Visited my B&M today to buy a 1870-CC Seated $1 but was taken back big time!

dizzyfoxx · June 22, 2012 1:13PM

A couple months ago, I inquired about a 1870-CC Seated $1 in a PCGS VF35. The quoted price was $2500 and I bought a proof early quarter eagle instead. Today, I was ready to add another nice Seated Dollar to my collection so I return to the coin shop only to be quoted $3,000.00 today.

I respond with, "Wow! a short while ago the asking price was $2500". The response was, "Yeah, but these have increased in value quite a bit".

I don't mind paying up for a coin that I want but when there's a feeling of being taken for a short ride is involved it just leaves a bad taste.

Needless to say I passed on the coveted first year CC Seated Dollar and will wait for one that falls within reason. Besides, although it was acceptable IMO, this VF35 example had sort of a "polished" look to it so passing on it was really not so difficult.

Is it just me, or should coin pricing remain relatively consistent over a short period of time?

mrpotatoheadd · June 22, 2012 1:17PM

<< Is it just me, or should coin pricing remain relatively consistent over a short period of time? >>

Based on what I've read here, it's not just you. But then again, every seller has the right to change his mind about his asking prices.

BTW- if he had told you the current price was $2000, not the $2500 previously quoted, would you have insisted on paying the higher amount?

dizzyfoxx · June 22, 2012 1:22PM

<< 

<< Is it just me, or should coin pricing remain relatively consistent over a short period of time? >>

Based on what I've read here, it's not just you. But then again, every seller has the right to change his mind about his asking prices.

BTW- if he had told you the current price was $2000, not the $2500 previously quoted, would you have insisted on paying the higher amount? >>

Sure, and if you have a bridge available in the heart of the Kansas flatlands, I'm a buyer of that as well.

mrpotatoheadd · June 22, 2012 1:25PM

<< Sure, and if you have a bridge available in the heart of the Kansas flatlands, I'm a buyer of that as well.

>>

So you're for consistent prices when the pricing is in your favor and against it when it's not? Got it!

michiganboy · June 22, 2012 1:30PM

I've seen it before, set your mind on buying something next time you inquirer the price has magically gone up. I would of did the same thing you did, unless it was still a really good deal.

dizzyfoxx · June 22, 2012 1:30PM

<< 

<< Sure, and if you have a bridge available in the heart of the Kansas flatlands, I'm a buyer of that as well.

>>

So you're for consistent prices when the pricing is in your favor and against it when it's not? Got it!

>>

To some extent, of course. (sort of common sense isn't it???). But more to the point, I'm unfortunately against being taken for a ride on a coin that has obviously remained idle, at least over the past few months, and well within the timeframe of my two inquiries.

TomB · June 22, 2012 1:35PM

From your description of the coin, I think you did well to pass on the purchase. However, I find nothing wrong with changing a price on a coin even if that price goes up 20% in a short period of time. The way I look at it is that a price was offered and that as soon as the deal is rejected then the price does not have to stay the same at a later time. Of course, the coin might never sell, but that is the dealers problem.

Coinosaurus · June 22, 2012 1:36PM

Let it sit for six months, then offer the guy $2250

bronco2078 · June 22, 2012 1:40PM

You inquired about the coin once and then later inquired again.

You were the only person that asked about that coin so when you asked again that represented a doubling in demand for that coin.

coindeuce · June 22, 2012 1:44PM

Does the OP really believe that he is the only one interested in this key date coin? What if there have been six or eight other customers sniffing around like a little hungry puppies? The dealer would be stupid not to push the envelope if he thinks that there is enough competition for the food bowl. He may be just trying to weed out the sniffers/ nibblers.

mrpotatoheadd · June 22, 2012 1:47PM

<< But more to the point, I'm unfortunately against being taken for a ride on a coin that has obviously remained idle, at least over the past few months, and well within the timeframe of my two inquiries. >>

How do you know it's "remained idle"?

Bochiman · June 22, 2012 1:48PM

<< Does the OP really believe that he is the only one interested in this key date coin? What if there have been six or eight other customers sniffing around like a little hungry puppies? The dealer would be stupid not to push the envelope if he thinks that there is enough competition for the food bowl. He may be just trying to weed out the sniffers/ nibblers. >>

No kidding! Good for that dealer! He gets to keep the coin in his inventory for a couple more months, or longer, rather than sell it

bronco2078 · June 22, 2012 2:00PM

<< 

No kidding! Good for that dealer! He gets to keep the coin in his museum for a couple more months, or longer, rather than sell it

>>

Fixed that for you

coindeuce · June 22, 2012 2:08PM

<< 

<< Does the OP really believe that he is the only one interested in this key date coin? What if there have been six or eight other customers sniffing around like a little hungry puppies? The dealer would be stupid not to push the envelope if he thinks that there is enough competition for the food bowl. He may be just trying to weed out the sniffers/ nibblers. >>

No kidding! Good for that dealer! He gets to keep the coin in his inventory for a couple more months, or longer, rather than sell it

>>

In gaming at a casino, the house always has a distinct advantage.

coindeuce · June 22, 2012 2:13PM

Then there is always the possibility that the "early proof quarter eagle" you bought from this dealer was on someone elses radar, and the dealer realized after you walked away with it that he could have sold it for $500 more than what you paid for it, so he wants you to make him whole now on the Seated Dollar. It may be time for you to seek out a different source for your collection.

MrEureka · June 22, 2012 2:20PM

There are many ways this could have happened, some of which may not even be obvious to DF. The most likely scenario is that the shop owner simply forgot what he quoted the first time and casually made up a different price this time.

Regardless, it seems like the type of situation where a tactful counteroffer at 2500 might still work.

mrpotatoheadd · June 22, 2012 2:25PM

<< The most likely scenario is that the shop owner simply forgot what he quoted the first time and casually made up a different price this time. >>

That's way too simple an explanation and has the added detriment of not allowing for deviousness on the part of the seller. It'll never fly here.

dizzyfoxx · June 22, 2012 3:12PM

<< 

<< Does the OP really believe that he is the only one interested in this key date coin? What if there have been six or eight other customers sniffing around like a little hungry puppies? The dealer would be stupid not to push the envelope if he thinks that there is enough competition for the food bowl. He may be just trying to weed out the sniffers/ nibblers. >>

No kidding! Good for that dealer! He gets to keep the coin in his inventory for a couple more months, or longer, rather than sell it

>>

I guess you can call it "in inventory" but for this particular dealer inventory in this case means tucked away in the back and out of sight from anyone to ever see it. I happen to be one of the few patrons that actually requests to see specific slabbed coins and this happened to be one of them that I inquired about. I've been frequenting this shop regularly for years and I wouldn't be surprised if the last person to view this particular CC dollar in-hand was me some months ago. In any event, I might go back sometime and inquire about it again but I will likely go with Coinosaurus's recommendation and "Let it sit for six months, then offer the guy $2250".

mrpotatoheadd · June 22, 2012 3:26PM

<< I guess you can call it "in inventory" but for this particular dealer inventory in this case means tucked away in the back and out of sight from anyone to ever see it. >>

I notice he's not the one here complaining about not being able to sell stuff from his "inventory". Maybe you and Realone can get together over a beer or two for some mutual moral support?

mrpotatoheadd · June 22, 2012 3:47PM

<< I woul dbe pissed off too! >>

Yeah- it's the dealer's fault you didn't buy the coin when it was first offered to you.

<< Too bad you didn't get it in writing, assuming that would make a difference with this dealer. >>

Yeah- because you're upset you blew your chance at the lower price, you have to figure a way to make the dealer the bad guy. No better way than assuming (without any evidence, of course) he wouldn't honor a written offer.

<< We all know the rare coin market has only gotten softer, the price should have stayed the same or gone lower. >>

"Should"? Because *you* think so? I guess it's out of the question to even consider the possibility that other people might have a different opinion?

<< I hate when a dealer smells blood. >>

I hate when I get a splinter in my finger.

TwoSides2aCoin · June 22, 2012 3:51PM

At the end of the day, it's still your B&M, and you can always visit the coin you like.

mrpotatoheadd · June 22, 2012 3:55PM

<< don't mind paying up for a coin that I want but when there's a feeling of being taken for a short ride is involved it just leaves a bad taste.

Besides, although it was acceptable IMO, this VF35 example had sort of a "polished" look to it so passing on it was really not so difficult. >>

In other words, you're unhappy about not being able to buy a coin you wanted, but don't really like? I hate it when that happens.

Bayard1908 · June 22, 2012 4:06PM

The early proof quarter eagle sounds much more intriguing than the seated dollar. I'd be interested in hearing more about it.

BryceM · June 22, 2012 4:15PM

I was going to say something that would have been quite negative. Suffice it to say that the person who can keep his emotions off the table will be at a distinct advantage in sales negotiations.

lcoopie · June 22, 2012 8:54PM

I am guessing that there was no price tag on the coin.

PerryHall · June 22, 2012 8:58PM

<< 

<< Is it just me, or should coin pricing remain relatively consistent over a short period of time? >>

Based on what I've read here, it's not just you. But then again, every seller has the right to change his mind about his asking prices.

BTW- if he had told you the current price was $2000, not the $2500 previously quoted, would you have insisted on paying the higher amount? >>

No. If he dropped his price it means he couldn't sell it at his old price and it was becoming stale inventory. The market for coins can change and if the this week's CDN gray sheets show a big jump in price, the dealer has every right to increase his price. In fact he'd be crazy not to.

EVillageProwler · June 22, 2012 9:00PM

Btw, don't let the polished appearance of the coin necessarily bother anyone. The 70-CC is supposed to be very PL. A circulated piece, therefore, ought to look like a circulated proof.

Of course, it is also possible that this coin had been lightly messed with too (not having seen it in-hand myself)...

EVP

Walkerguy21D · June 22, 2012 10:45PM

<< The market for coins can change and if the this week's CDN gray sheets show a big jump in price, the dealer has every right to increase his price. In fact he'd be crazy not to. >>

If that is the case, then I certainly agree. Or if he did some research of auction records in the interim and found that he had priced the coin too low to begin with. I've had several instances where I was preparing to buy a coin, the dealer checked Greysheet or whatever, and indicated he would sell it for the current marked price, but if I passed, he was marking it up. Some I bought, some I passed, and saw the dealer immediately reholder/reprice the coin.
Now if he was flat out jumping the price up that much to wring extra $$ from the OP, a long time loyal customer, then I would feel dis'd as well!

WTCG · June 22, 2012 10:48PM

Coin prices can change significantly in a short time period. The coins that do are mostly the ones that trend depending on spot prices or by surges in demand. When a telemarketer needs 8000 of one coin prices can shoot up fast. When 8000 show up at a show unexpectedly prices can take a staggering dive. Both scenarios have happened this year. Coins like CC Trade dollars don't often see sharp price changes.

Until a coin is invoiced and confirmed sold, prices are not set and can change. Sitting on the fence can sometimes bite.

Zrider · June 22, 2012 10:55PM

Dealer to employee: You know that dizzy guy came in looking at the 1870 CC again....

,,,,,,,

jdimmick · June 22, 2012 11:02PM

Price was 2500, you passed, new price is 3k. No offense to the potential buyer, nor to the seller, it is what it is. Seller has no obligation to offer at 2500 again if he feels that 3k is the current price. No reason to be pizzed at the seller. Remember you had the chance to buy at 2500. (Now again , the seller may regret he didnt lower to guarantee a sale, but that his business)

People come in all the time, Ill quote a price today, some will pass , then come back a week or two later and it will either be gone, or price is no longer the same. Some get upset. I politely say, should have picked up earlier.

IrishMikey · June 22, 2012 11:53PM

My only question about this dealer is the way he is treating a repeat customer. If a collector previously
purchased a Proof gold coin from me, then came back with the intent to purchase a better date Seated $,
I would be very interested in cultivating him as a long-term client. It does not appear that this happened.

Other than that, I find nothing wrong with prices changing. If the coin is a good deal at $2400, and the
asking price is $3000, chances are that the $2400 offer will be turned down, but there is no harm in making
the offer. On those few occasions where a dealer has been offended or insulted by an offer I made to them,
and spent a few minutes letting me know about it, I have had no problems just moving on. I have yet to
meet a dealer that was irreplaceable.

You might also consider having another local dealer or collector making him an offer on the coin, with the idea
that you would become the owner if the price was right.

phnatacc · June 23, 2012 12:12AM

Dear sirs,

This post is to inform you of this threads entry into the 2012 Criminally Inane Internet Thread Tournament (CIITT).

We wish you all the best, and good luck!

CIITT Staff
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RYK · June 23, 2012 12:14AM

I probably would have been surprised by the change in price. Of the dealers whose websites I visit, I have never seen a dealer mark up the price of a coin in inventory over time. If anything, they generally find ways to discount it if they have not sold it in a while. Storefronts may operate differently, or maybe this dealer works differently.

Also, Andy's explanation may be the best: the dealer did not remember the price quoted, so when it was quoted the second time, he was not anchored to the previous price, and perhaps there are data points that justify his selling price. Maybe it was misprinted or misquoted in the first place. I have not done the research myself.

What I would have done, and you still can do it if you want the coin, is politely offer the $2500 and offer your phone number or email address to contact you if he changes his mind. Given the fact that the coin has stayed in his inventory for several months and that he has overhead to pay whether or not he sells the coin, I think that there is a better than even chance that you will get the coin at the previous price.

UNCOnly · June 23, 2012 12:15AM

<< A couple months ago, I inquired about a 1870-CC Seated $1 in a PCGS VF35. The quoted price was $2500 and I bought a proof early quarter eagle instead. Today, I was ready to add another nice Seated Dollar to my collection so I return to the coin shop only to be quoted $3,000.00 today.

I respond with, "Wow! a short while ago the asking price was $2500". The response was, "Yeah, but these have increased in value quite a bit".

I don't mind paying up for a coin that I want but when there's a feeling of being taken for a short ride is involved it just leaves a bad taste.

Needless to say I passed on the coveted first year CC Seated Dollar and will wait for one that falls within reason. Besides, although it was acceptable IMO, this VF35 example had sort of a "polished" look to it so passing on it was really not so difficult.

Is it just me, or should coin pricing remain relatively consistent over a short period of time? >>

Why not offer him what he had be willing to accept a short ago for the coin?

The worse he can do is say no.

Cougar1978 · June 23, 2012 12:45AM

If you did not take the original deal at that time its your back at square 1. One needs to be decisive on coin deals or else it may slip away. The dealer owes you nothing, especially after a couple of months lol. That prices change with market conditions or dealer cash flow needs is part of the game.

The coin appears to be around a $3500 coin, his current price is well below that. What people want for coins can change with their cash flow needs. Perhaps he is feeling a little richer now or else realized he was giving it away at $2500. Another possibility he has another buyer in the bull pen at $3000. I am a little surprised he would walk away from a $2500 sale / cash flow (big ticket coin) if you were a buyer assuming he was in a decent profit position on it. I wonder what he would have did if you put cash money on the counter and said "Well I would be a buyer right now at $2500." The way to handle a seller sometimes is simply lay your money on the table and make your offer. I had a wishy washy seller at a show on some slabs I wanted at 20% behind bid - $600. He wanted $680. I layed $600 on the table (crisp gem new $100 bills) and said "here's $600 cash money for your coins and I can't promise I will have it later because I am considering another deal." He took the deal. Show em the money.

At a show if someone passes on a coin, I owe them nothing but will hold to the original quote if they come back during the show. Beyond that prices can change based on current market conditions / cash flow position.

Visited my B&M today to buy a 1870-CC Seated $1 but was taken back big time!

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Visited my B&amp;M today to buy a 1870-CC Seated $1 but was taken back big time!

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Visited my B&M today to buy a 1870-CC Seated $1 but was taken back big time!