation will get you from following up, but lies unravel very quickly, he says he spoke to a deputy--fine, name and number please. if that is a lie, then everything else is as well, and then just make the Post Office aware and let the dogs loose.
Comments
<< <i>I am not going to contact my local PD, I am going to contact his local sheriff's office and the postal inspector. >>
The problem here is you can't really prove where the crime occurred. I've been here, done that. The ONLY reason I got my $ back was i used regular paypal (paid a fee) and they realized the guy was lying. My police reports helped me, but both citys basically said there was absoultely nothing they could do and I had the USPS Post master witness me opening the return package (he sent back empty boxes)
<< <i>
<< <i>I am not going to contact my local PD, I am going to contact his local sheriff's office and the postal inspector. >>
The problem here is you can't really prove where the crime occurred. I've been here, done that. The ONLY reason I got my $ back was i used regular paypal (paid a fee) and they realized the guy was lying. My police reports helped me, but both citys basically said there was absoultely nothing they could do and I had the USPS Post master witness me opening the return package (he sent back empty boxes) >>
You don't think, in a situation like this, and with the chance that the offending person is reading all this, that your comments wouldn't have been better served being a PM rather than a public post?
To me, it would have.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
I can't believe that after finally going away, the timbuk3 thread and story is now back. He was bumping that thing to the top for weeks or decades even!
<< <i>I have a lot of evidence of his lies from prior threads, things on other forums, my video, the package contents, his excuses to mail, etc. I trust that the justice system will be able to help. >>
WoW .. good that someone has confidence in any justice system , especially when it comes down to something like this. Id ask again , do you think the police will really have time for this , he said she said i videoed this and sent money blindly. . or do we expect the cops to be out there doing what they need to be doing. This was preventable , the minute you hit friends and family send , your goose was cooked.
assist jclovescoin on some information.
If you don't like it, move on, it's real
simple !!! :-)
Thank you !!!
Postal inspectors are your best chance.
"A car is a tool that takes you from one place to another. Everything beyond that is a payment for other people's perception of you."
<< <i>What did his references say when you checked with them before making the purchase? I'm assuming he had good references since you decided you didn't need paypal protection. If you didn't get references and check them you are somewhat responsible for your predicament.
- Marcus Tullius Cicero, 106-43 BC
"A car is a tool that takes you from one place to another. Everything beyond that is a payment for other people's perception of you."
<< <i>What did his references say when you checked with them before making the purchase? I'm assuming he had good references since you decided you didn't need paypal protection. If you didn't get references and check them you are somewhat responsible for your predicament.
Postal inspectors are your best chance. >>
The sellers "references" in his sig were along the lines of too many to mention , and a join date of 2014.
It's always best to out here in public and you win or lose... Same for him ...
town is small enough he/she knows everyone. I'll bet he has a history in that town. You just might get some
help from the local police department.
I know my Son and his family live in a small town in N. Dakota and the police there know everything about
everybody. The met my son the day he moved to the town...introduced themselves. Just a good way of keeping
the peace and be prepared for any "new" problems in town.
bob
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
<< <i>Makes me wonder if someone else is waiting to find out they got ripped off on the 1895-S in XF-40 that allegedly was sold by the same member three days before the sale of the two Carson City coins that never made it to the OP of this thread. >>
Coming to a post near you soon .. no doubt , it's amazing how long the BST has been a free for all , two new members , both 2014 and headlines in the US coin forum " I paid by gift...now what?" ..
<< <i>Makes me wonder if someone else is waiting to find out they got ripped off on the 1895-S in XF-40 that allegedly was sold by the same member three days before the sale of the two Carson City coins that never made it to the OP of this thread. >>
I was hoping that was a "fake sale" on the part of the scam artist, to make it look like he'd done some transactions before going for the real score.
<< <i>Coming to a post near you soon .. no doubt , it's amazing how long the BST has been a free for all , two new members , both 2014 and headlines in the US coin forum " I paid by gift...now what?" .. >>
Stuff like this didn't happen when good ole SM1 was still the sheriff
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
<< <i>I took a video showing the front and back of the package before it was opened. I cut it with a scissors and it was shown at all times. I showed there was nothing else inside the package. I opened up the cardboard the coins were inside and showed them on the camera. Everything was seen as I looked at it on the camera.[/]
The video is worthless. Anyone could carefully open the package before videoing, and retape the package, then video "the opening".
Countless large & small dollar deals completed
<< <i>No they couldn't. Not the way he did it. And furthermore, the weight of the package didn't support there being 2oz. in it. His postal receipt would show that. I have everything I need to prove a case. >>
And now all you need is someone/anyone who is interested enough to take your case seriously.
That, sadly, may prove to be more difficult than the evidence gathering was.
<< <i>I DO NOT appreciate what you are insinuating. The manner in which you are handling this makes me feel like I am being harassed and basically publically humiliated. I received your THREATENING emails and I chose not to respond to those emails...because they are just that....threatening. I feel like I must respond here, even though I do not feel it should feel forced I feel that I must...key word MUST reply on this forum due to your allegations, your public posts here on the Collectors Universe Forum as well as other member's posts, who are totally not involved in this but being the kind of hobby this is feels as though they must *try to help. Your THREATENING emails are and the manner in which you have conducted yourself throughout this entire ordeal.
Which as of right now is short in time as it just started this afternoon is not typically the type of behavior I respond to for a number of reasons but again...I feel like I am being publicly harassed and these public posts by you are slanderous. I know what I shipped to you, I know what was in that package, I know how much you paid for them, I also am aware that you are asking for more in return, I know the package was in fact delivered, I know what condition the package was in when I sent it.
I do not know what this video you speak of consists. I do not know you personally but I do know I did NOT...I REPEAT DID NOT send you anything else OTHER than what we agreed on. Now, I want you to be made aware that I have myself contacted MY local law enforcement...which is my local Sheriff's Office as your threatening emails naturally concerned me. I spoke with a Deputy and explained the details....details that we BOTH would agree is correct. Which basically is I say that you paid me X amount for two specific coins. I mailed those coins to you. You state that you did not receive those coins but did receive other misc. modern coins. You are now demanding a "refund". The amount you are demanding is more than you paid.
So, sum it up...you claim that I did not ship you what you paid for and for what we agreed on. After I advised the Deputy of the these facts she then advised me that this "ordeal" is in fact not a law enforcement matter but in fact is a CIVIL MATTER. I also want to advise you that I am going to provide you with the name AND badge number of the Deputy I spoke with as well as a case number in a PRIVATE email as I do not believe that information needs to be posted all over this forum because as of right now...this is a unfortunate "He said", "He did". Or didn't for that matter. Even though I wish for others not to take sides and totally assume its naturally going to happen. I do wish to say that just because I was the seller does not and should not automatically make me the one who is in the wrong.
Again...I shouldn't have felt obligated to respond to these public postings but I do. I do not take kindly to your demeanor. It seems to me, by your demeanor that we are beyond any kind of resolution between you and I alone. I can appreciate the fact that those who posted trying to provide their guidance even if it was not in my favor...I can understand why. I am asking that you STOP posting any details of this manner on this forum and refer to your attorney. I feel I have been slandered far too much as it is and feel as though I, and my name can not overcome the false assumptions and surely all adverse future implications that will occur as a direct and purposeful result of your actions on this forum. Simply put, I did not post slanderous...or rather anything whatsoever involving this event. I did not accuse you of anything as it could be just as easy for me to turn it totally around on you. I am extremely unhappy with everything regarding this event.
I have nothing further to say on this forum regarding this manner and again ask you to stop posting anything negative about me on this forum. You can expect an email soon with the information I advised that I would provide you. >>
I broke this down (without altering the content whatsoever) to make it easier to read.
With that stated, it is still not easy to believe.
bob
<< <i>I broke this down (without altering the content whatsoever) to make it easier to read.
With that stated, it is still not easy to believe. >>
Thanks braddick
Here is our exchange once he failed to provide me tracking on the forum, I emailed his Paypal email:
John -
Can you please supply me with the tracking number for the two Morgans? Thank you
His response:
yeah I'm real sorry Joe I had my buddy do it today because I had to work and unfortunately he still hasn't paid his cell phone bill yet... which he should have because that's what I gave him money for to ship those out to you for me. Yea he kinda a d bag. I stopped by his place but he wasn't there apparently he was at his parents house. I'll get a hold of them one way or another and get it
I send him next:
Can you please get this out Monday because I was going to send them to NGC with another shipment? Thank you.
I'm starting to get a bit concerned. Who has the coins now? If he has them and you cant ship them Monday, then please just send me a refund.
He says:
Don't worry he has them because he was going to send them off for me because I start work before the P.O. opens and till after it closes. He shoulda sent it that next day but for whatever reason didn't so if im gonna just get the package and be late to work Monday to send em out. I apologize for the BS this isn't the way I EVER do business
I say:
No pr9blem. Please send me a tracking number today. Thanks!
He replies:
Ok he sent me the tracking # on my phone. 9114901230803073283196 Lemme know if it doesn't work in case he made an error in the # or in case I did. I apologize for the delay I wish I could have just taken care of it myself but I hit the gym at around 345-4a then I start work at 630a and am never off before 5…usually 6-7p Im the lead recovery guy and we are always so busy with State Patrol Airport PD and numerous other PD agencies not to mention all the other accts and for the public that I don't get a lunch…maybe a chuckwagon if I can get to a store while I use the head but I usually don't eat till I get home as it gets $$. This guy…he is a friend but he has some issues and im helping him as much as I can but he has been more and more unreliable but he was basically my only choice to get that sent out to ya. He wasn't always this way so im hoping I/we can get him back to his roots. Again thanks for your patience. Gotta go gotta get back to work...YAYYYYYYYYYYYY lucky me
I say:
Thank you! Looking forward to receiving these two Morgans! Looks like your 20 cent piece was delivered today! That's dedication hitting the gym at 4am.
He says:
I was hoping so but I didn't get anything in the mail besides bills. Im curious to why it states delivered. Damn..im having a bad day/week. Well heres to it being here tomorrow??
I say:
I strongly suggest you mail me the two Morgan dollars: 78-CC and 81-CC. The package that I just received was video taped while being opened and was not messed with in any way. It has two nickels, a quarter, another quarter in a holder and a presidential dollar in a holder. The police in Lake Elmo, MN will be contacted tomorrow morning if I am not refunded $750 USD to my Paypal account by 9am tomorrow morning.
*** The twenty cent piece I sent him clearly shows delivered and he claims he never received anything. Not only that but he claims his friend mailed my package back and forth in between saying he would mail it.
Great.
He trusts his friend who "has some issues ... more and more unreliable" to ship you the stuff, and has no time to do it himself?
If this was for real, he should not be selling....
More likely, it's a false story, which constructs an excuse for him when the items do not show up or are incorrect....
Seems like a good time to start double checking references and use straight PP.
This seller had email exchanges with me. If he is
a LEO, St Elmo is in deep kimshi.
If a seller won't accept straight PayPal, add it to the price.
Might be time to start digging a little dirt before you go to the Postmaster. Ask him to provide purchase receipts for the images he is offering. Credit checks are cheap. Police inquiries at his residence?
Edit: a tow truck driver?
Nothing that I have said is threatening in any way. I told you very clearly that you had until 9am tomorrow morning (26th) to send me a refund for $750. This is the correct amount because it represents the $600 I sent you via Paypal and the $150 that we agreed the 20 cent piece that I sent you was worth. Since you sent me $1.60 in change, the amount can be reduced to $748.40.
Material facts are not slander. And yes, my tone changed entirely because I am an unassuming and trusting person that was taken advantage of. Now it is time to make sure no one else is victimized and to be made whole.
I'm glad you have already started this investigation, and I assume when I call tomorrow morning they will already have your information? That will be great and make this easier for me.
<< <i>Yeah, that email log would induce dread into any normal person.
He trusts his friend who "has some issues ... more and more unreliable" to ship you the stuff, and has no time to do it himself?
If this was for real, he should not be selling....
More likely, it's a false story, which constructs an excuse for him when the items do not show up or are incorrect.... >>
this
<< <i>Mail fraud is not a crime? Time for a new Deputy. >>
Absolutely, like tens of thousands of other crimes that go unanswered each and everyday.
And, yes, mail fraud is a crime.
BIG red flag for me.
I haven't done business with Joe (jclovescoins) but I have corresponded with him back and forth and have found him courteous, professional and very knowledgeable.
I don't get the same 'feeling' for the seller by reading his emails.
Can't mail the coins because you're going to the gym and who gets a 'friend' to mail an important and valuable item?
Take responsibility and mail it yourself.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
<< <i>Lake Elmo, Minnesota.
Yeah, something stinks in Minnesota.
Countless large & small dollar deals completed
Here is the link. Just an FYI.
I also found it interesting that someone who was apparently on his deathbed 8 months ago or so is now working from 345am until past 530pm (when post offices close in Minnesota).
I'm not making any nefarious accusations, I'm just saying Google is pretty powerful, even when you're just going on a screen name.
Good luck to both parties in figuring out this hairy situation.
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My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
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<< <i>If you have this gentleman's full name, you can do a criminal check on him in the state of Minnesota.
Here is the link. Just an FYI.
I also found it interesting that someone who was apparently on his deathbed 8 months ago or so is now working from 345am until past 530pm (when post offices close in Minnesota).
I'm not making any nefarious accusations, I'm just saying Google is pretty powerful, even when you're just going on a screen name.
Good luck to both parties in figuring out this hairy situation. >>
wow, a real class act!
By the way, the PO does weigh the packages exactly. I don't know how to get that info but if 2 silver dollars and the envelope weigh more than the package that was accepted by his PO, you got this guy, at least in small claims court.
Lafayette Grading Set