Thinking of selling some of my coins.......

coinsarefun · October 3, 2013 10:37AM

........in particular CoinsAreFun toned American Silver Eagles with a few proofs.

I know, I know......they are near and dear to my heart

and I do hate to sell them

But....I need to face facts, I'm getting older and I have never investing in any stocks or in particular I'm thinking Roth IRA & Mutual funds for my retirement.

As far as value amount.....for those bullion collectors this is MUCH more.

I have next to no knowledge in investing but that's for my advisor to guide me on my merry and probably rocky way.

I am probably 10-15 years....15 being MAX from so called retirement, probably will work past that. As a contractor I can take jobs I like then

Here are a few questions.

1) Better to sell or hold the toned eagles? why....why not?
2) Best place to auction them? I was thinking Stacks Americana auction coming at the first of the year.
3) If I do this is it a good idea to promote them as "CoinsAreFun" set......or maybe my name is next to worthless

Probably other concerns but lets start with this.

For those few people who have not seen the collection.......Link to "CoinsAreFun" Toned Silver Eagles

Placid · October 3, 2013 10:48AM

If you do sell maybe best not to "flood the market" by selling them all at once.

I looked at Heritage the highest price I found for a toned ASE is $2,185.00 1992 $1 Silver Eagle MS67 PCGS sold in 2008. Link I am not sure if that would be the best way to sell them.

epcjimi1 · October 3, 2013 10:48AM

<< 

1) Better to sell or hold the toned eagles? why....why not?
>>

Hang tight, keep 'em, you like them, time will tell on whether it's a good investment.

Concentrate your future income on investing in other avenues, time will tell if that's a good investment, too.

AUandAG · October 3, 2013 10:54AM

I don't believe that "investments" by a broker "adviser" will outperform you toned eagles.

I'd keep them and if you still want to go the IRA route then do that as well.

Stocks are really scary and you have to be able to take strong moves in the market with
ease. Building a portfolio with a good broker is fun and challenging but you have already
built a very nice portfolio with your toners.

bob

crypto79 · October 3, 2013 10:59AM

I know nothing about the toned modern market but I wish you well.

deltadimeman · October 3, 2013 11:13AM

Those rainbow toned ASE's are beautiful ! You know the toned ASE market , why would you stop investing in them ? In my opinion you will make more money for retirement using your knowledge of coins than in a IRA account that is managed by someone who could care less if you have a decent retirement . If you want , start an IRA account and invest in your ASE's at the same time . Just my opinion.

coinsarefun · October 3, 2013 11:27AM

<< If you do sell maybe best not to "flood the market" by selling them all at once.

I looked at Heritage the highest price I found for a toned ASE is $2,185.00 1992 $1 Silver Eagle MS67 PCGS sold in 2008. Link I am not sure if that would be the best way to sell them.

>>

Holy crap!!!!.......If I could get that much now I would sell

IMO I have not seen many crazy toned eagles like I have not to say there aren't any killers out there
as I know at least one dealer has equal to or better than my collection...

I think the Unc's will bring $500 and up and proofs $800-$1k maybe better.

btw....thanks for the link and taking time to look it up

RYK · October 3, 2013 11:29AM

1. Sell the toned eagles while the market still appreciates them.

2. I have never seen that sort of material in a Stack's auction. Great Collections seems to be a more logical auction venue. Ian seems to have made a name for himself in that kind of material.

3. Outside of the ten people who still participate on this forum

, the Coinsarefun name is probably not very useful. Perhaps another, more fitting/descriptive name for the set might help to market.

Good luck!

AMRC · October 3, 2013 11:32AM

Well as much as I wish I had some words of wisdom to share I am not sure that I do. I am no financial adviser but I will say that if you are 15 years away from retirement and you are just getting around to thinking about what to do, then no matter what you decide, buying equities, bonds or coins, is going to make that much of difference. Maybe you own some real estate or other tangible assets as well? I would ask the adviser to do a balance sheet on your behalf and then make some decisions based on how your current assets are placed. Maybe the solution is some stocks, some coins etc., etc. Don't "decide" to sell anything until you have a full picture of what you have and where you would like to be (realistically) when you retire given what you earn/save in the next 15 years.

SkyMan · October 3, 2013 11:33AM

Just a few thoughts. Given the current drivers behind the stock market, e.g. mega-market brokerages/banks and the ultra-wealthy, and the attendant set-up of buy and flip and screw the long term consequences, be aware that you will need a strong stomach for the stock market. There will be some SERIOUS back-tracking (potentially all the way to crashing) in the market. However, again, given the powers that be, I would think that over a 5 - 10 year span even the worst crash would be overcome and a new market high would occur. To protect yourself and to be moderately conservative I would recommend dividend dispersing stocks from well known companies that dominate their market segment. Examples of these companies would include Coca-Cola, Pepsi, Kimberly-Clark, Procter & Gamble, Johnson & Johnson, most major oil companies, AT&T etc. etc. Your advisor should be able to give you a decent sized list. Even if the market takes a serious hit, it is highly likely that these companies will continue to disperse dividends so you can use that money instead of being forced to sell stocks in a down market. Stocks and high quality bonds tend to have a negative correlation, e.g. when stocks go down, high quality bonds tend to go up, so make sure you have a decent slug of bonds in your account. However, bonds are near a cyclical low for yield, so I would NOT buy any long term bonds. You could always buy bond funds that are stairstepped. For example if you want to go with 5 year bonds, you could split your bonds into 20% chunks and buy equal amounts of 1 year, 2 year, 3 year, 4 year and 5 years to maturity bonds. When your 1 year bonds come due then plow the money back into a new 5 year bond. This way every year 20% of your bonds will come due and you can buy new and potentially higher rate bonds.

Finally, I would continue to hold some bullion and/or rare coins. Different people have different weightings, but most conventional advisors seem to recommend somewhere in the 5 - 10 % range of your investment portfolio.

Best of Luck!!!!

EDITED TO ADD: Oh, and given how high the stock market currently is, I would definitely buy into it slowly, dollar cost averaging over time.

Type2 · October 3, 2013 11:34AM

I was thinking the same thing but i might sell some and buy a new house.

MidLifeCrisis · October 3, 2013 11:36AM

<< 1. Sell the toned eagles while the market still appreciates them.

2. I have never seen that sort of material in a Stack's auction. Great Collections seems to be a more logical auction venue. Ian seems to have made a name for himself in that kind of material.

3. Outside of the ten people who still participate on this forum

, the Coinsarefun name is probably not very useful. Perhaps another, more fitting/descriptive name for the set might help to market.

Good luck! >>

I agree with RYK on all points.

Broadstruck · October 3, 2013 11:40AM

<< 3. Outside of the ten people who still participate on this forum

, the Coinsarefun name is probably not very useful. Perhaps another, more fitting/descriptive name for the set might help to market. >>

FunAreCoins might be more fitting

nwcoast · October 3, 2013 11:51AM

You've got quite a bit of time before retirement.
I too would recommend holding your lovely toners, at least most of them.

If I might be so bold as to offer some advice.
If you can chip away with dollar cost averaging your purchases of broad market indexes- over time.
And when your might be sick and tempted to sell all your stocks- such as during a "bear market".
Resist that temptation and double up your buying.
Do this, and given enough time, you will do very well.

Please be very cautious as to who you trust for investing advice....
Many, but not all, are looking for commissions, and their advice often doesn't beat market averages.

Diversify, with coins being part of your investment portfolio.

Just my 2 cents.
Cheers

123cents · October 3, 2013 11:58AM

Whatever avenue you use good luck with your toners!!

cwt · October 3, 2013 12:04PM

<< 

<< 1. Sell the toned eagles while the market still appreciates them.

2. I have never seen that sort of material in a Stack's auction. Great Collections seems to be a more logical auction venue. Ian seems to have made a name for himself in that kind of material.

3. Outside of the ten people who still participate on this forum

, the Coinsarefun name is probably not very useful. Perhaps another, more fitting/descriptive name for the set might help to market.

Good luck! >>

I agree with RYK on all points. >>

I'll second that. Excellent advice.

Tiny · October 3, 2013 2:04PM

I just took all my ASEs either graded or detailed or genuine and put them in the SDB.

OperationButter · October 3, 2013 2:25PM

<< I don't believe that "investments" by a broker "adviser" will outperform you toned eagles.

I'd keep them and if you still want to go the IRA route then do that as well.

Stocks are really scary and you have to be able to take strong moves in the market with
ease. Building a portfolio with a good broker is fun and challenging but you have already
built a very nice portfolio with your toners.

bob >>

With markets are near all time highs, reckless govt spending, debt limit increases and many many more bad things happening, I wouldnt be liquidating to "invest" in any stocks right now. Maybe thats just me, but thats my .02.

I also wouldnt sell your toners, they are too awesome!

CoinCast · October 3, 2013 4:06PM

<< 1. Sell the toned eagles while the market still appreciates them.

2. I have never seen that sort of material in a Stack's auction. Great Collections seems to be a more logical auction venue. Ian seems to have made a name for himself in that kind of material.

3. Outside of the ten people who still participate on this forum

, the Coinsarefun name is probably not very useful. Perhaps another, more fitting/descriptive name for the set might help to market.

Good luck! >>

I agree with this.

DavidLawrence · October 3, 2013 8:19PM

I suggest that you take a table a national coin show or two and become a part-time dealer of sorts. This will allow you to personally connect with other people who love your coins, and give you a chance to make a 2-way market in them. It's not easy to rely on the auction market to establish that market. Almost every coin dealer at a show started as a collector and made the transition (including my father). Who knows, it may chance your idea of retirement, as well.

Nickcap · October 3, 2013 9:22PM

CoinsAreFun, not many people can retire in their early to mid Thirties.

Personally, I would stay out of the stock market right now. It is close to an all time high.

I May be a bit biased though. I was a share holder of GM and lost everything in 2008-2009. Be prepared for losses in the market. Hopefully nothing like that happens to you.

Another option is to trade your coins for gold and silver.

giorgio11 · October 3, 2013 10:22PM

There have always been reasons not to invest in the stock market. But the Dow Jones Index rose from 66 to 11,497 in the 20th century, an average of 5.3% compounded annually. You can buy a simple, super-low-cost Vanguard Index Fund and dollar-cost-average, putting in a fixed amount at regular intervals over a long period of time. Of course the market is high right now, so one would be quite foolish to put a huge lump sum to work all at once. (I have some orders placed for when the market tanks more than 5% from current levels, and others for a 10% drop.) But on any given day, the chances are far greater that the market will be higher than lower.

Yes, there will be crashes and sharp sell-offs, but that is when you go shopping. People should look at investing as though it were grocery shopping; you buy more when prices are cheaper. My own investments in 2009, a diversified holding of stocks and mutual funds that I had been building for 20-plus years, dipped to levels that were, yes, awfully scary. I stayed the course, and even bought some more stock at absurdly low levels (GE at $7 comes to mind). Today those investments are up cumulatively 236% from that level.

This investment approach is certainly not for everyone, but I have done my homework for many years and started well before I had two (Buffalo) nickels to rub together.

Good luck Stefanie!

Best Regards,

George

crypto79 · October 3, 2013 10:40PM

<< I suggest that you take a table a national coin show or two and become a part-time dealer of sorts. This will allow you to personally connect with other people who love your coins, and give you a chance to make a 2-way market in them. It's not easy to rely on the auction market to establish that market. Almost every coin dealer at a show started as a collector and made the transition (including my father). Who knows, it may chance your idea of retirement, as well. >>

Interesting perspective

halfhunter · October 3, 2013 11:05PM

Pardon my French . . . but screw stocks . . . Just looked at that wonderful set of Toned ASEs. Continue to enjoy and build on that beautiful set that you have started.
Anyway retirement ain't all it's cracked up to be . . . been there twice and after a little time passed just HAD to go back to work to keep my sanity . . .

. . . Well sort of ! ! !

HH

giorgio11 · October 4, 2013 12:57AM

Please note that I was not/am not advising Stefanie to sell or not ... but was talking about investing in general. I would hate to part with those coins too, but there will always be other numismatic challenges.

But the stock market does get a bad rap. My point regarding investing is that one can make money over the long run if one devotes sufficient time to it. I completely agree about retirement, I have to stay active and so far manage to do so.

Best Regards,

George

erickso1 · October 4, 2013 1:25AM

If the market for both toned ASE's and stocks tanked, which one would continue to provide you with enjoyment?

Since your total financial picture is outside the scope of this forum, the nuts and bolts of the question becomes a simple exchange of ASE's for stock. If it were me, and both tanked, yeah, I could wipe the tears away with the worthless stock certificates, but I bet the ASE's could still stir up a smile.

MsMorrisine · October 4, 2013 5:41AM

The amount people need for retirement is huge now.

I hope the house is paid for or has a lot of equity.

I wonder how much help selling them and investing in stocks would help. I would also consider not selling them and trying something else.

I hate to offer this advice, but I would also consider starting a second job.

WestySteve · October 4, 2013 6:02AM

<< There have always been reasons not to invest in the stock market. But the Dow Jones Index rose from 66 to 11,497 in the 20th century, an average of 5.3% compounded annually. You can buy a simple, super-low-cost Vanguard Index Fund and dollar-cost-average, putting in a fixed amount at regular intervals over a long period of time. Of course the market is high right now, so one would be quite foolish to put a huge lump sum to work all at once. (I have some orders placed for when the market tanks more than 5% from current levels, and others for a 10% drop.) But on any given day, the chances are far greater that the market will be higher than lower.

Yes, there will be crashes and sharp sell-offs, but that is when you go shopping. People should look at investing as though it were grocery shopping; you buy more when prices are cheaper. My own investments in 2009, a diversified holding of stocks and mutual funds that I had been building for 20-plus years, dipped to levels that were, yes, awfully scary. I stayed the course, and even bought some more stock at absurdly low levels (GE at $7 comes to mind). Today those investments are up cumulatively 236% from that level.

This investment approach is certainly not for everyone, but I have done my homework for many years and started well before I had two (Buffalo) nickels to rub together.

Good luck Stefanie!

Best Regards,

George >>

George gives some good advice here. I too am holding a position that will trigger into leverage bear ETFs in the event that the market starts tanking. Don't own them, but I will if the market crashes.

Anyway, I wouldn't put it in gold and silver unless there was almost as much numismatic value wrapped in the gold coins to protect you. If the gold prices drop by half, you don't want to lose your portfolio.

IMHO, the high grade ASE's fall into a category of "sell it because they moved to fast". If they are worth in the neighborhood of $1,000 each...compared to what they cost 20 years ago, that's a big move, and selling after big moves...especially to preserve a standard of living...is never a bad idea. They might go higher, but you're taking a big risk, for little gain. I'd rather see you cash them out and put them into coins that have moved more predictably and steadily.

Regarding stocks...yes...dollar cost averaging is the thing....but they are very "toppy" and it can be argued that the baby boomer retirement is stagnating it. If I were you...if you have the resources to put a big downpayment on a 15 year note for a rental property, I'd strongly recommend that. Property is cheap, mortgage rates are low, and if you own at least half of that place free and clear, you're not taking a big risk because you'll own the whole thing free and clear in 15 years...and until then you get a nice tax break and regular cash flow that will more than cover the mortgage. This is the advice I'd give my Mom. However, real estate investing does take a lot of due dilligence and can be a pain in the rear. But if you own half of it, you'll have the cash flow to pay someone else to manage it. You would want a smallish place in a really nice area and you'd want a good price on it. You'll want to do an inspection and you'll want a new-ish roof. And you don't want high condo fees...they eat your profits.

Good luck.

SmEagle1795 · October 4, 2013 6:21AM

Feel free to not respond publicly, but just some points to think about:

- Start by splitting your collection into an 'A', 'B', and 'C' collection, sorted by which ones you like most irrespective of price. It's worth making a similar list by which coins would be more replaceable should you want to acquire one in the future.

- Selling all at once may be easiest but is probably not the best idea (unless you were looking to consign to a large auction house and wanted to get a better rate). Personally, I suggest a phased approach: start on the BST with some of your more common coins, selling over time to not saturate the forum. Then, start to sell more of your favorite/nicer coins on the BST as well, but with asking prices that you would be obviously extremely pleased to sell at. Perhaps give some to a dealer to try as well - it can't hurt to see what people may be willing to pay. Then, for the remaining coins, I would suggest slowly selling them on Great Collections or eBay, but only do so when you have a destination planned for the funds you will receive.

- What percent of your total worth is tied up in coins? Will it make a significant enough dent to justify selling?

- I agree with the others that stocks are overpriced (and actually, I just sold more than half of my stocks in the last week)

- I personally don't like the volatility in the US dollar at the moment. It's dropped significantly versus CHF/EUR and I think many people don't take this into account - the money you have sitting in a bank account is worth considerably less in real terms today than it was even a couple months ago.

- Your personal enjoyment means a lot. If it were me, I would enjoy putting a tabletop book together with images of all of your coins and writeups, something to cherish and remember your collection by if you do decide to sell it.

coinsarefun · October 4, 2013 1:07PM

Wow, so much thought was given to each reply!

I want to thank each and everyone of you for taking the time to give me some very good food for thought.
it seems like I have to do some additional thinking on what to do with my beautiful set of toned eagles.
And a lot of thought as to retirement and investing/coins.

VanHalen · October 4, 2013 3:19PM

1) Better to sell or hold the toned eagles? why....why not?

Hold. Unless the market for toned eagles is much stronger than the overall coin market.

2) Best place to auction them? I was thinking Stacks Americana auction coming at the first of the year.

Stacks has nice stuff. Crazy as it sounds I would also consider eBay with lots of marketing on every coin forum out there.

3) If I do this is it a good idea to promote them as "CoinsAreFun" set......or maybe my name is next to worthless.

You need to market them as "your" set. How do most people know you? CoinsAreFun with Stef added in? Something like "Stef's CoinsAreFun Collection of Toned American Eagles" might be a bit long but should cover it.

Good Luck!

MidLifeCrisis · October 4, 2013 6:30PM

It's natural for collectors and collections to evolve. I suspect that if you are "thinking of selling" those toned ASEs, deep down you've really already made the decision to sell and you're trying to come to terms with it because you still have an emotional attachment to those coins.

It's ok to sell. In fact, it's healthy.

Investment choices and decisions, on the other hand, are personal and depend on many factors. As well intentioned as we are on this forum, we don't know you, your tolerance for risk, or your personal situation.

Justlooking · October 4, 2013 6:45PM

I hope you put at least some of them on the BST.

I'm totally clueless about this market. It seemed "toppy" to me a thousand points ago.

I do know that you shouldn't invest in bonds right now ... interest rates will be going up in the near future, and that hurts the value of bonds and bond funds.

An advisor might be the way to go if you're new to investing ... once you get your feet wet, you can always fire your broker and make choices on your own.

Thinking of selling some of my coins.......

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