He ended the listing and sent along a nice message.
<< <i>You got what you wanted I guess. You slandered the sh** out of my thanks. Let me tell you something bud, I have only done this for a short time and its so I can get the money to keep my house. I am running way behind on rent and am about to be kicked out. I make minimum wage doing labor jobs and this on the side. As soon as I get on top of my bills I will go back to selling graded coins. Bud now you have slandered me and are trying to kill my repeat buyers. I just wish you had a life and did something with your time besides kicking someone hard in the face when they are already about as low as they can go. I have close family members near death with tremendous medical bills that I am helping with. I will take returns if someone is not happy and I have perfect feedback. Look at my name that shows my beleifs even at the current time I dont live up to it. If I go homeless because of this loss of income be I would like to thank you in advance. Also I have removed that listing >>
It must have been something that came about as a result of the forum members here, as I didn't contact ebay myself.
I find it interesting that "slander" was used. (False statements injurious to a person's reputation.) Since the statements are true, might be closer to gossip!
t is entirely unethical and wrong. The seller knows he is deceiving people or he doesn't have a conscience or he is an idiot--it has to be one of those options.
I disagree. It could be "all of the above".
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Happens more than people know, I think, when buy raw coins. I personally think it is very unethical, but it is a perfect example why new collectors have to learn how to grade and identify problem coins for themselves.
I also contacted him asking if it was cleaned. No mention of details slab in my question. He denied any knowledge of prior cleaning. Later I replied with the fact that I checked completed listings and saw his coin purchase. I guess I put the bug up his ass, but he has more like the one I posted above.
At 47, I'm wondering why I'm one of the youngest people at stamp shows!!!!!
<< <i>t is entirely unethical and wrong. The seller knows he is deceiving people or he doesn't have a conscience or he is an idiot--it has to be one of those options.
<< <i>He ended the listing and sent along a nice message.
<< <i>You got what you wanted I guess. You slandered the sh** out of my thanks. Let me tell you something bud, I have only done this for a short time and its so I can get the money to keep my house. I am running way behind on rent and am about to be kicked out. I make minimum wage doing labor jobs and this on the side. As soon as I get on top of my bills I will go back to selling graded coins. Bud now you have slandered me and are trying to kill my repeat buyers. I just wish you had a life and did something with your time besides kicking someone hard in the face when they are already about as low as they can go. I have close family members near death with tremendous medical bills that I am helping with. I will take returns if someone is not happy and I have perfect feedback. Look at my name that shows my beliefs even at the current time I don't live up to it. If I go homeless because of this loss of income be I would like to thank you in advance. Also I have removed that listing, Christian >>
>>
If I've heard it once I've heard it a hundred times... How come everyone that tries to screw others in this hobby always has the same "woe is me" sappy story for doing so
To Err Is Human.... To Collect Err's Is Just Too Much Darn Tootin Fun!
<< <i>I also contacted him asking if it was cleaned. No mention of details slab in my question. He denied any knowledge of prior cleaning. Later I replied with the fact that I checked completed listings and saw his coin purchase. I guess I put the bug up his ass, but he has more like the one I posted above. >>
Thank you, I am sure he has ruined collecting for more then one novice collector like myself.
Right is right and wrong is wrong, many have lost sight of that recently, always wanting to justify it with a sad story. I do have compasion for his problems but I cannot support his unethical business model.
Successful coin BST transactions with Gerard and segoja.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
<< <i>I guess I'm just as guilty as this ebay guy. Mea Culpa.
Purchased a PCGS MS64 $10 Liberty a few years back because it looked like a no brainer MS65. Cracked it out and ended up getting "altered surfaces" from both PCGS and NGC. Showed the coin to several leading gold dealers I knew and none could tell me what was wrong with the coin other than it looked "too good" to them. I tried selling the coin raw w/o success as I fully disclosed the problems. Tossed in the towel and consigned it to a major auction figuring that as a raw coin someone might see the potential I did. Guess that made me a "criminal" trying to pass altered material off without full disclosure of my 2 previous grading attempts. And no doubt if it was left raw, it would have been described as choice unc, leaving it up to the bidders to decide what it was really worth.
The story had a twist to the ending though. The auction house loved the coin and sent it back in for grading one last time. NGC MS66. I doubled up on a coin I couldn't even give away for a 25% loss. The coin went MS64, AS, AS, MS66 on 4 grading events. What was the real grade of the coin? Each TPG saw it twice and they were split 50-50 on whether it was Altered Surfaces or gradeable. >>
That was one coin, this seems to be this guys business model.
Successful coin BST transactions with Gerard and segoja.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
<< <i>The right coins end up in the right hands. The wrong hands rarely end up with the right coins. People "flip" every which way and some flop. But the coins keep moving up or down until they get to the right hands. Weak coins do not go to strong hands, but if they do, we cannot be their watchdog.
About ethics and good vs. bad with coins on eBay ? I'm burned out on caring. >>
I respect your opinion but I just can't get my hands around how this is okay.
I do agree it's a broken record with eBay.
Successful coin BST transactions with Gerard and segoja.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
<< <i>He ended the listing and sent along a nice message.
<< <i>You got what you wanted I guess. You slandered the sh** out of my thanks. Let me tell you something bud, I have only done this for a short time and its so I can get the money to keep my house. I am running way behind on rent and am about to be kicked out. I make minimum wage doing labor jobs and this on the side. As soon as I get on top of my bills I will go back to selling graded coins. Bud now you have slandered me and are trying to kill my repeat buyers. I just wish you had a life and did something with your time besides kicking someone hard in the face when they are already about as low as they can go. I have close family members near death with tremendous medical bills that I am helping with. I will take returns if someone is not happy and I have perfect feedback. Look at my name that shows my beliefs even at the current time I don't live up to it. If I go homeless because of this loss of income be I would like to thank you in advance. Also I have removed that listing, Christian >>
>>
If I've heard it once I've heard it a hundred times... How come everyone that tries to screw others in this hobby always has the same "woe is me" sappy story for doing so >>
Dear Friend:
My name is Dave Rhodes. In September 1988 my car was repossessed and the bill collectors were hounding me like you wouldn't believe. I was laid off and my unemployment checks had run out. The only escape I had from the pressures of failure was my computer and my modem. I longed to turn my advocation into my vocation.
<< <i>I do agree it's a broken record with eBay. >>
It's not just eBay. There have always been (and as long as humans continue to exist) there will likely always be those who attempt to take advantage of others. It would be nice if it weren't so, but I'm not holding my breath in the hopes it's going to happen anytime soon.
<< <i>I do agree it's a broken record with eBay. >>
It's not just eBay. There have always been (and as long as humans continue to exist) there will likely always be those who attempt to take advantage of others. It would be nice if it weren't so, but I'm not holding my breath in the hopes it's going to happen anytime soon. >>
I agree but you still have to keep that slimmer of hope alive.
Successful coin BST transactions with Gerard and segoja.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
The seller either reads these boards or was tipped off by someone who does.
Here is a message to me from the seller:
<< <i>Funny that you can post my response but you dont have the balls to respond. Why dont you quite saying sh** behind my back through the web and respond directly. Go find something to do with your time (like a job). Because making up sh** through your dumb little coin talk site isnt getting you anywhere. This is one of the big problems in america. What the hell do you want? Took down the listing and you still try to get me in more trouble. >>
Though I would have prefered not to engage him I felt the need to respond,so I wrote this:
<< <i> I asked a question on a respected coin forum with regard to the practice of removing problem graded coins and re-selling that said coin as a raw problem free "Gem BU ++", I did nothing to you. In my opinion, and I'm not the coin police, I find that practice to be unethical unless one discloses, at the very least, the possibility of the fact that the coin may have a problem, that it may have been cleaned at some point.
I was sold that coin in the raw as problem free and was dissappointed when after paying good money for the coin and then more money to have it graded, that the coin wasn't problem free but in fact had issues. Maybe the dealer I bought it from knew it had a problem, maybe he didn't, but you and I certainly knew it did.
I, in good conscience, could not resell that coin to someone else without disclosing the problems the TPG have identified. That is deception. If you are a christian at heart then you know that deception is the favorite trick of the devil. I'm not here to judge your actions, that's a matter for you and your beliefs. I did not report what you were doing to any authority, I asked a question to a group of fellow collectors and dealers. And when I did that, it was not to get you in trouble but to determine if my moral beliefs were consistant with that of the numismatic community. If you read the replies, which you appear to have done, then it must be evident to you that the majority of people, in fact nearly all of the people who responded, found the practice of what you were doing to be wrong.
I don't know if one of them prodded you to stop the auction, I didn't. Maybe instead of being hostile you should reflect on the golden rule, to treat others as you would like to be treated. That is how I try to live. I think you can tell by the way I conducted my transaction with you, that I am an honest man. Christian, I'm sorry for you that life is difficult right now, and I hope God helps you with all your problems, but it isn't me who's wrong. >>
To which I got the this nice follow up message:
<< <i>You put links to my site and you and your little friends are contacting my buyers with bogus reports. Your whole intent was to screw me when you put that link to my site. I will be hiring lawyers to get this settled. This is slander and you contacting my buyers crosses the line into illegal. 99% of my items are legit. I will be filing a suit later today. >>
Amazing, isn't it. He is going to sue me. That takes the cake. As for the coin it was one of the very first coins I had purchased when I first started to collect. I didn't have much knowledge at the time and it showed. I got it graded some time later and it came back cleaned. Ok, was hoping for AU but it was what it was. Still, I feel that it was my lesson, I learned to be more careful. I wouldn't want to be a part of someone else's dissapointment. Hence, the thought of anything short of full disclosure when I decided to get rid of it recently never entered my mind. I was actually going to give it away here on the board but decided differently.
I'm sure he'll read this and then send another message.
Thanks for confirming my beliefs, I feel really good about the people here on these boards, standup people! Thanks for all that each of you do in helping and promoting the hobby. Now I'm going to put this to rest and move on.
Unfortunate subtitle that he put on the Isabella he cracked out of a PCGS details holder, “STUNNING TONED SOLID GEM BU++ ISABELLA QUARTER WITH PERFECT DETAIL! NO PROBLEMS!”
<< <i>Haha for it to be slander doesn't it have to be false? >>
Actually it'd be libel...slander would be me speaking (think S spoken=slander) to my associate and telling him specifically that the seller is a but regardless of the definitions truth is an absolute defense.
I'm sure the lawyers will be lining up to take his case....
Did this guy really write this: 99% of my items are legit...???
Reminds me of one of my favorite movies.....OK, put the gun down, give the bag to Bozo and put your hands up!!!!
<< <i>Unfortunate subtitle that he put on the Isabella he cracked out of a PCGS details holder, “STUNNING TONED SOLID GEM BU++ ISABELLA QUARTER WITH PERFECT DETAIL! NO PROBLEMS!” >>
If it's the same coin he bought it for well over $300 and sold for around $200, not exactly a winning business plan.
>>
I agree. This is hardly beating a dead horse.
There was a $221 profit (not counting fees) on that 1918-S Walking Half.
This is a business model that is fleecing fellow coin collectors. Yes, Caveat Emptor and all that, but it's bad for the hobby.
<< <i>Unfortunate subtitle that he put on the Isabella he cracked out of a PCGS details holder, “STUNNING TONED SOLID GEM BU++ ISABELLA QUARTER WITH PERFECT DETAIL! NO PROBLEMS!” >>
If it's the same coin he bought it for well over $300 and sold for around $200, not exactly a winning business plan.
>>
In your short time here you still can't figure out when a thread has been beaten to death. This thread would need to double in posts to actually enter that territory.
Successful coin BST transactions with Gerard and segoja.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
Anyway which way, he is a thief. He may be a petty thief, but a thief nonetheless. He's also a dumb thief in that he isn't even smart enough to buy under a different account.
<< <i>Anyway which way, he is a thief. He may be a petty thief, but a thief nonetheless. He's also a dumb thief in that he isn't even smart enough to buy under a different account. >>
So those who discover dumb thief's, what does that say for them??
Somewhat related anecdote: I once bought a coin from an eBay seller who guaranteed the coin was "genuine, never been cleaned." Came back from PCGS "genuine: cleaned." When I contacted the seller, he played the shocked & surprised card, and offered to buy back the coin at the purchase price. He did not offer to cover any shipping expenses, or grading cost. I decided to keep it.
<< <i>I once bought a coin from an eBay seller who guaranteed the coin was "genuine, never been cleaned." Came back from PCGS "genuine: cleaned." When I contacted the seller, he played the shocked & surprised card, and offered to buy back the coin at the purchase price. He did not offer to cover any shipping expenses, or grading cost. >>
Maybe he really did believe the coin was "genuine, never been cleaned" and actually was shocked and surprised. I mean- it's not like there's any guarantee that PCGS would grade the coin the same with repeated submissions. Offering to buy back the coin long enough after a sale to allow for time to send a coin in for grading certainly doesn't reflect badly on the seller. Covering the shipping expense to do so would be nice, but not offering doesn't make him a bad guy, either. Offering to cover the grading cost? Unless that was part of the sales agreement, you're expecting too much, IMO.
If the coin had come back from PCGS graded higher than what the seller graded it, would you have sent him more money?
<< <i>Anyway which way, he is a thief. He may be a petty thief, but a thief nonetheless. He's also a dumb thief in that he isn't even smart enough to buy under a different account. >>
So those who discover dumb thief's, what does that say for them?? >>
Unfortunately today there are too many of them.JMHO
Great coins are not cheap,and cheap coins are not great!
<< <i>I once bought a coin from an eBay seller who guaranteed the coin was "genuine, never been cleaned." Came back from PCGS "genuine: cleaned." When I contacted the seller, he played the shocked & surprised card, and offered to buy back the coin at the purchase price. He did not offer to cover any shipping expenses, or grading cost. >>
Maybe he really did believe the coin was "genuine, never been cleaned" and actually was shocked and surprised. I mean- it's not like there's any guarantee that PCGS would grade the coin the same with repeated submissions. Offering to buy back the coin long enough after a sale to allow for time to send a coin in for grading certainly doesn't reflect badly on the seller. Covering the shipping expense to do so would be nice, but not offering doesn't make him a bad guy, either. Offering to cover the grading cost? Unless that was part of the sales agreement, you're expecting too much, IMO >>
This dealer had way more years' experience than myself and had handled tens of thousands of coins, and must have known it was cleaned (and probably cleaned it themselves). I bought based on their word and submitted directly for grading without examining thoroughly myself that was my mistake and a lesson I learned well. Fortunately it was early in my collecting history.
edited to add: In this particular situation I believed (and still believe) the coin was more valuable in the slab than raw. Therefore I viewed their "buy back" offer as them trying to take advantage of me again so they could resell the coin for an even higher price / with the slab premium. Maybe I'm wrong but that's how it looked from my perspective. That's the way I remember it anyway.
Comments
<< <i>You got what you wanted I guess. You slandered the sh** out of my thanks. Let me tell you something bud, I have only done this for a short time and its so I can get the money to keep my house. I am running way behind on rent and am about to be kicked out. I make minimum wage doing labor jobs and this on the side. As soon as I get on top of my bills I will go back to selling graded coins. Bud now you have slandered me and are trying to kill my repeat buyers. I just wish you had a life and did something with your time besides kicking someone hard in the face when they are already about as low as they can go. I have close family members near death with tremendous medical bills that I am helping with. I will take returns if someone is not happy and I have perfect feedback. Look at my name that shows my beleifs even at the current time I dont live up to it. If I go homeless because of this loss of income be I would like to thank you in advance. Also I have removed that listing >>
It must have been something that came about as a result of the forum members here, as I didn't contact ebay myself.
JC
The only thing missing is that his dog just died.
I find it interesting that "slander" was used. (False statements injurious to a person's reputation.) Since the statements are true, might be closer to gossip!
I disagree. It could be "all of the above".
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Buyer beware
after
<< <i>t is entirely unethical and wrong. The seller knows he is deceiving people or he doesn't have a conscience or he is an idiot--it has to be one of those options.
I disagree. It could be "all of the above". >>
That's true...a conscienceless, deceptive idiot.
<< <i>He ended the listing and sent along a nice message.
<< <i>You got what you wanted I guess. You slandered the sh** out of my thanks. Let me tell you something bud, I have only done this for a short time and its so I can get the money to keep my house. I am running way behind on rent and am about to be kicked out. I make minimum wage doing labor jobs and this on the side. As soon as I get on top of my bills I will go back to selling graded coins. Bud now you have slandered me and are trying to kill my repeat buyers. I just wish you had a life and did something with your time besides kicking someone hard in the face when they are already about as low as they can go. I have close family members near death with tremendous medical bills that I am helping with. I will take returns if someone is not happy and I have perfect feedback. Look at my name that shows my beliefs even at the current time I don't live up to it. If I go homeless because of this loss of income be I would like to thank you in advance. Also I have removed that listing,
Christian >>
>>
If I've heard it once I've heard it a hundred times... How come everyone that tries to screw others in this hobby always has the same "woe is me" sappy story for doing so
<< <i>I also contacted him asking if it was cleaned. No mention of details slab in my question. He denied any knowledge of prior cleaning. Later I replied with the fact that I checked completed listings and saw his coin purchase. I guess I put the bug up his ass, but he has more like the one I posted above. >>
Thank you, I am sure he has ruined collecting for more then one novice collector like myself.
Right is right and wrong is wrong, many have lost sight of that recently, always wanting to justify it with a sad story. I do have compasion for his problems but I cannot support his unethical business model.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
<< <i>I guess I'm just as guilty as this ebay guy. Mea Culpa.
Purchased a PCGS MS64 $10 Liberty a few years back because it looked like a no brainer MS65. Cracked it out and ended up getting "altered surfaces" from both PCGS and NGC.
Showed the coin to several leading gold dealers I knew and none could tell me what was wrong with the coin other than it looked "too good" to them. I tried selling the coin raw w/o
success as I fully disclosed the problems. Tossed in the towel and consigned it to a major auction figuring that as a raw coin someone might see the potential I did. Guess that made
me a "criminal" trying to pass altered material off without full disclosure of my 2 previous grading attempts. And no doubt if it was left raw, it would have been described as choice unc,
leaving it up to the bidders to decide what it was really worth.
The story had a twist to the ending though. The auction house loved the coin and sent it back in for grading one last time. NGC MS66. I doubled up on a coin I couldn't even give
away for a 25% loss. The coin went MS64, AS, AS, MS66 on 4 grading events. What was the real grade of the coin? Each TPG saw it twice and they were split 50-50 on whether
it was Altered Surfaces or gradeable. >>
That was one coin, this seems to be this guys business model.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
<< <i>The right coins end up in the right hands. The wrong hands rarely end up with the right coins. People "flip" every which way and some flop. But the coins keep moving up or down until they get to the right hands. Weak coins do not go to strong hands, but if they do, we cannot be their watchdog.
About ethics and good vs. bad with coins on eBay ? I'm burned out on caring. >>
I respect your opinion but I just can't get my hands around how this is okay.
I do agree it's a broken record with eBay.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
<< <i>
<< <i>He ended the listing and sent along a nice message.
<< <i>You got what you wanted I guess. You slandered the sh** out of my thanks. Let me tell you something bud, I have only done this for a short time and its so I can get the money to keep my house. I am running way behind on rent and am about to be kicked out. I make minimum wage doing labor jobs and this on the side. As soon as I get on top of my bills I will go back to selling graded coins. Bud now you have slandered me and are trying to kill my repeat buyers. I just wish you had a life and did something with your time besides kicking someone hard in the face when they are already about as low as they can go. I have close family members near death with tremendous medical bills that I am helping with. I will take returns if someone is not happy and I have perfect feedback. Look at my name that shows my beliefs even at the current time I don't live up to it. If I go homeless because of this loss of income be I would like to thank you in advance. Also I have removed that listing,
Christian >>
>>
If I've heard it once I've heard it a hundred times... How come everyone that tries to screw others in this hobby always has the same "woe is me" sappy story for doing so
Dear Friend:
My name is Dave Rhodes. In September 1988 my car was repossessed and the bill collectors were hounding me like you wouldn't believe. I was laid off and my unemployment checks had run out. The only escape I had from the pressures of failure was my computer and my modem. I longed to turn my advocation into my vocation.
:
:
:
<< <i>I do agree it's a broken record with eBay. >>
It's not just eBay. There have always been (and as long as humans continue to exist) there will likely always be those who attempt to take advantage of others. It would be nice if it weren't so, but I'm not holding my breath in the hopes it's going to happen anytime soon.
<< <i>
<< <i>I do agree it's a broken record with eBay. >>
It's not just eBay. There have always been (and as long as humans continue to exist) there will likely always be those who attempt to take advantage of others. It would be nice if it weren't so, but I'm not holding my breath in the hopes it's going to happen anytime soon. >>
I agree but you still have to keep that slimmer of hope alive.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
Instead of paying rent and family medical bills, he's still buying $1k MS61 and 58s to crack out per his feedback just rec'd
1893 25C ISABELLA COMMENMORATIVE QUARTER. PCGS UNC DETAILS
Before.
After.
1918-S WALKING HALD DOLLAR- ANACS AU50 DETAILS- CLEANED
Before.
After.
<< <i>That was one coin, this seems to be this guy's business model. >>
Realistically, it only takes one time before you have become partners with the dark side.
Here is a message to me from the seller:
<< <i>Funny that you can post my response but you dont have the balls to respond. Why dont you quite saying sh** behind my back through the web and respond directly. Go find something to do with your time (like a job). Because making up sh** through your dumb little coin talk site isnt getting you anywhere. This is one of the big problems in america. What the hell do you want? Took down the listing and you still try to get me in more trouble. >>
Though I would have prefered not to engage him I felt the need to respond,so I wrote this:
<< <i> I asked a question on a respected coin forum with regard to the practice of removing problem graded coins and re-selling that said coin as a raw problem free "Gem BU ++", I did nothing to you. In my opinion, and I'm not the coin police, I find that practice to be unethical unless one discloses, at the very least, the possibility of the fact that the coin may have a problem, that it may have been cleaned at some point.
I was sold that coin in the raw as problem free and was dissappointed when after paying good money for the coin and then more money to have it graded, that the coin wasn't problem free but in fact had issues. Maybe the dealer I bought it from knew it had a problem, maybe he didn't, but you and I certainly knew it did.
I, in good conscience, could not resell that coin to someone else without disclosing the problems the TPG have identified. That is deception. If you are a christian at heart then you know that deception is the favorite trick of the devil. I'm not here to judge your actions, that's a matter for you and your beliefs. I did not report what you were doing to any authority, I asked a question to a group of fellow collectors and dealers. And when I did that, it was not to get you in trouble but to determine if my moral beliefs were consistant with that of the numismatic community. If you read the replies, which you appear to have done, then it must be evident to you that the majority of people, in fact nearly all of the people who responded, found the practice of what you were doing to be wrong.
I don't know if one of them prodded you to stop the auction, I didn't. Maybe instead of being hostile you should reflect on the golden rule, to treat others as you would like to be treated. That is how I try to live. I think you can tell by the way I conducted my transaction with you, that I am an honest man. Christian, I'm sorry for you that life is difficult right now, and I hope God helps you with all your problems, but it isn't me who's wrong. >>
To which I got the this nice follow up message:
<< <i>You put links to my site and you and your little friends are contacting my buyers with bogus reports. Your whole intent was to screw me when you put that link to my site. I will be hiring lawyers to get this settled. This is slander and you contacting my buyers crosses the line into illegal. 99% of my items are legit. I will be filing a suit later today. >>
Amazing, isn't it. He is going to sue me. That takes the cake.
As for the coin it was one of the very first coins I had purchased when I first started to collect.
I didn't have much knowledge at the time and it showed.
I got it graded some time later and it came back cleaned. Ok, was hoping for AU but it was what it was.
Still, I feel that it was my lesson, I learned to be more careful. I wouldn't want to be a part of someone else's dissapointment.
Hence, the thought of anything short of full disclosure when I decided to get rid of it recently never entered my mind.
I was actually going to give it away here on the board but decided differently.
I'm sure he'll read this and then send another message.
Thanks for confirming my beliefs, I feel really good about the people here on these boards, standup people!
Thanks for all that each of you do in helping and promoting the hobby.
Now I'm going to put this to rest and move on.
Thanks Again
JC
<< <i>Haha for it to be slander doesn't it have to be false? >>
Actually it'd be libel...slander would be me speaking (think S spoken=slander) to my associate and telling him specifically that the seller is a
I'm sure the lawyers will be lining up to take his case....
Did this guy really write this: 99% of my items are legit...???
Reminds me of one of my favorite movies.....OK, put the gun down, give the bag to Bozo and put your hands up!!!!
<< <i>
<< <i>Unfortunate subtitle that he put on the Isabella he cracked out of a PCGS details holder, “STUNNING TONED SOLID GEM BU++ ISABELLA QUARTER WITH PERFECT DETAIL! NO PROBLEMS!” >>
If it's the same coin he bought it for well over $300 and sold for around $200, not exactly a winning business plan.
I agree. This is hardly beating a dead horse.
There was a $221 profit (not counting fees) on that 1918-S Walking Half.
This is a business model that is fleecing fellow coin collectors. Yes, Caveat Emptor and all that, but it's bad for the hobby.
Those starting with **do not mention anything to details grade it. They seem to be sliders(?).
1902-Unc-Details-NGC-Indian-Head-One-Cent
1878-S-Trade-Dollar-RRC-AU-Cleaned-Hairline-Scratches
1928-S-Standing-Liberty-Quarter-NGC-UNC-DETAILS-Improperly-Cleaned
1930-Standing-Liberty-Quarter-NGC-UNC-DETAILS-Reverse-Improperly-Cleaned
1927-Standing-Liberty-Quarter-NGC-UNC-DETAILS-Improperly-Cleaned
Seated-Liberty-Quarter-1888-S-Good-Cleaned-18-Ounce-Silver
1888-S-SEATED-LIBERTY-QUARTER-CLEANED
1826-Classic-Head-Half-Cent-ANACS-AU50-Details-Corroded-Tooled-Cleaned
1928-Peace-Dollar-KEY-DATE-NGC-graded-UNC-Details
**1930-STANDING-LIBERTY-QTR-GRADED-PCGS-AU58-MINMAL-FRICTION-PLENTY-OF-LUSTER
1865-Nickel-Three-Cent-Piece-ANACS-AU-50-Details
1897-barber-quarter-au-details-damage
1876S-AU-Details-NGC-USA-Liberty-Seated-Silver-Trade
1874-ARROWS-SEATED-LIBERTY-DIME-NGC-AU-DETAILS-CLEANED
1874-S-Trade-Dollar-AU
**1930-GEM-UNCIRCULATED-ALMOST-FULL-HEAD-3-LEAF-NO-EARHOLE-STANDING-LIBERTY-QTR
pcgs1901-barber-half-dollar-vf-details
1887-S-MORGAN-DOLLAR-HIGH-GRADE-NO-RESERVE
1914-Barber-Quarter-NGC-AU-Details
1852-Silver-Three-Cent-Piece-ANACS-AU-50-Details
1877S-Trade-Dollar-PCGS-Genuine-Cleaning-AU-Details
1915-10c-Barber-Dime-NGC-Unc-Details-Obv-Improperly-Cleaned
1928-25c-Standing-Liberty-Quarter-NGC-Unc-Details-Improperly-Cleaned
1901-NGC-UNC-DETAILS-MORGAN-SILVER-DOLLAR-1-UNCIRCULATED
1928-PEACE-DOLLAR-NGC-UNC-CLEANED-RARE
1917-Standing-Liberty-Quarter-ANACS-MS60-Details-var-1
1831-O-111-NGC-AU-details-Bust-Half-No-Reserve
1929-S-Standing-Liberty-Quarter-AU
1917-Ty1-Standing-Liberty-Quarter-AU
1876-Trade-Dollar-AU
1805-25c-Draped-Bust-Quarter-Key-Date-NGC-VG-Details
1873-1-Silver-Trade-Dollar-PCGS-AU-Details
1893-25C-ISABELLA-COMMEMORATIVE-QUARTER-PCGS-UNC-DETAILS
1918-S-WALKING-HALF-DOLLAR-ANACS-AU50-DETAILS-CLEANED
1804-DRAPED-BUST-HALF-CENT-CERTIFIED-NGC-MINT-STATE-DETAILS
1814-1-ANACS-AU-Details-Key-Date-Large-Cent-Crisp-Details-Very-Minor-Wear
1876-INDIAN-HEAD-1c-VF35-DETAILS-ANACS
1924-D-LINCOLN-1c-AU58-DETAILS-ANACS
1873-INDIAN-HEAD-1c-VF20-DETAILS-ANACS-Open-3
1867-INDIAN-HEAD-1c-F12-DETAILS-ANACS
1859-INDIAN-HEAD-1c-EF45-DETAILS-ANACS
1908-S-Indian-Head-Cent-NGC DETAILS
1928-D-STANDING-LIBERTY-25c-Quarter-PCGS-UNC-DETAILS-DAMAGE
**1877S-Trade-Dollar-NGC-AU58-no-chop-marks
after
check the reverse for a black dot above "we" and an edge hit on the obverse near the rear of the jawline
after
check the black dot near the denticles on the obverse at 11:30
after
Before
After
Note the hits on the cheek, and the line between/above the "1" and "9" of 1928.
after
obverse hit on staff holding cap across the wrist and into the field right of wrist
<< <i>
<< <i>Unfortunate subtitle that he put on the Isabella he cracked out of a PCGS details holder, “STUNNING TONED SOLID GEM BU++ ISABELLA QUARTER WITH PERFECT DETAIL! NO PROBLEMS!” >>
If it's the same coin he bought it for well over $300 and sold for around $200, not exactly a winning business plan.
In your short time here you still can't figure out when a thread has been beaten to death.
This thread would need to double in posts to actually enter that territory.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
<< <i>Anyway which way, he is a thief. He may be a petty thief, but a thief nonetheless. He's also a dumb thief in that he isn't even smart enough to buy under a different account. >>
So those who discover dumb thief's, what does that say for them??
When I contacted the seller, he played the shocked & surprised card, and offered to buy back the coin at the purchase price. He did not offer to cover any shipping expenses, or grading cost. I decided to keep it.
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Top 10 • FOR SALE
<< <i>I once bought a coin from an eBay seller who guaranteed the coin was "genuine, never been cleaned." Came back from PCGS "genuine: cleaned."
When I contacted the seller, he played the shocked & surprised card, and offered to buy back the coin at the purchase price. He did not offer to cover any shipping expenses, or grading cost. >>
Maybe he really did believe the coin was "genuine, never been cleaned" and actually was shocked and surprised. I mean- it's not like there's any guarantee that PCGS would grade the coin the same with repeated submissions. Offering to buy back the coin long enough after a sale to allow for time to send a coin in for grading certainly doesn't reflect badly on the seller. Covering the shipping expense to do so would be nice, but not offering doesn't make him a bad guy, either. Offering to cover the grading cost? Unless that was part of the sales agreement, you're expecting too much, IMO.
If the coin had come back from PCGS graded higher than what the seller graded it, would you have sent him more money?
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>
<< <i>Anyway which way, he is a thief. He may be a petty thief, but a thief nonetheless. He's also a dumb thief in that he isn't even smart enough to buy under a different account. >>
So those who discover dumb thief's, what does that say for them??
Unfortunately today there are too many of them.JMHO
<< <i>
<< <i>I once bought a coin from an eBay seller who guaranteed the coin was "genuine, never been cleaned." Came back from PCGS "genuine: cleaned."
When I contacted the seller, he played the shocked & surprised card, and offered to buy back the coin at the purchase price. He did not offer to cover any shipping expenses, or grading cost. >>
Maybe he really did believe the coin was "genuine, never been cleaned" and actually was shocked and surprised. I mean- it's not like there's any guarantee that PCGS would grade the coin the same with repeated submissions. Offering to buy back the coin long enough after a sale to allow for time to send a coin in for grading certainly doesn't reflect badly on the seller. Covering the shipping expense to do so would be nice, but not offering doesn't make him a bad guy, either. Offering to cover the grading cost? Unless that was part of the sales agreement, you're expecting too much, IMO >>
This dealer had way more years' experience than myself and had handled tens of thousands of coins, and must have known it was cleaned (and probably cleaned it themselves). I bought based on their word and submitted directly for grading without examining thoroughly myself that was my mistake and a lesson I learned well. Fortunately it was early in my collecting history.
edited to add: In this particular situation I believed (and still believe) the coin was more valuable in the slab than raw. Therefore I viewed their "buy back" offer as them trying to take advantage of me again so they could resell the coin for an even higher price / with the slab premium. Maybe I'm wrong but that's how it looked from my perspective. That's the way I remember it anyway.
Amat Colligendo Focum
Top 10 • FOR SALE